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Tom Monaghan sues feds over new health care law

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posted on Dec, 15 2012 @ 02:03 PM
reply to post by rickymouse


To some degree I agree.

Men should pay for condoms. It is not a medicine and no doctor's prescription is needed.

Women should not have to pay for contraception. The pill is a medication and a doctor's prescription is needed to purchase. It should still be free if used for any other medical condition as one of the posters mentioned above, and I mentioned about my daughter and wife.

If the pill were available "over the counter" then the dynamic changes as insurance doesn't cover "over the counter" meds.

Further, I do support religion being separated from the medical aspect of contraceptive medication. One should have nothing to do with the other.


posted on Dec, 15 2012 @ 02:21 PM

Originally posted by Charmeine
reply to" target="_blank" class="postlink">post by DarthMuerte

I'm conflicted about this story. There are many women who need to take birth control to control hormone issues like Polycystic Ovary Syndrome, Endometrosis and so on. But there are some women like me with rare blood disorders, who can NOT take birth control, even though I also have PCOS. While in some cases the use of birth control has helped control these disorders - contraceptives have also been known to cause blood clots and other diseases in women.

Birth control should always be an option - but when it comes medical conditions and if using birth control is a solution to those problems, then yes - a company like Domino's SHOULD provide coverage - because the birth control in many cases are saving lives.
edit on 15-12-2012 by Charmeine because: (no reason given)

I think that one of the issues is the blurring of distinctions between arguments. I would perhaps draw two particular questions out for discussion.

Is contraception/abortion a medical treatment? In my opinion, yes, for a number of reasons that many people have articulated well through the thread.

Should the employer be forced to pay for any or all medical treatment that the employee wants? No, absolutely not. If the employer wants to offer health insurance as part of the employment package then that is up to them - including choosing what is covered. If the employer wants to exclude treatment for broken legs then, as meanspirited as it may be, that is up to them. Like any other part of the package - salary, hours, bonuses, benefits, etc - it's about something the employer is willing to offer to induce you to work there, not something you have a deity-given right to demand. If the employee wants more coverage than the employer is willing to offer, then the employee should find a different policy that suits their purposes and pay for it themselves, or find a different employer who does offer a suitable package.

My objection is to people being offered a slice of the birthday boy's cake and then throwing a hissy fit that he didn't give them the biggest piece with the nicest bit of icing. It's his cake, for crying out loud, he doesn't need to share it with you in the first place. Obamacare is like holding a gun to the birthday boy's head and this thread is like the gunman feeling surprised when he screams "robbery!".

If you're busy raping a guy (which is what Obamacare is effectively doing on a corporate scale) don't be surprised when he tries to resist.

posted on Dec, 15 2012 @ 02:21 PM
reply to post by EyesII

The problem with adding all this stuff to insurance is that it brings up the costs so much. My wife's insurance costs her employer about fifteen grand a year, which we now have to pay 20 percent of and then there is the deductible. She only makes about thirty three grand a year working there, look at the ratio. We have to do something about these rising insurance costs, no employer was going to be able to supply healthcare in the future if something wasn't done. I think we need to go to socialized healthcare myself and bring the real jobs back to America. There is nothing wrong with working in a factory. We don't need to create more and more healthcare jobs to keep the economy going.

posted on Dec, 15 2012 @ 03:16 PM
reply to post by rickymouse


That's close to what I am paying.

The biggest problem is 18% to 22% increases every year - year after year after year.

Since there aren't many alternatives such as insurance carriers that offer adequate plans, we are 100% at the mercy of these criminal insurance companies. There needs to be more competition with more players, but with medical expenses rising at alarming rates, I can see why the cost of insurance continues to rise unreasonably. Still we need more players, more competition, not less players.

In NY, Blue Cross/Blue Shield no longer offers health insurance policies to company’s with less than 50 employee’s. (How dare they pick and choose what company sizes they will insure. That should be illegal.) That combined with ludicrous increases from the remaining player’s makes insurance very unaffordable. But what choice do we have?

Where is the competition factor that would keep increases in check? It does not exist!

Obama wants to make it so every company is required to have health insurance for their full time workers. How can a small business support health insurance costs that are approaching the cost of one's salary? What happens when it surpasses the cost of payroll???

I don’t like any of this, but again, what choice is there?? We need insurance!

Insurance companies just don't care. It’s basically take it or leave it! The insurance companies have become like the mafia. It's becomes an offer that we can't refuse - ever.

On topic: I still think that contraception should be offered and paid for by the insurance companies. That sentiment does not change.


posted on Dec, 15 2012 @ 05:00 PM
reply to post by EvillerBob

It's a tough call either way. There are women who need contraceptives to survive their chronic conditions...and others who should be using birth control but don't. I think it would be a nice perk/incentive to attract female employees if Dominos offered it to their staff. However, I guess I'm surprised Dominos even HAS benefits to offer. Who knew.

posted on Dec, 16 2012 @ 10:04 AM

Originally posted by EvillerBob

Originally posted by VictorVonDoom

Originally posted by tgidkp
(p.s. the WHOLE idea here is that healthcare is decided by DOCTORS, not religious whacks.)

It would be nice if healthcare was decided by doctors instead of insurance companies. I'm sure a lot of people here can offer stories of medical proceedures that doctors felt were necessary but insurance companies refused to pay for.

The insurance companies didn't say they couldn't have the procedures. The insurance company just won't pay for them. The employer is paying the insurance company and it is for the company to say what they will pay for, not you. If you do not like that, organise your own insurance that provides the coverage you want.

It's like a kid demanding pocket-money from the parent and then complaining that the parent doesn't want them to spend it on hookers and blow

Edited to add: While I'm saying "you", I mean this in the general sense, not specifically you, VictorVonDoom.

edit on 15-12-2012 by EvillerBob because: (no reason given)

No offense taken. I was just trying to illustrate the difference between health care and Obamacare. Just because someone is forced to pay for insurance doesn't mean they will get the medical care they will need. Just as they do today, insurance companies will do everything they can legally get away with to maximize their profits.

posted on Dec, 16 2012 @ 11:56 PM

Originally posted by kaylaluv

Originally posted by OccamsRazor04

Originally posted by pillock
reply to post by OccamsRazor04

If you eat Domino's Pizza contraception should be mandatory .
It would help Darwin skim out the gene pool

While I can not say the idea is not appealing, it is unfortunately not Constitutional to force them to do so

Nor is it Constitutional to force Domino's to pay for elective healthcare needs. If someone requires birth control for a medically necessary reason then Domino's needs to cough up, as then it is no longer about contraception, and about hormonal imbalances most likely.

What's to stop a doctor from stating that his patient's birth control (or abortion) is for a medically necessary reason, just so that insurance will cover it? I could see a doctor doing that out of loyalty to their patient, and if they are pro-choice. What's Tom going to do then? Will he try and force his employees to use only his own team of doctors??

It's insurance fraud. That is what stops them. Audits can be done. Regardless, all you have done is conceded my point saying that is the way to go.

posted on Dec, 16 2012 @ 11:57 PM

Originally posted by EyesII
Isn't birth control also used to regulate/control an adolescent’s hormones?

My teenage daughter takes it everyday as a way of controlling her hormones - which affects a person’s temperament.

No pill - she is out of control - a real B!!!

With pill - she is normal again.

My wife also had to take it for many years as it had something to do with lessening the frequency and/or severity of migraine headaches.

I don't want any Dominoes people telling us what we can take or not take as medication. That is the doctors job.


That has already been addressed, maybe you should read the posts.

posted on Dec, 17 2012 @ 12:00 AM

Originally posted by sputniksteve
reply to post by EyesII

That is just what your wife told you because she doesn't want to be a grandma! Truth is your daughter is always a B, just to different degrees. I am only kidding, I have a 14 yo girl so I can joke.

Seems a lot of arguing over religion when this is about the constitution. Occams is right, whether you agree or disagree with his religious stance. If you aren't from the US and don't know what a constitution is you are wasting your time here.

Personally I think Tom must be an idiot for believing in God, but I agree that Obamacare should be challenged.

Exactly, this is not about my beliefs, or yours, or anyone else's. This is about the Constitution and the right guaranteed by it.

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