The Hypocrisy of Gun Control Advocates, page 13

Originally posted by jimmiec
reply to post by Loki420th

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The incident was a breakin in the middle of the night. The owner had a gun but it misfired. It was 2 drug addidcts (meth) that killed him. Drugs are a problem here. One very bad incident happened to an 80 year old couple. They had no weapon. They were in bed when 2 men broke into their home. Ransacked it and raped his wife while he was forced to watch. I'm sorry but there are evil people in the world and it is wise to have some means of protecting your family. If you can magically make the bad people disapear please do.

Sad story. Drugs can often do more damage to society than guns. don't get me wrong but that gun could've killed all of em, wouldn't be a solution. Those drug addicts are just sick, they need help no punishment actualy. Don't know why you have such a big drug problem but I heard the gun lobby is tied to the drug cartel. I think it would be a good start to make some permissions someone has to achive if he wants a gun. At best a half year to a year course for gun control, where someone is being tested if there is a risk to psyche out for him. where he is taught safer gun use, appropriate stowage(ammunition in a different safe than the guns), how to hunt, hunting permission, yearly check up if guns are stowed right and if the owner is capable of using em properly.

reply to post by Kram09

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The right to bear arms? Why - for what reason?
For sport, hunting, self defense, and because it is our 2nd amendment right. It is part of the American culture like it or not just a fact.

Serious question. If you say freedom, then take a look around - because that freedom's being eroded, icrementally and insidiously.
If freedom has eroded as you say then it will only be an armed people who can fix that. This too is why we are armed...read up on Thomas Jefferson and see his opinion of this.

Yet you all still cling to your guns like frightened children. The mentality of the Americans was shown after the shooting earlier this year in Denver...the sale of guns and ammunition shot up (no pun intended)!
Here we go name calling; that is a standard pratice of "Libtards" History has showed your relsolve when it comes to frightened children! Winston Churchill even questioned why his people cowarded in the subway systems and would not emerge while the Germans came out each morning and cleared the streets of debris. Gun and ammo sales went up for a very simple reason; because people think that a "NEW" law will prevent that. It is that simple no deep dark secret.

Guns aren't tools, they are weapons and are designed to kill.
Guns are tool's there purpose is to kill as you say. A hammer is designed to drive a nail, a radio to play music, ect.....So you point out the obvious?? What is your point should we design different??? They would not sell very well!

How much more innocent blood are gun advocates willing to have shed, just so they can still sit back and feel secure with their right to bear arms.
The gun advocated have shed no blood! A nut job shed the blood don't paint everyone with the same brush...Again another "Libtard" main stay! Bad people do bad things period! It is society not the guns!

I'm not suggesting that right be taken away, but stricter gun laws are needed.
I agree with you on this point! Some people should never own a gun period!

There needs to be a serious inquiry by the government into why these gun masssacres are now becoming a tragic staple of American society and there needs to be a deep look at gun culture in the United States.
Our goverment is broke and useless; they can't even balance a checkbook much less do anything meaningful. They would only take rights away from the "Good" people and protect the "Bad"!!

We can have more "search for answers" bla bla bla, just like after the shootings in Denever and all that came before, but unless some serious action is taken, nothing will change and in several months time the same will happen again
There are no anwsers!!! he took that to the grave! No the so called professional's will tell us why it happened for the next 3 months on every talk show on TV' when the fact is they are clueless idiots!!! Unless a note was left we will never know why this sicko did what he did!

Originally posted by SeenMyShare
reply to post by detachedindividual

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Please, by all means, keep your children in the country from which you hale!

Many of you anti gun proponents in countries NOT USA have no clue how rural some of us live. We don't keep guns for protection from human intruders. We keep guns for protection for our livestock from animal predators. We keep guns to put food on the table. We keep guns to euthanize livestock that might be suffering from accidents, old age, etc.

And, as far as protection goes, if I did need protection from human intruders ... I live 26 miles (41 kilometers) from the sheriff's department and 32 miles (51.5 kilometers) from the State Police barracks. Gee, I wonder how long it would take them to get here?

edit on 15/12/2012 by SeenMyShare because: (no reason given)

edit on 15/12/2012 by SeenMyShare because: fixed my metric conversion

Regardless of whether I am in the USA or not, I will comment on anything I wish to discuss and no American can tell me not to.

In addition, farmers in the UK are permitted firearms for the very same reasons you outline. I fail to see how an automatic rifle helps any farmer. You need to put down a sick horse, are you really going to pump 300 bullets into it? How many people in NYC have to defend themselves against wolves and bears? How many people in any area of the US actually can justify owning a weapon for this reason, and an automatic weapon at that?

As for protecting yourself from intruders, why do all Americans think that they are all moments away from being robbed, raped, or murdered in their beds? It's like you all walk around under this delusional threatening cloud with the belief that someone is ready to attack you at any moment.

You're all just looking for any excuse you can find to own that poxy gun, from making up scenarios where you might be attacked by a bear, to scenarios where everyone is out to kill you.

I see the propaganda of the gun salesmen is working really well on you guys. You're all convinced you NEED a weapon of war just to exist.

reply to post by MagicWand67

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Because knives have other uses, guns do not.

Also it is much harder to fatally attack someone with a knife than it is with a gun.

May I throw out a chart? Let me see if I can finally put an image into a post. If not, can someone else be kind enough to get the chart visible in the post? Thanks.




upload.wikimedia.org...

en.wikipedia.org...

Take notice of the lowest line on the chart. It happens to be death by firearm except for in the teenage years where of course it is probably greater than death by, say, heart failure for obvious reasons. Now tell me how Firearms aren't just a political agenda?

Originally posted by zayonara
May I throw out a chart? Let me see if I can finally put an image into a post. If not, can someone else be kind enough to get the chart visible in the post? Thanks.




upload.wikimedia.org...

en.wikipedia.org...

Take notice of the lowest line on the chart. It happens to be death by firearm except for in the teenage years where of course it is probably greater than death by, say, heart failure for obvious reasons. Now tell me how Firearms aren't just a political agenda?

edit on 16-12-2012 by zayonara because: (no reason given)

Do you know the difference between natural diseases and preventable violent crime?

I have a heart problem, thankfully it was picked up and I can act accordingly. I can change my diet and lifestyle. I have some control over it.

I do not have control over someone ending my life with a bullet. And it is more preventable than cancer, HIV/AIDS, Coronary disease, diabetes, and any other natural disease or condition out there.

You could clean up gun violence tomorrow if you had the will, the same cannot be said about cancer, HIV or anything else on those lists.

That's the difference, and a child could point that out.

reply to post by LPOPranger

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How do you keep guns out of the hands of criminals? We had Prohibition here and more people drank then than when it was legal. It also created the Mafia which we still have today. Guns can be smuggled in and sold to criminals for huge profits, effectively creating more Mafia style organizations. The problem is not as simple as you make it sound. Machine shops can make guns quite easily and there are several machine shops in every town in America. Our open borders make it easy to smuggle guns in. The illegals can commit crimes without being tried for their crime, they simply deport them and they come back under a different name. Banning guns is full of unintended consequences. I personally do not own a gun, but then pretty much everyone around me does and i have never felt uneasy knowing it. Where i am guns are considered tools for hunting and self defense. They fill their freezers with deer meat every year to feed their families and keep Americas heritage alive. If the flow of electricity ever stops you will not be buying prepackaged meat at the store. You will have to go kill it,skin it,butcher it to eat.

reply to post by MagicWand67

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reply to post by detachedindividual

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Given enough push, even death by disease or physical ailment may be, offset, minimized, curbed, or even eliminated long enough to die of other causes. You are living proof. You don't see many politicians jumping on the "find a cure" bandwagon do you? No, they jump at "guns" because it makes a taller soapbox. My point.

reply to post by detachedindividual

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Yes, that Laza woman had guns for protection, and look how that turned out.

What about the other 311 million + people who did not harm anyone??? One person did this not an entire country; you use no logic.

As for protection from government... when is that actually going to happen? These people claim that it's about stopping an authoritarian government, but they let the Patriot Act slide through with no argument, they let their phones, emails and search be tracked and traced, they're watched through CCTV every day... so when does the crunch point come?

It doesn't, and these people know it.

When is it going to happen?? What a moronic question!! Even if someone had plans; i am sure they would tell you on a site like this! LOL!! It will happen when it happens or maybe never...when my crystal ball arrives i'll be sure you the first to know. The patriot act was passed because of 9-11; you rember that? When America was attacked and over 3000 people died??? That is how it was passed. We do not have all the CCTV like you do get you facts straight; this is a vast country not an island.

Even if it did, the armed American people stand no chance at all against the US military. If the American people tried to start a revolution tomorrow, those guns in public hands would be meaningless. They would need defections from the military to do it, or support from another nation like Russia or China. There is absolutely NO WAY ON THIS EARTH that the armed American people would be capable of overthrowing their government just using their guns.

The US Military are Americans!!! Do you really think they would kill there own because of an unlawful order?? You don't know Americans very well!! It's called a coup!! It is unlawful and treason to use the military againist it's citizens!!

And even if this delusion persists, why not Militias? Why do you need a weapon in your home in case of a revolution? The militias would be at the forefront of anything like that, so why can there not be a compromise where weapons are handled and kept by authorised militia groups instead of in the home?

Militias are everyday people they is no offical standing "Militias" we have the National Guard that awnsers to the Governors of each state. You really need to stop watching so much TV!

I have a feeling that even if it were proposed that all guns be kept under the control of militia groups, stored and used on authorised sites, away from large populations, most pro-gun people would STILL stamp their feet like spoiled brats.

Again, there are no Militias....the armed people of the USA are the Militia!!! It is SEPERATE from goverment..can you understand????? Why would you put arms under control of the very system that they are supposed to protect you from??

IMO that's the perfect compromise. You can still get your boner shooting a weapon at something, you can still appreciate them, and you still have them on hand "just in case" someone decides that a revolution is needed (maybe one day American Idol will be off the air and you'll have nothing to occupy your brains).

IMO....well that's worth about nothing!!!! The Brits started American Idol! You don't have a brain to occupy! Everytime I think America is a lost cause; I read what someone like you has wrote and feel like maybe there is still hope because there are much worse and dumber places in the world!

I have a feeling the NRA and the profiteers of violence will not like that one little bit

Does not even merit a comment it is so out there!!

reply to post by spangledbanner

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Have you ever heard of Switzerland? 'Europe' is a geographic entity, not a political one, despite the wishes of some power mongers, so there is a lot of variation.Besides, I would not trust the UK & Australian statistics, because they have a vested interest to forge them after their weapons bans to retroactively justify their legislation, which most certainly isn't based on crime related considerations, otherwise some sort of probation period would have been be applied.

Of course, the pertinent question is what the real motives of the gun grabbers really are, swimming pools kill vastly more children every year than spree killers, no drive to ban those, is there?

reply to post by Long Lance

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Swimming pools are designed and used exclusively for leisurely swimming. Guns are designed and used exclusively to kill things. Does that answer your question?

reply to post by buckrogerstime

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A: No it does not. Self defense against lethal threats may include lethal force, so weapons use is legitimate under very clear circumstances, which of course only helps if you have one. So there IS a positive effect from firearms possession, you just contend it is outweighed by the negative. just read the following article to see why that's important, sometimes. The argument cuts both ways, too since why would you risk children's life for leisure but not to preserve your means to literally survive a confrontation?

beforeitsnews.com...

The bottom line is that gun bans are yet another form of prohibition especially in countries with high rates of weapons owners (legal and illegal) and completely impractical. What do you really expect to accomplish and what would you ban exactly?


PS: why did the media outlets refuse to mention the tidbit of the CCW owner stopping a killing spree early? How many people should we consider saved in that incident alone? Why is selective perception such a recurring theme among gungra.. err control advocates.

===============================================================================

Originally posted by exponent

Originally posted by MagicWand67
My rant is more directed at the people who want to ban guns all together.

And those that think that guns are to blame when some nut job goes on a killing spree.

This guy could have used a knife and bat and still caused as much mayhem.

Could you list some comparable killing sprees carried out with a knife or a bat? You seem to be pretty convinced this is possible.

you wish is my command:

edition.cnn.com...

now the worst a killer could do would be to lock all doors with padlock and chain (probably while wearing a construction worker's outfit) then set fire to the place - you'd kill a high percentage of the attendees that way because windows will be locked by default and the escape routs you've just blocked.

count yourselves lucky that most killers seem to be obsessing over firearms.

reply to post by Long Lance

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Interesting that my son yesterday point out that the media is so bias and in a highest gear of propaganda against guns, that most people actually knows the name and the face of the elementary and high school killers of recent shooting now and before but nobody can even name a single victim or recognize the face of the columbine massacre shooting and nobody will remember soon who the victims of Conn children were either.

It tells you right there and then how the brainwashing is going on, glorify the killers forget about the victims because drilling the killers into the minds of the public will breed more sleeping cells to come forward and follow sue.

reply to post by Long Lance

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The thing is even if guns are used "legitimately" or illegitimately, they're still being used to kill things or threaten to kill things. When swimming pools (or alcohol, for that matter) are used "legitimately," people have a fun time on vacation. Perhaps this clarifies why there is more uproar about gun control than swimming-pool control.

You make a good point about how there are many other methods to go on killing sprees beyond guns. You have definitively shown it is possible to kill lots of people without guns. Maybe there are ways to defend one's self without guns as well (especially if insane people and criminals aren't able to purchase them either).

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