Obamacare fee to offset costs of pre-existing conditions

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posted on Dec, 12 2012 @ 09:51 AM
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reply to post by Stormdancer777
 


You forgot to add that the poor and elderly will be in the hands of a panel of unelected officials to dicatate what benefits or fees can be added or taken from the two entittlement programs medicare and medicaid under Obamacare.

But that is ok, no wonder people are worrying about the so call death panels.
If you are ederly or poor I guess somebody will decide for you.
edit on 12-12-2012 by marg6043 because: (no reason given)




posted on Dec, 12 2012 @ 10:19 AM
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When did we all forget that this model was originally a Republican idea...including the mandate, including covering people with pre-existing conditions. Here's an article that talks about it:

blogs.laweekly.com...

I am more than happy to pay a little bit more so someone who got laid off and has no health insurance can get a life-saving operation if they need to, or to help out the single mom who's working 3 part time jobs, but is not getting enough hours at any one of them to qualify to get employer sponsored health care like most of us have, so she and her kids have preventative medicine and care. Obamacare may not be perfect we can all agree on that but it is a step in the right direction.

The US currently ranks 37th in the world for healthcare delivery (en.wikipedia.org...). We've got to do something.

When did it become so bad to offer basic health services to everyone? I always hear, "The US is the greatest country the world has ever seen", and all about American exceptionalism. How can we be the best or exceptional if we are able to provide basic preventative health care to everyone but don't?



posted on Dec, 12 2012 @ 10:21 AM
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reply to post by marg6043
 


nothing will get us out of this mess!!!
not taxing the rich, not cutting the entitlements, nothing!!!
which just peeves me off more!!
the politcal players just keep playing on and on, if we can do this, or if we can do that....
and all the while...
in the back rooms, they are spending more and more money of crap that very few of us here on these boards would find useful in our personal lives in any manner shape or form!!!

the problem isn't us, be it liberals or conservatives, the problem is the corrupt political leaders and those who bought them off...

but, let me ask you something....
the amount of bush's wars plus those lovely bailouts for the financial systems.....please include the ones that aren't that well know and don't tell me that much of it was paid off, having the fed funnel money to them so they can pay it off, isn't paying it off, it's more like, that hidden tax called inflation was increase to give them the money to pay it off....well, those two items combined about equals the debt
so, well, just who should be taxes to pay it off??
should our servicemen and women come home after long tours in hellholes to find the price of everything so much more, their veterns benefits not what they expected, and more and more taxes, less and less services??
should those who are about to go into retirement, who may have done everything right, had their iras, paid their mortgages all along, possibly even own their houses now, worked everydays for over 40 years, paid and social security only to find their iras, their homes and their other investments not worth as much as they should be because of some nice big scam that an alliance between bankers and gov't officials concocted, well... should they be the ones paying?? what about those who actually managed to reap the rewards of the scam...who by the way....are members of those we can truly call rich!! just why shouldn't they have to give back some of that profit to pull the country out now???
no, taxing the rich isn't the answer, but there is one thing for sure...
there is no answer is everyone isn't sharing in the cost!!!
and that is where the republicans fail I am afraid....their are so intent on protecting those rich people from any consequences of their actions, acting like, just taking it from the poorer classes will work....
how can it work???? ya, take the money from the future grannies, okay...anyone out there actually look into just what those grannies are doing with their time?? they are watching their grandkids so mommy and daddy can work...without pay in most cases... they are volunteering in positions that once well, were actually once paid posititons! the poor, many of whom are working, ya, take away their food stamps...just what are you gonna have?? sick hungry employees?? disgruntled workers demanding higher pay?? more workers heading into the workforce wanting those part time jobs to go along with their full time job?? and yes, let's put all those single moms to work....even though it quite possible that the amount is costs to put their child into a child care setting per hour is more than she can earn!!!!

unless you are willing to allow the poor, the young, the elderly to just lie in the streets and die!!! you really can't expect them to contribute that much....they have nothing to give! they are barely getting by!!
the middle class is quickly falling into the the "poor" and that leaves just one group left!
the one that some seem to think should be immune to paying anything!

I am just saying....
if the old, the poor, the youngest, the vets, ect can be expected to make a few sacrifices, well, those the did reap the rewards of the heist to begin with sure the heck should be expect to!!! at least increase the capital gains tax...increase the ceiling for social security payments. at least try to give the impression of fairness to the scam!! as far as obamacare, most of us knew it was a farce to begin with, unless they actually do something to bring the costs of care down, well, nothing is gonna work!! this nation pays more for healthcare than every other nation on earth even without obamacare. I'm pretty sure that there are viable ways to bring that cost down to a managable level if the one's pulling the strings were to lay their greed aside and chose that path. they're not, thus, the obamacare fiasco!



posted on Dec, 12 2012 @ 10:27 AM
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reply to post by Happy1
 


We actually already pay over $800 a month for insurance and it has gone up constantly since Obama took office.
We make less than $60K a year.

You are right they want everyone to be dependent little sheep. Well, sorry, we work our hardest to assure that our children have healthy food and a roof over their heads, and to still contribute to our community.

Apparently some of these people either don't have mouths to feed (without foodstamps) or taxes to pay, or outrageous energy bills. Congratulations! I DO!

It is one thing when people from another country don't have a clue, and entirely another when they are from here and buy into our 'savior government' who in all of their innate wisdom has put us on such a path of honesty and prosperity.


I also hate the the guilt trip junk that they use to coerce people into staying quiet and not fighting the system. They have used this politically correct bs to completely cow people who normally try to do the right thing anyway. Now they are using these snotty remarks to guilt good people into doing what the collective wants. I for one am sick of it.

Thanks for understanding, I am floored sometimes by the mentality that just because you are not on welfare means that you can afford to pay for everyone else. It is not true because we ALREADY ARE!! The day people on welfare showed off their new gaming systems to me is the day I was done feeling sorry for them. Maybe the recipients of the healthcare should pay the $63. I know I have to pay for my own healthcare.
edit on 12-12-2012 by woodsmom because: typo



posted on Dec, 12 2012 @ 10:49 AM
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reply to post by woodsmom
 


it wasn't going up before obama???
ours did, year by year...the boss ate most of the additional cost, ours went up a little, and well, the rest was made up by higher deductables, ect...

the last few years I lived in NY I watched...
the state legislators would want tax increase after tax increase...the justification?? the cost of heatlhcare, for their employees, for medicaid.... and well, little changes would be made to the programs about once a year..and everytime they were made two things would happen shortly afterwards....
one, all the big wigs in the insurance companies would pat themselves on the back and reward themselves with nice big raises!
two, the cost of the insurance premiums would be increase...(why not the gov't just expanded the programs again, so well, those who couldn't afford the cost had a little better chance of getting the gov't to subsidize). and well, if not, who cared?? the gov't delivered a bunch of new customers to their door everytime they expanded the program, so well, lose one gain three!!!

obama care is the ultimate for them!! ya, they might lose some customers who well, then will end up paying anyways in the form of a nice tax, which will probably end up in the insurance companies hands anyways....but now it's probably more like lose one gain a hundred!!!

their "help the poor" is and always has been a nice scam to take money from us to put into their pockets and the pockets of those few who manage to get on the recieving end of the subsidies that are given out to benefit the poor.
the only reason why it's coming to the head now is that those at the receiving end are finding that they are paying more in taxes than they want to. all was fine and dandy to them as long as they were getting a nice profit from the scam!!

edit on 12-12-2012 by dawnstar because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 12 2012 @ 11:31 AM
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reply to post by dawnstar
 


And yet again WE as tax paying citizens pay for it all. I don't see the Obama family giving up their vacation in Hawaii to help pay for those poor people.

The insurance companies have played their role in putting us where we are for a long time, with the help of government mandates that force us to buy this policy and that coverage. They have been working together for decades at out expense.

Things rose occasionally before 2008, but not like they have since then. Like you stated the employer was in a better position to cover the difference. The employers ( at least the smaller ones) are no longer in a position to eat that cost any more. They have bills to pay too, and this is still costing our economy jobs.

The system is BROKEN. Throwing more and more money at a lemon doesn't stop it from being a lemon, it just bankrupts you, and crushes your spirit when the haze clears and you realize that it wasn't worth what you paid for it in the first place.
edit on 12-12-2012 by woodsmom because: typo



posted on Dec, 12 2012 @ 11:54 AM
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reply to post by woodsmom
 


this everybody for themselves atititude isn't gonna help much either though. I don't care how rich you think you are, unless you are one of those few, I got a feeling that you will be finding yourself in the same boat as those "poor" that you are griping about taking your money now.
and in many cases, it's not the fault of the "poor" that they are in the position that they have to ask for help...crap just happens, and well...the ptb have been working hard for decades to make sure that they have to.
in most industries, the ones that are sucking in the most of the rewards, are basically middlemen...
look how much more a salesman makes compared to the one who produces the product they sale. or the percentage that the stockholders gain compared to them.
the whole system needs an overall, but first, we need to overhaul ourselves I think.
I remember about five or so years ago, on these very boards, people saying crap like,...oh, machinists,...ya even a monkey can do that..they don't need get decent wages....
really, look now..you have a bunch of employers complaining that they can't find anyone wanting to go into these skilled trades!! yep, the monkeys can do the work, so I guess we will let them do it, and the employers can pay them in banana and vet fees, right??
there is something off with the way society thinks, and unless they want to expand the social service programs even more to accomodate for the increasing numbers of the "needy" and inflation, or see those wages go up...well, people better start looking around at what these people are doing and ask themselves if they really want to live without their services. as a general rule, I don't think people work too hard for the priviledge of starving or being homeless....

don't like the social programs, well, empower those on them to not need them. that is something we could be doing, without the gov't, and quite frankly, I wouldn't expect the gov't to help in that area, they are too busy lining the pockets of themselves and their buddies to care.



posted on Dec, 12 2012 @ 11:55 AM
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reply to post by dawnstar
 


Is unfair, Drawnstar is so unfair I can scream to the top of my lungs and lose my voice in the process, why? because once you realized that the problems facing our nation is not us the people tax payer and voters, but the corruption, miss use and thievery of the same elected officials that dare to ask for for sacrifices, when they are the ones with bad policies that created the mess to Begin with

While we are facing unemployment higher taxes, loss of income, lower wages and lower standards of living, the whores in Washington dine and party in splendor while taking money from their benefactors for keeping the hard working Americans unable to be nothing more than a slave to the system, they have not problem with selling us to their pimps in the private interest business

They lie the steal and they do empty promises while selling the voters a pretty dream of better days.

Is all a lie.



posted on Dec, 12 2012 @ 11:58 AM
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Originally posted by Wrabbit2000
Yeah.. Freebie my dying tail. My mother just got an 'offer she couldn't refuse' made for financial payment on a hospital stay. She's always cash paid and never had a problem with reasonable payments established. Thats how she has always lived. This last time they explained that she could do one of two things. She could remain on cash, but the payments would be adjusted beyond her ability to meet them....or she could join the interim Obama care high risk pool of the uninsured. Oh what joy for her.... $600 a month is what THAT "freebie" costs and her S.S. payment? Just UNDER $600 a month. Merry Christmas and I hope it's a jolly one in the White House. At least someone ought to enjoy the thing.
....But think about all those poor children who will now have Obama care to pay their way because mommy is too lazy to go out and get a job. Obama care is only one component of many that enables the poor NOT to go out and better their lives. I mean really, why work if you can have those who DO work to pay your way?



posted on Dec, 12 2012 @ 11:59 AM
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reply to post by acuna
 


Is not the about leaving the poor and needy out of something to help them live by, is how the government is a liar about sacrifices when is the government the one that has created the economic mess with the tax payers are stuck with.

And then we most trust their lies one more time because they are presenting a propaganda of a health care for all.

Is not so, Obamacare is not what people think, is a scam and we all are going pay one way or the other and that includes the poor and needy.



posted on Dec, 12 2012 @ 12:03 PM
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Originally posted by usernameconspiracy
So I throw in $63 whole bucks a year and that's my part of helping to ensure that people with preexisting conditions are not refused by insurance? Sounds like a bargain to me. God forbid, I guess we just stay home one Saturday night a year and it's covered. Oh the burden!
If I have to pay $63 dollars a year, than it should be my choice. Not the Gov.



posted on Dec, 12 2012 @ 12:08 PM
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reply to post by marg6043
 



We told you so, but as usual people still think that Obama is going to send them checks in the mail to cover the extra cost

Its funny when you say that, because believe me, there will be people who believe they will actually get a check in the mail.



posted on Dec, 12 2012 @ 12:16 PM
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reply to post by Propulsion
 


I live in a welfare state, the town I live in have one of the highest unemployment rate in the whole state and yes people here are actually waiting for their first Obamacare check along with their welfare check and I am not joking, is unbelivable, what they don't know is that already the state is cutting medicaid benefits as we speak.



posted on Dec, 12 2012 @ 01:16 PM
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reply to post by woodsmom
 


My Healthcare insurance has been going up for a lot longer then Obama thats for sure! I've been with my current employer 20+ years and in that time I've seen where I used to get money-back- every paycheck to paying extra every paycheck. Just about every time benefits have come up for reelection (usually once a year) the cost of all insurance has gone up. Combine this cost with other cost of living increases and no protection for American jobs that aren't military and its no wonder that the middle class is an endangered species. So everyone can keep blaming Obama (his plan being the GOP plan by the way, that is until he wanted to do it and then the GOP was against it) but Obama is not the problem, healthcare reform took a tiny step forward but it has a long way to go.



posted on Dec, 12 2012 @ 01:28 PM
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reply to post by CALGARIAN
 


Yes but we cover illegals immigrants..I was under the impression that Canada was pulling away from that...And we may be the only country that does that now...but, I could be wrong..



posted on Dec, 12 2012 @ 01:39 PM
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reply to post by dawnstar
 


That's what I have been trying to address in every one of my posts.

We are NOT rich. We sacrifice everyday to feed our children the food that will actually help the grow up healthy. I spend my days cooking from scratch and preserving my own food because it is to expensive.

We do encourage people. When those same people don't have to make sacrifices and still expect me to pick up their slack it infuriates me. I understand it isn't everyone who needs help, but the more that I personally see, the more these thoughts are proven right.

We make sacrifices and hard decisions so that hopefully we are not in that position. Every one of our personal decisions has helped us to build the life that we lead.

I choose to take groceries to the Food Bank because I know that it was an extra hard year on people around here. I choose to feed that needy family with a $300 box of groceries because I do care. I donate warm winter gear on a yearly basis so that kids are not cold.

I am already voluntarily making sacrifices for my family in order to encourage the needy in my community. I know what it is like to be homeless and literally starving. It is my decision to better my life and not drag my children through the horrible childhood that I had.

I literally see people spend money on TOYS and whine because they don't have gas money. That is their personal choice.

I should have the FREEDOM TO CHOOSE WHO I HELP!! Not have it mandated to me by the government.
People are making it harder on a daily basis to allow people to truly help their communities. This new mandate may well mean that my food bank does not see my contribution next year.

And besides the government is so good at spending money wisely, I am sure that someone's grandma will see that $ 250 from my home show up directly at theirs for her bills. There is no way the wise government would possibly spend that on something else.*sarcasm*



posted on Dec, 12 2012 @ 01:48 PM
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reply to post by Helmkat
 


You are right!! Absolutely!! They are all jackasses!! If our current dink can't give up his multi-million dollar vacation in Hawaii to pay for this, then why do I have to give up my damn grocery money?

It does not change what I have personally dealt with in the last 4 years. I see where the paycheck goes, I am at least OK with math. It may not be the same for everyone, but this is what my family is experiencing.

The system is broken and throwing more money, that nobody has, is not going to fix the problem.
Politics are not going to fix the problem. People need to stand up for what is really right to fix the problem.

We have some major problems that have been building for some time now.
Which is why my family has made the personal choices that it has.
Nobody, not even my husband
) is allowed to tell me what I think or how I feel is wrong.
This is my personal opinion.



posted on Dec, 12 2012 @ 03:35 PM
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Many of you are too dim to see the ultimate plan I guess...

Have you ever heard the phrase that it is often the darkest right before the light? That's what we are going through and what we will have to go through before things get better.

Those who will see their strangle hold on us fall away are squeezing tighter in an effort to make us stop "bucking". If you've ever broken a animal, you know they buck really hard before they break. All I see are people who are so scared for the animal (the rich corporations) that you want to let em off the hook.

1. Can't tax the rich they will just leave = the rich bucking and spreading propaganda.
2. The moochers and leeches are the problem = more bucking and propaganda.
3. Businesses threatening to fire everyone and reduce hours = MORE BUCKING!

Can't you see, the corporations are attempting to make us get off their backs....right before they break!

Just hold on for the wild ride and things will get better.

What Obamacare is doing is putting the ball in the court of business owners and the insurance companies. For years they've been trash talking, so Obama called their bluff and put the ball in their court. The insurance companies will get fat for a while, but the result will be they can't cover everyone! They will go out of business and the true leaches will die. Get rid of all these middle-men who make fortunes not doing any work!

True businesses may hurt for a while not being able to cover the employees. But that serves a purpose also.

A persons healthcare SHOULD NOT BE TIED TO THEIR EMPLOYMENT! I can't believe so many people are so stupid they never noticed this!!! That is true slavery, being forced to kiss a boss' arse, not so much because of a pay check, but to keep your healthcare!

Obamacare is a road to more freedom! Where you can choose to be an independent contractor or work for a company that doesn't offer healthcare because you will already and always have it! NOW THAT IS FREEDOM!!!

Healthcare is being removed from the employers responsibility to the area of public access.

True poor people may not pay into the pool much but look at this angle. Instead of middle income families paying $400 per month to cover their family, due to the larger pool, they may only pay $80 per month. Along with everyone else. How is that not a win?

Obamacare is just a step to forcing the country to single-pay.



posted on Dec, 12 2012 @ 03:38 PM
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Free stuff is never free. Socialism never worked and never will. It's always been a huge trick. Bye bye Liberty. Hello totalitarianism



posted on Dec, 12 2012 @ 03:43 PM
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We condemn people and families for living above their means, but we let these businesses off?

Many businesses have been operating above their means. They know they can only employ 10 people, but in an effort to make more profits, they hire 20. And make no mistake that it's done to make the owner more profit, no one owns a business with the single minded goal of empoying people!

Perhaps companies should budget for the true number of employees they can employ comfortably and stop gambling? It's the chase for becoming rich that is causing them to do this. True some succeed, but most don't.

If your innovation and idea only allows you to employ 3 people, why are you trying to operate above your means in hopes that demand will pick up? Then complaining that government is regulating you out of business.





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