Why join the military? Your thoughts?

So, we can always hear from recruiters as to why join up for the armed services (of any nation really). But I think it would be nice to put some thoughts forward from people themselves the pros and cons.

Whats your thoughts? Why would you suggest to join (or not join) your armed services?

______
For me, I look at some of the more basic aspects
First off, the military has some of the coolest call signs like, ever..especially if you make it to specops (night stalkers...really? how epic would it be to say you were a NS).
I am an algorithm lover, and the military has no short supply of that..ok, linguistics aside:
There appears to be a sort of brotherhood (not sexist, just a good word for it) between military folks that trancends civilian understanding..I guess it would be a legit gang..if the crips were a honorable group to join sort of thing.
Even interdepartmentally..although there is a lot of ribbing going on there, but always good natured.

some cons would be following a order you disagreed with...you still have to do it, but I suspect you lose a bit of yourself everytime you know you do something wrong just because it was a order.
Although I imagine I could kill someone whom was trying to kill me or my friends, there is the initial reservation of ending a life..someone who had hopes, dreams, humor, talent, etc...

I am a civilian looking into the world...how about some actually enlisted folks explain to us what they see as pros and cons based on their experience

All I can say is don't join the wrong team. Our government is corrupt as #. Fight for your family. Not the global leaders.

I joined because I had very little direction in life. I knew that the military would give me some direction to go for a few years and it may be fun. I joined the USAF. I guess I wasn't the dumbass I thought I was as I scored good on the asvab. I went into avionics and learned how to work on Electronic systems on C-130's and other aircraft. All the training seemed very specialized until you look back and see the big picture.

I learned how to be responsible. (more so than I was) I learned how to learn. (the most useful thing ever) And I learned how to deal with adversity better. I found that I don't like leaving my family more than a few days. I made some lifelong friends. I got to see parts of the world that most will only see in pictures. (some parts were not very desirable, AKA desert)

For me, it was a very positive experience and now as an adult, I can appreciate the sacrifice part much more. I was just a kid, and didn't think much of it at the time, but to see young men and women sacrificing their time and being away from their families especially this time of year, makes me proud to have been a part of it all and even prouder of the ones doing it today. From pencil pusher to sniper, they are all heroes in my book.

Originally posted by wrksstudios
All I can say is don't join the wrong team. Our government is corrupt as #. Fight for your family. Not the global leaders.

I am not even concerned much about what fight is going on..more of a boots on the ground view of their experience and view.
No matter what war or conflict is going on, there is two sides to the story, and if you get stuck forever contemplating which is right, you will quickly be paralized with inaction and doubt.

reply to post by SaturnFX


I have been in the military for 12 years, I left high school three months early to go to boot camp. So I have spent pretty much my entire adult life in the armed forces.

I'll start with the pros first.

-You get to meet a lot of interesting people from all walks of life.
-You get to travel all over the world.
-Three meals a day most of the time.
-Free medical and dental care.
-Lots of really cool training.

Cons

-Seeing your friends die. I have been to 17 funerals in the past 3 years.
-Having people shoot at you.
-Moving a lot. I stopped counting a long time ago, but I had moved 40 some times at that point.
-Doing things that serve no logical purpose, it's just how it's always been done.
-Having to put up with idiots.
-Sleeping in mud up to your waist.

This just what I can come up with off the top of my head.

reply to post by SaturnFX


If I had a choice between a cool call sign and camaraderie VS Keeping my self worth and dignity. I would choose the later. But I don't think it's so black and white.
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I've never been on the forefront of a war. I won't pretend to know how it's like either. But from what I can understand, I think it's from the book Fast Movers, among others, it says in times of war you as a person detaches yourself from reality. It becomes almost like a play. But then again that was the Vietnam era. Maybe soldiers perspectives have changed since then. But it made sense to me. How can a person with kids, a mother, a father, a brother and sister be sent to fight a war they want no part of and kill their fellow humans beings like they were dogs? They have famillies as well. By detaching them selves from who they really are. The problem with that is sometimes what they think they lost for a moment, they, in reality lost for ever. And with the wars we have today, I wonder why anybody would enlist in the armed forces since 90% of the theaters are for profit not peace. Killing the innocent to make a buck. A shameful display of power.


Edit to Add----Just so you know. I'm not blaming the soldiers, I support them actualy. I don't always support the cause and blame the people on top. Soldiers who do what they're supposed to do, I have a utmost respect for. Those that get creative, like that chopper gunner as an example. Deplorable.

Originally posted by network dude
From pencil pusher to sniper, they are all heroes in my book.

hero is a word reserved for..well, heros.
standard military folks don't make my list of heros..specops start to move closer to that title, career military that work in earnest for some esoteric reasons of making their country stronger..closer still...someone whom runs to save his shot up mate from harms way...crazy, but definately entering into the hero catagory..still, who wouldn't at least try?

Bravery is also questionable...many join to get free college and other benefits (medical, dental, etc), bravery is assigned when a person preforms their duties well in the face of danger, and when leaving is an actual option (and they remain).

Not trying to diminish anyone by saying they aren't brave or heroic..just wanting titles like that, which used to be strong titles given to individuals for merits as such and not water it down..else when you do meet an actual brave hero whom did stellar things, you put him in the same catagory as some clerk in kansas whom seen papercuts as his only on the job danger..it diminishes the honorary titles.

Originally posted by watchitburn
-Three meals a day most of the time.

I was informed that mre's are not actually considered food products moreso than eatable building material.

Cons
-Sleeping in mud up to your waist.

People pay good money for mud baths

Your skin must look fantastic


Thanks for the response, and service of course.

Originally posted by XLR8R
Killing the innocent to make a buck. A shameful display of power.

edit on 14-12-2012 by XLR8R because: (no reason given)

I know there is a lot of collateral damage, this is not lost on me..but I do enjoy thinking that during war, both sides do try to minimize that as much as possible.
And if you consider todays wars with precision missile strikes, ariel strikes, etc...verses say WW2's basic dumb bomb carpet bombing methods, the civ casualties percentagewise has decreased dramatically..not eliminated mind you, but decreased for sure.

But ya, one innocent life lost is indeed a sad understanding of the world we live in and the (dark) nature of mankind. I do also believe a lot of our warfare is profit motivated, but there are also some pure ideals pushing some aspects...of course that gets ramped up by those whom stand to profit the most to become almost religious in its effects
(aka, we go help the peeps of iraq due to its monsterous government...but no help for the north korean people?)

But I don't blame the military for any of that...military is a tool used by politicians...a very effective tool.

1. There are clear lines of hierarchy and career advancement as well as opportunity for lateral promotions into different job/task/career paths.
a. Most other careers you start with what you're hired to do and stay there.
2. There are clear terms of contract for length of term in employment.
a. You have to almost try to get fired to lose your job, and so long as you do your job, you have job security without worry of ever being let go due to downsizing.
3. You get pension if you maintain a full career path to retirement.
a. If you start young, you could be retired around the age of 40 compared to other careers where retirement is 65+.
4. You've opportunity to travel all over the planet on the 'company's" dime.
5. If you leave military service with certain skill sets, training and experience, you can earn $100k+ in the private sector.
6. The benefits package, with medical, dental, etc, including educational incentives is fairly decent.
7. Military service can be a gateway into the "cooler" agencies like CIA, though, that's far from a guarantee, and you'd need have a clear plan of action from day 1 to open that door.

Cons:
1. Pay is suck.
2. The job is often suck.
3. The job can kill you, or worse maim you where benefits for injury is extremely low compared to benefits derived from injury in private sector.
4. Job fulfillment may result in capture and torture followed by death, including maiming as an aspect of torture.
5. Job fulfillment is often physically and mentally strenuous.

Protip: You'll get better pay and benefits, plus job perks, as well as career advancement opportunities if you apply to and graduate from officer training (essentially military University) where you start your military career as an officer.
Enlisted service members can only ever go so far in a career path, where officers can go all the way to the top.

Edit: Military Pay scale Chart starting for 2013
Note the differences in Officer pay and Enlisted pay.
Lowest first year Officer pay is higher than highest first year Enlisted pay.
(you probably want to look into Officer school)

Originally posted by SaturnFX
.it diminishes the honorary titles.

Every one of them takes an oath to support and defend the constitution of the United States, and knows that they may have to do so with their lives if necessary. Think what you want, but you don't have to be shot at to be someone's hero.

reply to post by SaturnFX


Just a question and I don't mean any disrespect. Doesn't it piss you off? To sometimes get used for corporate ends? I used to do quite a bit of volunteer work and the amount of homeless veterans we have is....they gave there lives for us and then get thrown out on the street! What the hell is wrong? I would love to understand your dedication but I just can't seem to justify it after seeing and hearing stories about all the sh!t you people go through. But like I said before, I do support our troops, I know it might not mean much but what ever reason you have to go marching in there, you have my respect.

reply to post by Druscilla


If you read the other posts I wrote here you will see I respect soldiers so don't take this the wrong way. I noticed that you and watchitburn. Didn't write in "killing others" as a con. Is this because it goes with our saying?

I apologize if this sound ignorant, I'm just trying to understand a little better.

Originally posted by XLR8R
Didn't write in "killing others" as a con. Is this because it goes with our saying?

I apologize if this sound ignorant, I'm just trying to understand a little better.

edit on 14-12-2012 by XLR8R because: (no reason given)

Some would see that as a pro.

Some would see that as neither (humans are simply animals crowd).

So, that would be a individual viewpoint.
In a all out war, you would want the pro and neutral types. They can get the job done, so I try not to curse them..however, them adjusting to civilian life should be monitored after being in the trenches and used to simply shooting opposition happily...make sure the transition doesn't have hiccups (see McVeigh).

Originally posted by XLR8R
Just a question and I don't mean any disrespect. Doesn't it piss you off?

I am not military..so that question should be directed at others.
I don't think they think on those terms..they aren't fighting to line the pockets of people, they fight to protect their friends, themselves, and hopefully some aspects of their country...stay focused on those points and they tend to do alright.

As far as profit in war...there is always winners and losers in war...since the first time cavemen slung rocks at neighboring caves, there has been some people banking on the outcome...so, no change there. Resource wars are almost always the underlying reasons for war...and it is arguably the purest reason for war also...

in a world of finite resources, it is survival of the fittest..as in our individual dna, its also in societys focus...toss out the god stuff and all that..and you got a very basic understanding of not just our society, or our species..but life as we know it in general..you got stuff, we want it, we will destroy to get it..be it amoeba, or man.

So, ya..until we get a star trek style replicator and material needs are no longer a consideration, then expect no change..will be as it always has been.

Originally posted by XLR8R
reply to post by Druscilla

 

If you read the other posts I wrote here you will see I respect soldiers so don't take this the wrong way. I noticed that you and watchitburn. Didn't write in "killing others" as a con. Is this because it goes with our saying?

I apologize if this sound ignorant, I'm just trying to understand a little better.

edit on 14-12-2012 by XLR8R because: (no reason given)

I don't mention it because not every job in the military, in every branch of military involves killing people.
There are career paths for Doctors, Nurses, Mechanics, Nutrition specialists, Psychologists & Psychiatrists, Communications, Electronics, Internal security (police), Engineering, and many many other career paths.
Army job descriptions
Marine Corps jobs
Air Force jobs
Navy jobs

Those are mostly Enlisted jobs. Officer jobs are certainly attached to those, but, involve differing qualifications.

You don't have to kill, be a killer, or even be in much of a position to get killed to have a job in the military.

One could specialize in supplies logistics for the navy in hustling food and other supplies back and forth to and from ships and naval bases, far away from any hot action.
Someone could pursue a career as a cook, in the Navy, or Air force or any branch.
You could be a code cracker in the cryptographic/linguistic specialization and move on to the CIA as a crypto-analyst.
One could perform secretarial and administrative work their entire career.

One need not be a killer, or ever risk being killed in doing service in any branch of the military.

Sure, there's all sorts of different kinds of "street cred" if someone becomes super soldier ultra black Epsilon force ninja cyborg killing machine or something, but, there's probably way more money in something like air traffic control, or some other specialization in high demand with high pay that can be pursued in the private sector outside of the military.

reply to post by Druscilla


Star for you. Thanks for the response. I'm not a military type person but if super soldier ultra black Epsilon force ninja cyborgs do exist ...I'm signing up

reply to post by SaturnFX


Star for you too. Nice response. I understand that people kill to get others resources and it's been that way for ever. But now, since we're "civilized" we could maybe start to work on a solution. With technology that's been presented to us since the early 1900's, we don't need fossil fuels anymore. Maybe for plastics and what not, but even so. You can get that from hemp seed oil, sunflower oil and so many more. As for food well, most developed countries waste enough food to feed the rest of the world; until we can come together and fix the problems we all know we have but do nothing about,...well, the amoeba will reign supreme I guess.

Originally posted by XLR8R
reply to post by SaturnFX

 

Star for you too.

Nice response. I understand that people kill to get others resources and it's been that way for ever. But now, since we're "civilized" we could maybe start to work on a solution. With technology that's been presented to us since the early 1900's, we don't need fossil fuels anymore. Maybe for plastics and what not, but even so. You can get that from hemp seed oil, sunflower oil and so many more. As for food well, most developed countries waste enough food to feed the rest of the world; until we can come together and fix the problems we all know we have but do nothing about,...well, the amoeba will reign supreme I guess.

That of course is the issue, isn't it.
The ticks that feed off the blood of society don't want change..they are making a ton with the status quo, and will ensure that nothing changes too dramatically.
This is the truely frustrating part of it all. Not to say things don't change, but its at such a slow rate to satiate the greedy that living through the times of change feels like complete stagnation.

I don't know if there is a solution for it..

If a star trek style replicator did come out, if it wasn't instantly banned or hidden from the public, then a simple "replication" would be taxed and controlled to where its still basically just a rich nation toy verses a world changing event.

Yes, as people that claim civil society, it is time we change the game to employ the latest tech and move away from resource through conquest...now its just a matter of removing the parasitic uncivilized people on top that lock or stagnate progress.

And the question is..how would we do that..

got no answers there..but I think the internet may hold a key...so, the only important thing is to keep it up and unfiltered...information is ultimately the strongest weapon.