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Do Freemasons worship demons!? I used to think not. Then I read this.

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posted on Jan, 20 2013 @ 05:10 PM
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reply to post by AugustusMasonicus
 


Nothing you posted from the Vatican directly contradicts anything I said. You are misconstruing things. Now while the Vatican may have contradicted what I said at some point in time, you have failed to prove that beyond a reasonable doubt thus far.

If this is that important to you to prove, you need audio from the Church explaining it. There is audio explaining everything else, so why not this? Let me help you out catholic.com . Catholic answers. Find something from there definitively saying the pronunciation is not the original. With audio, not from their forums.

eta : I am just politely reminding you that I still call BS, and you need audio.
edit on 20-1-2013 by NarrowGate because: (no reason given)




posted on Jan, 20 2013 @ 05:11 PM
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Originally posted by NarrowGate
I know you are an expert at taking things out of context...


It is kind of hard to take the Vatican out of context when they say:


Jesus
The word Jesus is the Latin form of the Greek Iesous, which in turn is the transliteration of the Hebrew Jeshua, or Joshua, or again Jehoshua, meaning "Jehovah is salvation."


and


The name Jesus (‘Yeshua’ or ‘Yehoshuah’ in Hebrew) is usually understood to mean ‘The Lord saves’.


How do you pronounce 'Yeshua’ or ‘Yehoshuah’?

The letter 'J' (as in the first letter of 'Jesus') was not even in use until the 15th century:


A distinctive usage emerged in Middle High German.[3] Gian Giorgio Trissino (1478–1550) was the first to explicitly distinguish I and J as representing separate sounds, in his Ɛpistola del Trissino de le lettere nuωvamente aggiunte ne la lingua italiana ("Trissino's epistle about the letters recently added in the Italian language") of 1524. source


It becomes more and more apparent that you are a shameless huckster who is attempting to rewrite history in the hopes that no one will ever call you on your glaring misinformation.



posted on Jan, 20 2013 @ 05:11 PM
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By a strange coincidence I'm currently watching Father Ted again. Great show!



posted on Jan, 20 2013 @ 05:13 PM
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reply to post by AugustusMasonicus
 


Look up what the Catholic Church teaches about the name Jehovah. You have proved zilch. So obviously no it is not hard to take it out of context. You just did.
edit on 20-1-2013 by NarrowGate because: (no reason given)


Ok seriously though, you just do not get it for some reason. I need audio evidence from a credible source, not out of context BS that you threw together. Jehovah
it was developed in the middle ages for the last time. Would you like to refute THAT statement? You already said I was wrong about that, and that you did not take that out of context.

So prove that the Catholic Church recognizes the name Jehovah and also prove that Jesus is not pronounced Jesus with audio evidence from the Church. You can't take that out of context, no wonder you are not using it.

I would like to think you would not go this far to deceive, which is the only reason I am bothering with this. I am probably wrong, and you probably would.
edit on 20-1-2013 by NarrowGate because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 20 2013 @ 05:36 PM
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reply to post by NarrowGate
 


You seem to be remarkably certain in your beliefs.



posted on Jan, 20 2013 @ 05:59 PM
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Originally posted by NarrowGate
I need audio evidence from a credible source, not out of context BS that you threw together.


I am going to let you provide your own audio:


Jesus
The word Jesus is the Latin form of the Greek Iesous, which in turn is the transliteration of the Hebrew Jeshua, or Joshua, or again Jehoshua, meaning "Jehovah is salvation."


The above source from the Catholic Church makes this so simple a retarded 1st grader could grasp the pronunciations.

The Greek Iesous (notice no letter 'J'?) was taken from the Hebrew Jeshua. Being that there was no letter 'J' in Greek, Latin, Aramaic and Hebrew how would you get the 'J' sound to make the word 'Jesus'? How could you even spell 'Jesus' whithout the letter 'J'?

Tell us oh, great Uncle Ponto, rewriter of history, language and etymology.



posted on Jan, 20 2013 @ 06:05 PM
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Originally posted by AngryCymraeg
reply to post by NarrowGate
 


You seem to be remarkably certain in your beliefs.


Thank you. While my faith may appear to be great, it is in fact not at all. There is nothing remarkable about me. I am assuming by beliefs you meant faith.



posted on Jan, 20 2013 @ 06:08 PM
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Originally posted by NarrowGate

Originally posted by AngryCymraeg
reply to post by NarrowGate
 


You seem to be remarkably certain in your beliefs.


Thank you. While my faith may appear to be great, it is in fact not at all. There is nothing remarkable about me. I am assuming by beliefs you meant faith.


Yes, that's the stuff. Tends to dissolve rapidly with the correct application of facts.



posted on Jan, 20 2013 @ 06:10 PM
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Originally posted by AugustusMasonicus

Originally posted by NarrowGate
I need audio evidence from a credible source, not out of context BS that you threw together.


I am going to let you provide your own audio:


Jesus
The word Jesus is the Latin form of the Greek Iesous, which in turn is the transliteration of the Hebrew Jeshua, or Joshua, or again Jehoshua, meaning "Jehovah is salvation."


The above source from the Catholic Church makes this so simple a retarded 1st grader could grasp the pronunciations.

The Greek Iesous (notice no letter 'J'?) was taken from the Hebrew Jeshua. Being that there was no letter 'J' in Greek, Latin, Aramaic and Hebrew how would you get the 'J' sound to make the word 'Jesus'? How could you even spell 'Jesus' whithout the letter 'J'?

Tell us oh, great Uncle Ponto, rewriter of history, language and etymology.



I feel bad for you. We already went over this.

For clarity, you are saying that the Church recognizes Jehovah as a valid name of God and that it was not developed in the middle ages?

We always have to go over things so many times. If there was a single audio out there you would have found it by now in your rush to prove me wrong. You can not, and have not, proved me wrong.

You did take that out of context, and we already went over how I know this with certainty.

You can take anything out of context and make it look like anything mitt.

Please, do provide undisputable proof of your outrageous claims. As in audio from the Church.

Once again, for clarity, you are working off of the pretense that the name Jehovah was not developed in the middle ages. Your post took this out of context and is misleading. It was developed in the middle ages and that is what the Church teaches.


You are now trying to erase the name of God
. Unless of course....you have audio evidence of your claims from the Church. Try Catholic.com - they surely covered this. With audio/video and in context too!

eta ; this is only obvious but the y was pronounced the way we pronounce J - well atleast closer to that than our y.
edit on 20-1-2013 by NarrowGate because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 20 2013 @ 06:11 PM
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Originally posted by AngryCymraeg

Originally posted by NarrowGate

Originally posted by AngryCymraeg
reply to post by NarrowGate
 


You seem to be remarkably certain in your beliefs.


Thank you. While my faith may appear to be great, it is in fact not at all. There is nothing remarkable about me. I am assuming by beliefs you meant faith.


Yes, that's the stuff. Tends to dissolve rapidly with the correct application of facts.


You just lied twice. What did I say about lieing?



posted on Jan, 20 2013 @ 06:20 PM
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Originally posted by NarrowGate
For clarity, you are saying that the Church recognizes Jehovah as a valid name of God and that it was not developed in the middle ages?


For clarity's sake read what the Vatican said above. I am not saying anything. The Vatican is.

You still never told us how to say or spell 'Jesus' without the letter 'J'.



posted on Jan, 20 2013 @ 06:26 PM
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Originally posted by NarrowGate
You just lied twice. What did I say about lieing?


You seem to be thrashing about a lot. Interesting.



posted on Jan, 20 2013 @ 08:13 PM
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Originally posted by AugustusMasonicus

Originally posted by NarrowGate
For clarity, you are saying that the Church recognizes Jehovah as a valid name of God and that it was not developed in the middle ages?


For clarity's sake read what the Vatican said above. I am not saying anything. The Vatican is.

You still never told us how to say or spell 'Jesus' without the letter 'J'.


Do you think I doubt my memory? No amount of childishness changes the fact that this conversation has become nearly useless because you literally do not apply logic - and on purpose I would assume.

You have been trying to make me doubt not only my memory, but my faith, since the beginning of our discussions.

You have failed.....

And wasted a lot of your time. I learned a whole lot though
. I am sure, since you are already familiar with Christianity and all *ahem*....that you learned nothing. Fun for me though. Surely, I am not the only one who took something from this. They should thank you for putting in the work.

ETA:
For the record the only time God has appeared as a man was when he came to Save us. Avatars are idol worship.....

No we should not condemn idol worshipers. As if that were a question. I hope someone realizes the wisdom in this logic....
edit on 20-1-2013 by NarrowGate because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 20 2013 @ 08:18 PM
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Originally posted by AngryCymraeg

Originally posted by NarrowGate
You just lied twice. What did I say about lieing?


You seem to be thrashing about a lot. Interesting.


And I am accused of not having a sense of humor. Interesting.



posted on Jan, 20 2013 @ 09:46 PM
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Originally posted by AngryCymraeg
By a strange coincidence I'm currently watching Father Ted again. Great show!


Feck!

Drink!
Classic stuff.


Fitz



posted on Jan, 20 2013 @ 10:58 PM
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reply to post by AngryCymraeg
 


By a strange coincidence your name translates to angrycmyrage, correct?

Are you familiar with the term legion? Or rage legion?

Do not be angry with your brother, for he who is angry with his brother will be in danger of hellfire.



posted on Jan, 21 2013 @ 06:13 AM
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Originally posted by NarrowGate
Do you think I doubt my memory?


No, I doubt your integrity.


No amount of childishness changes the fact that this conversation has become nearly useless because you literally do not apply logic - and on purpose I would assume.


Well, if you, as an admitted Catholic, do not take the Vatican as a reputable source then, short of Jesus coming to visit you personally and converse in Aramaic, what is any rational person to do?

Wait, I know. I can give you the Greek text from the Codex Sinaiticus, the oldest complete Bible in the world:


Matthew 1:1-2:5

1 βιβλοϲ γενεϲεωϲ ιυ χυ · ὑϊου δαδ ὑϊου αβρααμʼ

1 The book of the genealogy of Jesus Christ, the son of David, the son of Abraham.


So, how does the world's oldest Bible spell 'Jesus'? Need some help? Fine, I bolded it for you since we all know you have challenges with English, let alone Greek.

'Iuxu'. Does that look like 'Jesus'? Do you think you pronounce 'Iuxu' as 'Jesus'? Did the Greeks have the letter 'J' in the 3rd and 4th Century AD?

Start being honest and answer the questions truthfully.



posted on Jan, 21 2013 @ 06:48 AM
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Freemasons take that pseudepigraphical work "Testament of Solomon", very seriously...



posted on Jan, 21 2013 @ 10:02 AM
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reply to post by AugustusMasonicus
 


I doubt your integrity and I am waiting on audio.

Those letters are pronounced....wait for it.... "Jesus". Of course I am not greek, but i actually know a couple who stay up the road. I am going to ask them how to pronounce those letters.
edit on 21-1-2013 by NarrowGate because: (no reason given)


edit; here we go. AM I know you don't get this but letters are not pronounced the same in all languages...
edit on 21-1-2013 by NarrowGate because: (no reason given)


Also, even though His name has been pronounced different by different cultures (not always true, especially today) I have faith that His name is and always has been Jesus.
edit on 21-1-2013 by NarrowGate because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 21 2013 @ 10:29 AM
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Originally posted by NarrowGate
reply to post by AugustusMasonicus
 


I doubt your integrity and I am waiting on audio.

Those letters are pronounced....wait for it.... "Jesus". Of course I am not greek, but i actually know a couple who stay up the road. I am going to ask them how to pronounce those letters.
edit on 21-1-2013 by NarrowGate because: (no reason given)


edit; here we go. AM I know you don't get this but letters are not pronounced the same in all languages...
edit on 21-1-2013 by NarrowGate because: (no reason given)


Also, even though His name has been pronounced different by different cultures (not always true, especially today) I have faith that His name is and always has been Jesus.
edit on 21-1-2013 by NarrowGate because: (no reason given)


Aha! The scales are falling from his eyes.

So are you now saying that despite speaking in a language that had no "J'-sound equivalent, your dogged certainty is that His name was always pronounced with a hard "J"? Was this in anticipation of present-day global domination of the then-unknown English language in spite of the then-dominant Roman Empire?

Inquiring mind would love to know

Fitz





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