Stories of Jesus in Islamic tradition.

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posted on Dec, 14 2012 @ 06:19 AM
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reply to post by Deetermined
 



No, insulting the Qu'ran is insulting the fake revelation from Muhammad.

Its fake only in your eyes.
Even if you don't believe Islam, when you insult the Koran, you are basically denigrating a book containing the revelations about Jesus and the prophets given to the Arabs.


Skorpion, if Muhammad had a real revelation, why did he need to quote the Bible so much and then turn around and give his own interpretation? The Bible and the Qu'ran contradict each other.

He didn't quote the bible. The stories in the Bible were revealed to him seperately.


The biggest mistake Muhammad made was trying to convince all of you that Jesus didn't really die when all of the other prophets say he did. Now we have Muhammad contradicting the other prophets too.


So if Mohammads revelation said that Jesus was killed, would you have accepted him as a prophet?
I doubt you would.... because you already have it in your mind that Mohammad was a false prophet... and that you need Jesus' dead body on a cross for YOUR personal benefit.
All we have is an account that Jesus was captured and executed. You will quote something from the Old Testament to make it look like the OT prophet was foretelling that Jesus would be crucified.




posted on Dec, 14 2012 @ 06:31 AM
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Originally posted by sk0rpi0n

Wilderness can be used in a different context in different places. Wilderness in Isaiah 42 refers to the wilderness that Ishmael was sent to. Kedar is the son of Ishmael. Mohammad was a descendant of Kedar. The clues are all there. If you don't want to see it, then its your problem.


I've already proven that there were Kedarites living in the region of Petra and the areas around Jordan, which is where those verses were talking about. But I also proved that there were Korahites living there too. They were both inhabiting the land.

If you think the "wilderness" in Isaiah 42 is a different location, then prove it.



On the contrary, the first 4 verses perfectly match Mohammad.


I'll let other people read it for themselves in order to make that determination.

Isaiah 42:1-4

1 Behold my servant, whom I uphold; mine elect, in whom my soul delighteth; I have put my spirit upon him: he shall bring forth judgment to the Gentiles.

2 He shall not cry, nor lift up, nor cause his voice to be heard in the street.

3 A bruised reed shall he not break, and the smoking flax shall he not quench: he shall bring forth judgment unto truth.

4 He shall not fail nor be discouraged, till he have set judgment in the earth: and the isles shall wait for his law.

By the way, what isles did Muhammad set judgement on? Did Muhammad set judgement in the entire earth? The answer would be, NO!



Mohammad, despite being a warrior and a military strategist was a very gentle human being. There are plenty of Hadiths which attest to his gentle nature. My favorite is the one about him not disturbing a cat that was sleeping on his prayer robe, he simply cut the part of the robe the cat was sleeping on and took the rest of his cloak with him.


Was Jesus a warrior or a military strategist? No. He is the only one who fits the description in verses 1 thru 3.

Sorry, Skorpion, no amount of repeating yourself is going to work on this one. It only takes some common sense to see through what you're saying.

edit on 14-12-2012 by Deetermined because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 14 2012 @ 06:39 AM
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reply to post by sk0rpi0n
 





So if Mohammads revelation said that Jesus was killed, would you have accepted him as a prophet? I doubt you would.... because you already have it in your mind that Mohammad was a false prophet... and that you need Jesus' dead body on a cross for YOUR personal benefit.


Yes, if Muhammad's stories even came close to the stories of the other prophets, it wouldn't have been a problem. Muhammad would probably have had his own book in the Bible, but he doesn't because he contradicted everything everyone else was teaching about Jesus, including what Jesus taught.

You can't have Muhammad contradicting EVERYONE ELSE and expect it to be related to Jesus in any way.

Once again, common sense should tell you that, even without the power of the Holy Spirit.



posted on Dec, 14 2012 @ 06:44 AM
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Originally posted by Deetermined
reply to post by Aesir26
 


Sorry, Aesir26, but I don't know what your point is, again! Do you care to speak in English sentences communicating the information that you've provided? Don't forget the links as to where you're getting your information.
edit on 14-12-2012 by Deetermined because: (no reason given)


That particular reference was from the Online Etymology Dictionary.
You had said "Peter" connotes, "rock".
I demonstrated it to mean, "father", which is the correct reading.
Sometimes there is more than one meaning to a given word.
For example, "laos" means "people" just as it does mean, "rocks".

Why are you lost? Are you not able to follow the trail of evidence I have provided?
It is ample.



posted on Dec, 14 2012 @ 06:56 AM
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reply to post by Aesir26
 


Guess what I just pulled from the "Online Etymology Dictionary"?


Peter

masc. proper name, 12c., from O.E. Petrus (gen. Pet(e)res, dative Pet(e)re), from L. Petrus, from Gk. Petros, lit. "stone, rock," translation of Syriac kefa "stone" (Latinized as Cephas), nickname Jesus gave to apostle Simon Bar-Jona (Matt. xvi:17), historically known as St. Peter, and consequently a popular name among Christians (e.g. Italian Pietro, Spanish and Portuguese Pedro, Old French Pierres, French Pierre, etc.). Slang for "penis" is attested from 1902, probably from identity of first syllable.

The common form of this very common name in medieval England was Peres (Anglo-French Piers), hence surnames Pierce, Pearson, etc. Among the dim. forms were Parkin and Perkin. To rob Peter to pay Paul (1510s, also in early 17c. French as descouvrir S. Pierre pour couvrir S. Pol) might be a reference to the many churches dedicated to those two saints, and have sprung from the fairly common practice of building or enriching one church with the ruins or revenues of another. But the alliterative pairing of the two names is attested from c.1400 with no obvious connection to the saints:

Sum medicyne is for peter þat is not good for poul, for þe diuersite of complexioun. [Lanfranc's "Chirurgia Magna," English translation].


www.etymonline.com...

So, once again, I'm not seeing what you're talking about.

edit on 14-12-2012 by Deetermined because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 14 2012 @ 07:13 AM
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And Abraham took Ishmael his son, and all that were born in his house, and all that were bought with his money, every male among the men of Abraham's house; and circumcised the flesh of their foreskin in the selfsame day, as God had said unto him. And Abraham was ninety years old and nine, when he was circumcised in the flesh of his foreskin. And Ishmael his son was thirteen years old, when he was circumcised in the flesh of his foreskin. In the selfsame day was Abraham circumcised, and Ishmael his son. (Gen 17:23-26)

Ishmael was thirteen when he was circumcised. Thirteen in gematria represents "water"; "fish", and the "fisherman". Who is the fisher of men? Who is the Kingfisher (Latin: Halcyon)? Alcyone, the bright star of the Pleiades; the Morning Star.


"And God heard the voice of the lad; and the angel of God called to Hagar out of heaven, and said unto her, What aileth thee, Hagar? fear not; for God hath heard the voice of the lad where he is. Arise, lift up the lad, and hold him in thine hand; for I will make him a great nation. And God opened her eyes, and she saw a well of water; and she went, and filled the bottle with water, and gave the lad drink. And God was with the lad; and he grew, and dwelt in the wilderness, and became an archer. And he dwelt in the wilderness of Paran: and his mother took him a wife out of the land of Egypt. (Gen 21:17-21)

Allah is with Ishmael, just as He is with Esau.

Ishmael: translated literally as "God has hearkened", suggesting that "a child so named was regarded as the fulfillment of a divine promise". (Wiki)

edit on 14-12-2012 by Aesir26 because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 14 2012 @ 07:15 AM
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reply to post by Aesir26
 


Why in the world are you trying to use Sanskrit to interpret the Bible? Really? That's where you are going wrong.


Sanskrit (संस्कृतम् saṃskṛtam [sə̃skɹ̩t̪əm], originally संस्कृता वाक् saṃskṛtā vāk, "refined speech"), is a historical Indo-Aryan language, the primary liturgical language of Hinduism and a literary and scholarly language in Buddhism and Jainism. Today, it is listed as one of the 22 scheduled languages of India and is an official language of the state of Uttarakhand. Sanskrit holds a prominent position in Indo-European studies.


en.wikipedia.org...



posted on Dec, 14 2012 @ 07:20 AM
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reply to post by Deetermined
 


Because Sanskrit/Hindi is a Proto-Indo European language, as is Greek and Latin, for that matter.
I'm sorry, but your posts are perverse.



posted on Dec, 14 2012 @ 07:23 AM
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reply to post by Aesir26
 





Allah is with Ishmael, just as He is with Esau.


You finally said something that made sense!

Yes, we all know that Allah is the God of Ishmael and Esau. Just like the God of the Bible belongs to Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. Now you know why they are two separate religions.

God made all of the tribes into great nations, but he didn't promise Abraham's inheritance to all of them, now did he?



edit on 14-12-2012 by Deetermined because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 14 2012 @ 07:25 AM
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Originally posted by Aesir26
reply to post by Deetermined
 


Because Sanskrit/Hindi is a Proto-Indo European language, as is Greek and Latin, for that matter.
I'm sorry, but your posts are perverse.


Why don't you go back to Hebrew and Arabic if you want a true understanding.



posted on Dec, 14 2012 @ 07:34 AM
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Originally posted by Deetermined
reply to post by Aesir26
 





Allah is with Ishmael, just as He is with Esau.


You finally said something that made sense!

Yes, we all know that Allah is the God of Ishmael and Esau just like Abraham, Isaac and Jacobs' God is the one of the Bible. Now you know why they are two separate religions.

God made all of the tribes into great nations, but he didn't promise Abraham's inheritance to all of them, now did he?



And Esau said unto his father, Hast thou but one blessing, my father? bless me, even me also, O my father. And Esau lifted up his voice, and wept.
And Isaac his father answered and said unto him, Behold, thy dwelling shall be the fatness of the earth, and of the dew of heaven from above;
And by thy sword shalt thou live, and shalt serve thy brother; and it shall come to pass when thou shalt have the dominion, that thou shalt break his yoke from off thy neck. (Gen 27:38-40)

Jacob ("Heel-Catcher"/"Israel": "those who strive against El"), deceived his Father stealing his brother's blessing . The entire tribe of Israel is founded upon deception. Esau, his Father's favorite, is prophesized to
overthrow the yoke of Israel in the name of El Elyon to come into his rightful inheritance.



posted on Dec, 14 2012 @ 07:45 AM
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reply to post by Aesir26
 


It sounds like you need to do some more research on El Elyon...

"The Names and Attributes of God"

www.myredeemerlives.com...



posted on Dec, 14 2012 @ 07:53 AM
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reply to post by Deetermined
 



I've already proven that there were Kedarites living in the region of Petra and the areas around Jordan,


"The cities Kedar inhabits" includes the cities of both Arabia and Jordan where Kedarites lived. And obviously most of the Kedarites were located in Arabia. It makes no difference. I've already shown that Jordan became Islamic shortly after Islam arrived. Like as if mentioning Kedarites living in Jordan will somehow falsify what I said.

I think Kedarites are mentioned there because Mohammad himself was descended from Kedar.


By the way, what isles did Muhammad set judgement on?


"and the isles shall wait for his law" = the law of Shariah.

It turns out Islam arrived on the Comoros Islands during the lifetime of Mohammad. I did't know this until I googled looking for a reply. Your question has only strengthened my belief a little more.


Did Muhammad set judgement in the entire earth?

It doesn't say "entire" earth.
"till he establishes justice on earth." = Mohammad established justice in the land, here on earth.



Was Jesus a warrior or a military strategist? No. He is the only one who fits the description in verses 1 thru 3.

Except these parts....
A bruised reed he will not break,
-Jesus caused a perfectly healthy fig tree to whither.

He will not shout or cry out, or raise his voice in the streets.
-Jesus made a big scene while driving out the money changers.


Another problem is that the servant of God in Isaiah 42 had to be a warrior. (see verses 4 and 14)

See its pretty easy to disqualify Jesus using your approach as well.
I'm not saying I don't want it to be Jesus.... but all the clues point towards Mohammad.


edit on 14-12-2012 by sk0rpi0n because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 14 2012 @ 07:54 AM
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reply to post by Deetermined
 




You finally said something that made sense!

Yes, we all know that Allah is the God of Ishmael and Esau. Just like the God of the Bible belongs to Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. Now you know why they are two separate religions.


The Bible teaches us that Ishmael was named directly by the God of the Bible.... and that God was "with" Ishmael as he was growing up.

Congrats, YOU just finally said something that made sense! Allah is the God of Ishmael because Allah is the God of the Bible and of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob.


edit on 14-12-2012 by sk0rpi0n because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 14 2012 @ 08:05 AM
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reply to post by Deetermined
 


El Elyon, El and Yahweh are three different entities.

El Elyon is God Most High; the Father of the Heavens; The One and The Merciful.

Yahweh is Mars/Marduk/Tyr/Taranis the fallen tyrant who rebels against El Elyon:

"I will ascend above the heights of the clouds;
I will make myself like El Elyon." (Isa 14:14)

The Yahwists (JOVE/Law worshippers) clashed with the Elohists in the composition of today's version of the Old Testament. I digress, but what do you think "Jude Law" really means?



posted on Dec, 14 2012 @ 08:35 AM
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reply to post by sk0rpi0n
 





Another problem is that the servant of God in Isaiah 42 had to be a warrior. (see verses 4 and 14) See its pretty easy to disqualify Jesus using your approach as well. I'm not saying I don't want it to be Jesus.... but all the clues point towards Mohammad.


Fail. The Bible says that Jesus will return to judge the earth. We all know he isn't returning peacefully, which is why it talks about his peaceful nature here on earth and then waiting a long time before unleashing wrath. You only want to separate the verses. You're not looking at them from a whole.

Isaiah 42:14

14 I have long time holden my peace; I have been still, and refrained myself: now will I cry like a travailing woman; I will destroy and devour at once.



posted on Dec, 14 2012 @ 08:43 AM
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Originally posted by Aesir26
reply to post by Deetermined
 


El Elyon, El and Yahweh are three different entities.

El Elyon is God Most High; the Father of the Heavens; The One and The Merciful.

Yahweh is Mars/Marduk/Tyr/Taranis the fallen tyrant who rebels against El Elyon:

"I will ascend above the heights of the clouds;
I will make myself like El Elyon." (Isa 14:14)

The Yahwists (JOVE/Law worshippers) clashed with the Elohists in the composition of today's version of the Old Testament. I digress, but what do you think "Jude Law" really means?


Why do you think God said that most important of the Commandments to the Jews was....

Deuteronomy 6:4

4 Hear, O Israel: The Lord our God is one Lord:

They didn't get it either. Just like you.

Besides, you've taken Israel 14:14 out of context too. Read the surrounding verses. It doesn't mention Yahweh. It mentions Lucifer.

Isaiah 14:12-15

12 How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!

13 For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north:

14 I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High.

15 Yet thou shalt be brought down to hell, to the sides of the pit.



posted on Dec, 14 2012 @ 08:47 AM
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reply to post by sk0rpi0n
 





Congrats, YOU just finally said something that made sense! Allah is the God of Ishmael because Allah is the God of the Bible and of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob.


If that were true, Muhammad wouldn't have contradicted the Bible, all of the other prophets and Jesus too.

God doesn't contradict himself, so Muhammad must have been in error.

Edit to add: Thanks for cutting off my posts to change their true meaning. That's why I changed it to two separate sentences instead of one.
edit on 14-12-2012 by Deetermined because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 14 2012 @ 08:57 AM
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reply to post by Aesir26
 


In the earliest stage Yahweh was one of the seventy children of El, each of whom was the patron deity of one of the seventy nations. This is illustrated by the Dead Sea Scrolls and Septuagint texts of Deuteronomy 32:8-9, in which El, as the head of the divine assembly, gives each member of the divine family a nation of his own, "according to the number of the divine sons": Israel is the portion of Yahweh. The later Masoretic text, evidently uncomfortable with the polytheism expressed by the phrase, altered it to "according to the number of the children of Israel" (Wiki)

"When Elyon gave nations as their inheritance, when he separated the sons of man, he set boundaries for the peoples according to the number of the sons of God/Israel. For Yahweh's portion is his people; Jacob is the lot of his inheritance." (Deu 32:8-9)

Yahweh is Marduk/Lucifer.
edit on 14-12-2012 by Aesir26 because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 14 2012 @ 09:07 AM
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reply to post by Deetermined
 



Muhammad wouldn't have contradicted the Bible, all of the other prophets and Jesus too.


Mohammad doesn't contradict the bible.
He, like the prophets and Jesus maintained that God is One and only God is to be worshipped.

It is the religion of Christianity have contradicted the Bible, with their ideas about God being a trinity / Jesus being God / God demanding a human sacrifice.

And also you don't seem to want to address what I said earlier about Ishmael.

The Bible teaches us that Ishmael was named directly by the God of the Bible.... and that God was "with" Ishmael as he was growing up.





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