Christians are great

reply to post by NewAgeMan

they hold in contempt that which they've never really investigated fully with an open mind and heart.

No other religion has seen more brutality and contempt thru history, than Christianity
And that contempt is just unfounded hate. Where does the hate come from most common ? Fear.
People who have certain lifestyles fear Christianity because it is the hard hitting truth.
It's the truth that people first fear and then move on to hate, then scorn, laugh, mock and claim the Bible is
just an old book of fairy tales.

Why would anyone ruled by their chosen life style want anything to do with God ? They may have to change something about the way they live. Easier just to write him off.

And the beat goes on.

.

reply to post by randyvs


randyvs, as much as I usually agree with you wholeheartedly I must say that I don't think that Christianity is about a morality of should and shouldn't, nor that even the Christian must TRY to be a good person in order not to be a bad person or not not to not be bad if you know what I mean. That type of Christianity isn't from Jesus imho, but from a subtle twist whose ultimate aim it is to separate us from the great TRUTH at the heart of it all, which to receive, to take in and "grok" is to simply want to be better, not because of any sort of right and wrong but because it's the only thing that makes us happy, to play within the field God has given us, which is an expansive domain of freedom and liberation, not to sin, but to enjoy in the best possible way the best that life has to offer, to the full and then to overflowing (and not I'm not talking about a wineglass). To get it, to really get it, and accept what's being offered leads to a very speedy repentance that is quickly met with an overwhelming joy and in completing that circle of joy WITH Jesus (in spirit), his joy is also completed, and this is our great work - to understand what he was about and receive him more and more where the will not to sin never really enters into the equation, simply because it doesn't make any sense or even make us happy.

What you're saying I guess is that they're afraid of transformation, and that as a result they might have to give up some things that don't make them happy, they're that greedy, having measured the cost of discipleship that they want no part of it, thus turning what might have been otherwise open minded consideration and investigation into a blind pursuit in the name of intollerance and hatred. How sad, and FUNNY!

reply to post by randyvs

No other religion has seen more brutality and contempt thru history, than Christianity And that contempt is just unfounded hate. Where does the hate come from most common ? Fear.

Whoa, settle down there, cowboy!

No other religion has seen more brutality and contempt that Christianity? Jews come to my mind.

If you lump all the pagans that Catholics killed, and the history of Christians killing each other, like the historical conflict between Protestants and Catholics in Northern Ireland, and add to that the brutal treatment to the indigenous people of the Americas, and HANDS DOWN, Christians are the most brutal religion in the history of their existence.

reply to post by windword


I wasn't mentioning conflicts Win. I should have used the word persecution I guess for more clarity and my point may be arguable. But my point starts at the events leading up to The Cross on Calvary and have been ongoing ever since that day.

reply to post by NewAgeMan


No it's not so much about good people, bad. Or right or wrong people. But it is most definitely about what God in his
wisdom requires and demands of us now. That we may not fall short in the future. The future after this world passes away and becomes no more even in memory.

Originally posted by randyvs
reply to post by windword

 

I wasn't mentioning conflicts Win. I should have used the word persecution I guess for more clarity and my point may be arguable. But my point starts at the events leading up to The Cross on Calvary and have been ongoing ever since that day.

Fair enough. I'll edit my content to reflect your edited position:

Whoa, settle down there, cowboy!

No other religion has seen more persecution than Christianity? Jews come to my mind.

If you lump all the pagans that Catholics persecuted, and the history of Christians persecuting each other, like the historical conflict between Protestants and Catholics in Northern Ireland, and add to that the persecution of the indigenous people of the Americas, HANDS DOWN, the Christians religion is the religion that has done the most persecution in the history of their existence.

Better?

Originally posted by mymymy
I have no problem with people believing in God, or worshiping God, or even talking to me about their beliefs in their chosen God. What I detest though are people who call themselves Christians who are in actuality the furthest thing from one. Every single person I have met who claims to be a Christian have been an incredible hypocritical, judgmental person. Every single one!

You don't talk down to people if you're a Christian, you don't call for votes to deny people food and shelter if you're a Christian. You don't put a helping hand out to a wealthy person while standing on a poor person if you're a Christian. And a real Christian does not belong to any political party.

The reason Christians get so much contempt is because they have no idea what being a Christian actually means. Being able to quote Bible verses, or going to church does not make you one.

No one is perfect, even the best of us still fall short because were stuck in these rotting bodies this still hold some influence over us. That being said, yeah i agree with most of what you're saying. Ofcourse most of those people are not christians. You can sit on the front pew, pay tithes and be a member of a church and bust the gates of hell wide open as you pass through them. The road to hell is paved with good intentions. Most people calling themselves christians have probably rarely if ever cracked open a bible much less be able to quote from the scriptures, but it's not our place to condemn. Not that we cannot make judgements, we can make judgements alright, but they can't be about appearences or fleshly judgements, but make righteous judgements of the spirit.

John 7:24 Do not judge according to appearance, but judge with righteous judgment.”

This falls along the lines of (as example), not giving a rich person the best seat in the house because they have great wealth, and when a poor man comes, make him stand or sit on the floor, deeming the rich man more valuable than the poor man because he has more money. It's this type of hypocrisy that pissed Christ off about the pharisees and why he condemned them.

Originally posted by Kargun
This is not tounge and cheek.

With so much ignorance, antisemitism and pure dissdain for Christian on this site I thought I would like to make a short thread thanking Christians.

First off we owe everything from space travel to modern medicine to Christian scientists. Now you might not like this but it is a stone cold fact.

Here is a small list of Christian scientists.



en.wikipedia.org...

Some interesting ones from the link

Isaac Newton (1643–1727)

He is regarded as one of the greatest scientists and mathematicians in history. Newton's study of the Bible and of the early Church Fathers were among his greatest passions, though he consistently refused to swear his allegiance to the church. He wrote Observations upon the Prophecies of Daniel and the Apocalypse of St. John (Nontrinitarianism).[58]

Most people know that he was a Christian but people don't realize 80% of all his writings were about the Bible.


Galileo Galilei (1564–1642)

He didn't like Catholics all that much but he was a devout Christian. Wrote a ton about his faith.

Blaise Pascal (1623–1662)
René Descartes (1596–1650) These guys brought on the "Scientific revolution" yup, Christians.

Stephen Hales (1677–1761)

"A Copley Medal winning scientist significant to the study of plant physiology. As an inventor designed a type of ventilation system, a means to distill sea-water, ways to preserve meat, etc. In religion he was an Anglican curate who worked with the Society for the Promotion of Christian Knowledge and for a group working to convert black slaves in the West Indies.[60]"

Safeway would like to thank this guy. Oh and everyone that eats.

Anyhow the list is long. From Lord Kelvin, Georg Cantor (hi set theory) to Max Plank and Werner Heisenberg the contributions to improving our society and all levels, be it Vacuum cleaners to the laws of gravity, these people believed in science and God.

These people were not the evil Christians. Some posters often say " I'd love to get rid of all the Christians" by doing so we would be living in the dark ages.

edit on Tue Dec 11 2012 by DontTreadOnMe because: IMPORTANT: Using Content From Other Websites on ATS

edit on Tue Dec 11 2012 by DontTreadOnMe because: (no reason given)

To God Almighty be the Glory!
The Lord Jesus will be ashamed of those who don't confess Him as Lord and savior.. as will Our Holy Father.
He is the One true God. Honor Him and He will honor you.

Originally posted by randyvs
reply to post by NewAgeMan

 

they hold in contempt that which they've never really investigated fully with an open mind and heart.

No other religion has seen more brutality and contempt thru history, than Christianity
And that contempt is just unfounded hate. Where does the hate come from most common ? Fear.
People who have certain lifestyles fear Christianity because it is the hard hitting truth.
It's the truth that people first fear and then move on to hate, then scorn, laugh, mock and claim the Bible is
just an old book of fairy tales.

Why would anyone ruled by their chosen life style want anything to do with God ? They may have to change something about the way they live. Easier just to write him off.

And the beat goes on.

.

edit on 13-12-2012 by randyvs because: (no reason given)

Christian is a word many have used and diluted, same as the word Love.

Any person who is Christian is a person who follows and believes on the words of Christ Himself. not adding nor subtracting truth/His words

There are many in the past and today who ' add ' opinion and tradition alongside Christ.

where, opinion and tradition were upheld higher than the deity of Christ, many have slaughtered and murdered hiding behind the name of Christ.. and they have and will pay for what they have done.

Not only have those of the catholic church defiled what is holy, but they have created an atheist drive in millions upon millions of souls who have been mislead by the horrid deeds of catholics who hide behind the name of Christ.

Today many stand behind the catholic church, even when their so-called priests have and continue to rape children.

i've heard a woman say aloud " They should've allowed them to marry! " siding with the priest she said this as though the man was innocent of rape. This organization is no Christ filled place. catholicism need be abolished.


Christ is innocent in all of this. He has not a thing to do with the catholic church. this is the sole reason why catholics have slaughtered protestants, because One was correct, while the other was catholic.

Originally posted by MrInquisitive
As for civilization owing a lot to Isaac Newton, didn't Newton, in turn, owe a lot to pagans, such as the ancient/classical Greeks who developed math and geometry? Wasn't most all of agriculture developed by pagans/heathens, so we owe a great debt to them.

Hitler was a Christian and was raised a Catholic. And we owe so much to the Spanish inquisition -- particularly Jews do. Not.

Isaac Newton and all other mathematicians do owe a debt to the Church. After St. Patrick brought Catholicism to Ireland, and the Church taught them to write, the Irish soaked up as much knowledge as they could. They had books shipped in from all over, and copied them. If it weren't for the Irish and the Catholic Church, we wouldn't have any of the ancient texts that we do today.
A man named Fr. Roger Bacon was the one who saved the Aristotelian texts from being destroyed, and brought them into the the universities. He also was the one who brought the teachings of the Muslim mathematicians over to Europe, as well, and insisted that those be taught in universities.

Hitler was told by the Church that he couldn't become a priest, and that's why he ended up becoming a dictator. The Church knew he was bad stock. Many argue that the Church sided with Hitler, but Hitler wanted to bury the Church. He had a plan to arrest and kill the Pope, but one of Hitler's advisers told him that would be stupid, since the entirety of the Church would rise up against him. Pope Pius XII had tens of thousands of Jewish people hiding in the Vatican. He did everything he could to save them. Catholics from all over took them into their homes to protect them.

The Inquisition was established to try to clear the names of people who were falsely accused of heresy. However, those who were convicted were not punished by the Church. The convicted were handed over to local authorities for their penal system. In fact, people preferred the ecclesiastical courts to the secular court system, which had less safeguards for them. Evidence has been found that people purposely blasphemed in the secular courts to get their trial moved to the ecclesiastical courts. Furthermore, the Inquisition laid the basis for current court systems: summoning and interrogation of witnesses, investigation of accusations, and acceptance of evidence from the accused, instead of waiting for witnesses to come forward after a formal accusation, and reliance solely on witness testimony. Pope Boniface VIII required that all witnesses be named to the accused. Pope Innocent III forbade help to the accused, but this was ignored, and counsel was generally provided.

Originally posted by milominderbinder
The period of time known as "The Dark Ages" refers to the time AFTER the collapse of the PAGAN Roman Empire and DIRECTLY COINCIDES WITH THE ADVENT AND SPREAD OF ORGANIZED CHRISTIANITY.

The Dark Ages ENDED in the 15th century when the RENAISSANCE took hold and people, governments, and scholars MOVED AWAY FROM the teachings of the church and decided it was time to stop burning scientists at the stake for practicing "sorcery"...although it should still be noted that non-scientists continued to be roasted alive for another three hundred years or so whenever crops failed, somebody's pig died, or anything at all happened that the semi-literate-at-best peasants couldn't wrap their heads around.

The Dark Ages ended in the tenth century with the Middle Ages, during which time the Catholic Church founded over 80 universities to spread education and knowledge. Subjects taught include mathematics, science, engineering, design, medicine, nursing, music, art, etc. Take a look at the European cathedrals and artwork, and then come back and tell me just how unlearned those people were.

A comprehensive welfare system was established, which was based on parishes, guilds and monasteries. They cared for the old, the ill, and the poor. Like welfare for the poor, ill, and old? Thank the Church.

During the Middle Ages was when the Charter of Liberties, and later the Magna Carta were signed, the latter at the behest of the barons after Fr. Stephen Langton read the former at a council meeting, reminding them of their rights. Without the Magna Carta, we wouldn't have democracy.

Originally posted by Quadrivium
reply to post by Krono

 

Well then by all means, please explain your logic.

First of all, my sincere apologies for the late reply, I completely forgot about this thread.

Before I say what I'm about to say, I'd like to say I don't care what "belief system" people wish to follow and if it makes you happy praying to a "celestial, benevolent being" then great! Enjoy. If you chose to go down the scientific road and believe the Universe was created by accident then fantastic. I really don't care and if I offend anyone with what I'm about to say, then, at the bottom of my heart, I'm sorry.

Now back to the question in hand!

Regarding your statement,

"Many, who feel that to believe in a higher power makes one "stupid", have an "elitist" attitude."

Well, those who are of that opinion are only saying that because they can't see the logic in believing in a "being" whom created everything in the Universe (including the Universe duh!). I don't see the logic either. So, sometimes they'd wonder, "what's the point in believing in something which has no evidence to back it up, where as science has backed up evolution with sufficient amount of evidence? Why follow an ancient book of stories which is 2000 (Approximately, I don't know how old it is) years old, where as scientific text books are constantly being updated?".

For many years, people have been massacred, but it's ok because "god" told them to, Crusades in the Middle East for the prime example!!!! Religion is pretty much founded on death. Now I'm not saying non-believers are perfect, I'm well aware of the atrocities that non-believers have committed. In a sense, we are all "sinners" because we've ALL done something bad in our lives and that has nothing to do with "satan's work" or the forces of "evil" and that crap. It's human nature.

Again, I have no issue with people believing in god or what ever they believe in, how ever I have a BIG issue with religion itself. The vast majority of religious folk are good, honest and kind people. The vast majority of non-believers are good, honest and kind people. But, on each side, there will be a minority of idiots who like to ruin it for people.

I know I kinda went of your question a bit but I got carried away.

Looking forward to you reply.

reply to post by Krono

No offense taken, you are entitled to your beliefs as well

So if I read your post correctly your beliefs could be boiled down to the following picture..


Where I choose to believe that every great soup needs a great chef

Seriously, any TRUE logical person would look at evolution and find the "evidence" very lacking.
The only thing the theory really has going for it is adaptation or if you would prefer "micro-evolution".
All life on earth was given the ability to adapt to survive.
I do not want to derail this thread but I will gladly discus this with you in another more appropriate thread or u2u.

The elitist attitude serves no purpose.
Any critical thinking person should know better.
They would understand that we only know a very, very small part of all there is to know. A drop in the ocean so to speak.

reply to post by lonewolf19792000


I so agree my friend, and you put it so more eloquently than I did. I just get so sick of the "Christians" I know looking down on people, and this is everyone of them I have met, so when I see these threads or hear people like this complaining about how they are treated, or talked to, well, in my experience, they deserve it completely. I hope I stressed enough that this is completely from my experiences with them

Originally posted by spyder550

Originally posted by PlayerOne

Originally posted by spyder550
The basic underpinnings of science is math -- sorry definitely not thunk up by christians

Oh and think where we would have been today if the christians hadn't brought us the DARK AGES.

The Dark Ages where brought to you by the Visigoths destroying the Roman Empire and all of the security it brought. A power vacuum along with a lack of law and order and education then occurred followed. As far as I am aware the Visigoths where not Christians.

Yeah as if that isn't debatable -- if it hadn't been for christians I would have my flying car by now.

Your quite wrong...

The Dark Ages Early scholars gave the name "Dark Ages" to the period in Europe after the fall of the Roman Empire. During this period, barbarian Goths, Vandals, and Huns swept down on Europe from the north and east. They destroyed many fine buildings and works of art that had existed during Roman times. During the Dark Ages, knowledge survived only in monasteries, and there were very few schools. Many of the old arts and crafts were lost. This is why the time was called the "Dark Ages." The eastern Roman Empire was not conquered by the barbarians. There, the arts still flourished. People were still thinking and making fine works of art in other parts of the world. In China and India, great civilizations grew and spread. In the 1000s, Europe began to slowly recover from its artistic darkness. The lost knowledge of the ancient Greeks and Romans was found again. There was a new interest in learning, and the richer life of the Middle Ages began.

Source

Nothing whatsoever to do with Christianity, in fact quite the opposite. The Roman Catholic Church (not remotely similar to what we call Christianity today or immediately following the death of Christ) was burning people for heresy during the middle ages starting at around 1200 CE. During the Dark Ages religion held society together as best it could retaining what knowledge it could.

Christians are great and believing christians are better.