Evolution deniers are an insult to the deity they worship

Originally posted by SimonPeter
reply to post by luciddream

 

Abiogenesis is not going to cut it . Please give the link to the RNA developing under natural circumstances . DNA is a very complicated strand with many millions of parts . The single celled Amoeba has a DNA Structure more complicated than the human cell from what I read .

www.brooklyn.cuny.edu...

tch.ucsd.edu...

en.wikipedia.org...

www.stats.ox.ac.uk...

DNA and RNA are nucleic acids. Period. They obey the laws of chemistry. There is nothing special about them in terms of chemistry or physics.

Also, do not confuse the size of a genome with complexity--there is no correlation. Although there does seem to be a correlation between complexity and the number of genes. It's called a C-value.

Hell, an onion has four times the amount of DNA than we do. The longer a species has been around, the more time it has to accumulate "junk" or other random bits of DNA. And amoebas have been around a LOT longer than humans.

Originally posted by SimonPeter
reply to post by Zcustosmorum

 

You know this for certain ! And then when they hit the Earth and cause what wouldbe a life extinguishing event life starts ? Not likely !

Amino acids and the very elements we're made of have been found in the depths of space and in the gas clouds that are remnants of supernovae. They are part and parcel of the universe.

Originally posted by SimonPeter
reply to post by Zcustosmorum

 

You know this for certain ! And then when they hit the Earth and cause what wouldbe a life extinguishing event life starts ? Not likely !

Are you serious? We are made up of oxygen, carbon, hydrogen, nitrogen, calcium, and phosphorus, where do you think this stuff comes from? I'll give you clue, look at the stars

Originally posted by SimonPeter
reply to post by Barcs

 

There is no direct evidence of anything evolving . Similarity in species that died off does not prove evolution . And what did they evolve from ? How did that species get here on earth . How did DNA occur here on earth in a living cell . The building block of life .

No direct evidence of anything evolving? That completely 100% false. Boy you sure sound like a scientist or somebody who spends a lot of time researching scientific experiments.

www.talkorigins.org...

www.talkorigins.org...

en.wikipedia.org...

arstechnica.com...

www.wired.com...

en.wikipedia.org...

Start with that. If you have an issue with something there, cite it and explain why it's false and what evidence you have to back it up. STOP THE ATTACK ON SCIENCE!

I am a Christian and I mostly agree with you...

The debate is poorly defined by both sides...
...it is not evolution vs creationism but abiogenesis vs creationism.

The micro-evolutionary or adaptability of organisms is observable...
...the question is how biology started.

Originally posted by Barcs

Originally posted by SimonPeter
reply to post by Barcs

 

There is no direct evidence of anything evolving . Similarity in species that died off does not prove evolution . And what did they evolve from ? How did that species get here on earth . How did DNA occur here on earth in a living cell . The building block of life .

No direct evidence of anything evolving? That completely 100% false. Boy you sure sound like a scientist or somebody who spends a lot of time researching scientific experiments.

www.talkorigins.org...

www.talkorigins.org...

en.wikipedia.org...

arstechnica.com...

www.wired.com...

en.wikipedia.org...

Start with that. If you have an issue with something there, cite it and explain why it's false and what evidence you have to back it up. STOP THE ATTACK ON SCIENCE!

edit on 10-12-2012 by Barcs because: (no reason given)

I think the multicellular yeast speaks directly to the point. If you have a bunch of unicellular organisms in close proximity to each other, it's not much of a stretch for them to join forces and specialize and viola!, multicellularism! (I know, that's not a word...)

I'd just like to point out that until cyanobacteria figured out the trick of photosynthesis and there was enough O2 in the air, life forms simply couldn't get past anything more complex than single-celled. (Although there have been recent discoveries of multicellular organisms that are anaerobic.) O2--and mitochondria--allowed them to utilize more energy at less risk to themselves. Once organelles (such as plastids) evolved, it allowed life to become increasingly more complex.

reply to post by troubleshooter


You are one of the few who is not an Atheist that understand that on this site.

It should be Creationism VS Abiogenesis.

Religious pick on evolution like its the start of life, but in fact its Abiogenesis(which is a theory, that is hard to prove unless you have time machine).

Unlike how most religious believe, Evolution has many evidence it call it "just a theory"

Originally posted by SimonPeter
Remember DNA ! It doesn't grow on trees or rocks . Even scientist of today will not argue spontaneous life . DNA does not occur randomly nor does the living cell occur randomly . Now they must also exist together . Then the cell has to survive , feed , grow , have offspring , continue to exist and the same with their offspring . What are the chances ? Not likely without an extinction . What will it feed on ? Even old Carl Sagan could not project how this could be so he would throw a BILLION years in to give it possibility .reply to post by KrzYma

 

OK, than lets follow your argumentation... no physics, but WE ARE HERE!
Who is holding you to the ground ? God's thoughts I suppose?? this is what humans believed not so long time ago, also that the earth is flat, Wake up !@!
All you are doing is explaining all that you don't understand/know as God's power
I just tell you physics, chemistry space and time is all you need... call it God, but don't confuse this God with that gray haired man sitting in the clouds watching you, that was told to you since humans invented this superpower and gave it a name.
Look at other lifeforms on this beautiful planet, that exist way way longer then humans do by the way.
Somebody calculated once, if you compare the earths history to the height of the empire building, almost to the top stories there was nothing but simple cells, the dinosaurs is just one and a half floor and humans existence is just the thickens of the lack on the roof. Try to imagine this for a second !!!
Does this other creatures ever invented any kind of super force they worshiped???

ah this whole explanations I do is pointless.. like trying to teach a dog how to bind his shoes...

Originally posted by SimonPeter
reply to post by luciddream

 

Abiogenesis is not going to cut it . Please give the link to the RNA developing under natural circumstances . DNA is a very complicated strand with many millions of parts . The single celled Amoeba has a DNA Structure more complicated than the human cell from what I read .

Sure DNA is, but you just don't see this are just molecules, very complex to this time, sure, but all started with simple chemical reactions, like carbon and oxygen combines into carbon dioxide.
Call this God's power, I'm fine with that !! but please step back from a super mind that calculated and foreseen what it is doing. Thous forces that rules the universe are the cause of all that happened, and I'm sure not just here on earth but everywhere in universe. Life is nothing special !! it is everywhere! that's why we look for it on other planets and already have found some evidences of it in asteroids.

Originally posted by SimonPeter
reply to post by Zcustosmorum

 

You mean that thing that gets a thousand degrees when it enters the Atmosphere or a commet that also gets very hot and likely explodes in our atmosphere ?

do you have any knowledge of thermodynamics? I see you DON"T

no, I'm not going to explain this

Originally posted by SimonPeter
reply to post by Zcustosmorum

 

You know this for certain ! And then when they hit the Earth and cause what wouldbe a life extinguishing event life starts ? Not likely !

you really don't understand anything and your science is based on Discovery Channel I think...
look, even if a comet or asteroid hits the earth, and it cares some cells with it, not all of them will "die"!
if any complex life already exists on this planet, they may get extinguished, the environment changes because of this impact, but life will carry on, not exactly the same lifeforms but others.

Start with accepting the fact that all the iron in your blood comes from an exploded star, try to understand how universe works, no God said there will be iron, nuclear reactions did!

Originally posted by KrzYma

Originally posted by SimonPeter
reply to post by Zcustosmorum

 

You mean that thing that gets a thousand degrees when it enters the Atmosphere or a commet that also gets very hot and likely explodes in our atmosphere ?

do you have any knowledge of thermodynamics? I see you DON"T

no, I'm not going to explain this

Yep, unfortunately most people who come on here to attempt to disprove evolution have no knowledge whatsoever about anything related to science. They just repeat what they hear from a pastor or a creationist website/youtube blogger and take it as unquestionable truth. It's a shame really, and it's one of the big issues that plagues society today. Intellectual honesty is kind of important, especially if you are working in a field where what you learn and discover can affect everybody's security, technology and medicine.

reply to post by Barcs


agree !!
the problem of those people is the poor education they get in schools, the pseudo scientific MSM publications, fear to question what has been told to them..... and and and...

but this could be a new thread, I was thinking to start one, well... maybe some day, this is the true conspiracy in this world indeed

sounds like you put humans, feelings and yourself to a special position in this universe. btw. evolution is NOT survival of the fittest rather than quality of being accommodative

reply to post by KrzYma


I put self awareness above less conscious lifeforms in terms of having manual input into the direction of evolution. I don't imagine humans are at the top. We are all in the middle as it were - creation being infinite...

We are a product of our environment, sure enough, but the environment as we see it, is a product of group consciousness (mainly). We create the ideas of what things actually are, yet we are so limited.

To be on a higher level of consciousness is to self organise in more complex ways depending on your needs / wants.

I don't disagree with the scientific principals given here but my original 'religious' point of view is still much less constrained and more realistic.

Saying we are all just flukes, like the product of a billion monkeys and a billion typewriters is too idiotic for me, lol. How about, on their way to writing a classic novel they went through millions of stages of development, just as we already know everything to be ... and use that in your theory of evolution.

Originally posted by KrzYma

Originally posted by SimonPeter
reply to post by Zcustosmorum

 

You know this for certain ! And then when they hit the Earth and cause what wouldbe a life extinguishing event life starts ? Not likely !

you really don't understand anything and your science is based on Discovery Channel I think...
look, even if a comet or asteroid hits the earth, and it cares some cells with it, not all of them will "die"!
if any complex life already exists on this planet, they may get extinguished, the environment changes because of this impact, but life will carry on, not exactly the same lifeforms but others.

Start with accepting the fact that all the iron in your blood comes from an exploded star, try to understand how universe works, no God said there will be iron, nuclear reactions did!

This is actually a pro-scientific / materialist, anti-spiritual view, so you know.

It may be a product of brainwashing but what you call religion in this context, is actually absolute faithlessness. Moreover, if you have hard material provable facts v unprovable spiritualism, the creationist is on your side. This creationist view is why science is leading us in the wrong direction, making the wrong assumptions and fighting like they (science) are the most advanced religion, while stating the opposite... of course

reply to post by KrzYma

All you are doing is explaining all that you don't understand/know as God's power I just tell you physics, chemistry space and time is all you need...

Yes but you still can't explain "life". You never ever shall, especially while you lack any semblance of a scientifically provable concept of "who and what you are".

All you seem to be capable of is misdiagnosing religion and bringing up past mistakes from "scientists' who used religious dogma.

"Science" doesn't change much unfortunately.

Originally posted by bowtomonkey
reply to post by KrzYma

 

All you are doing is explaining all that you don't understand/know as God's power I just tell you physics, chemistry space and time is all you need...

Yes but you still can't explain "life". You never ever shall, especially while you lack any semblance of a scientifically provable concept of "who and what you are".

All you seem to be capable of is misdiagnosing religion and bringing up past mistakes from "scientists' who used religious dogma.

"Science" doesn't change much unfortunately.

we have very nice definition of LIFE
and also one of God

statements like "Science doesn't change" tells me all i need to know

...who and what I am
NO dude, here ends my patience...

Originally posted by randomname
adapting to an environment makes logical sense. God gave them that ability so they can survive and not go extinct.

it gets colder, an animal grows a thicker coat. it gets warmer, it sheds.

but even then, there's still evidence that every animal on earth was placed in its current location or face death.

for, example, you can't put a hippo in the arctic tundra. it'll die. and you can keep putting hippos in the arctic for the next billion years and the result will be the same. they'll die.

but according to evolutionists, they should grow shiny fur coats.

transforming from an ape into a human being is not adapting. it's changing species.

evolutionist conveniently ignore the crocodile paradox. according to them they claim they are 250 million years old and have remained unchanged.

then why aren't they warping around the universe and doing advanced mathematics.

instead they live in swamps, scavenging on rotten meat and getting killed by toothless hillbillies every week on the discovery channel.

did evolution take a holiday when it was the crocodiles turn. or did the crocodile say, you know what, i like to wallow in methane gas and rotten vegetables.

what an ignorant pile of cr@p.

Its making statements like those that give religious folks a bad name.

Athiests dont think you're stupid because you belive in god, I dont think you're stupid for beleiving in god....I think you're stupid for thinking that any of the above is correct.

And heres the kicker, it shouldnt matter whether evolution is real or not, it shouldnt have any bearing on your faith.

Originally posted by dusty1
reply to post by NavyDoc

 

I don't follow your point. What I am saying is that it is not against the Bible to think that God created and used a natural law such as evolution to get to humankind. God uses physics to keep the planets in orbit, yes?

The bible says that God created animals according to their kind.

If He didn't do that, then what the bible says is false.

Or incorrectly translated 1500yrs ago!

Saying we are all just flukes, like the product of a billion monkeys and a billion typewriters is too idiotic for me, lol. How about, on their way to writing a classic novel they went through millions of stages of development, just as we already know everything to be ... and use that in your theory of evolution.

Itsthetooth had a classic quote on here.

"Evolution is like 1000 tornadoes going through a junkyard and assembling a working 747."

Evolution isn't a big storm that poofs things into existence or making them suddenly change. Creatures usually do go through millions of stages of development before a new species comes about and that's very much what evolution is all about. No, we aren't flukes. We are survivors.