Survival Gardens

reply to post by grownshow


Yeah, I am probably crazy! It's the farm girl in me though that just doesn't see my garden as complete until there are corn stalks.
That's why I took a 3 year break from it too! It was just this last fall that Victory Seeds offered 'Orchard Baby' sweet corn, 5-10 germination and 65 days to harvest vs 'Golden Bantam' sweet corn 5-10 days germination, and 78 days to harvest.
This year for the beans, I am trading out my 'Kentucky Wonder' pole bean for 'Gross Brother's Vermont Cranberry' bush bean. They are supposed to like cooler growing conditions.

And Thanks! I never would have imagined I would be having such a nice garden conversation, in December, on ATS.

Here are a couple of links as well, most of it comes from books though!
Feel free to ask questions too, I will help out as much as I can!

Victory Seeds

ag.arizona.edu...

www.saveseeds.org...


The last link is from a seed saving trial done over the course of 10 years, pre-GMO technology

Originally posted by woodsmom
reply to post by new_here

 

You can grow your non GMO corn and get untainted viable seed if you isolate the plants. I am unaware of exact distances between crops, since nobody in their right mind grows corn in Alaska, but the info is out there.

If you live in an area that isn't highly agricultural, then you can probably work your crop so it only self-pollinates. As odd as this sounds, people may have better luck growing untainted corn in backyards and city gardens, because of the lack of pollen transfer.

There are alot of excellent seeds available for wonderful unmodified foods. Ask around too, grandma's and great aunt's may have come from the generations when saving seed was a yearly occurrence! Some of the strains that these companies are offering have been found treasure in someone's attic or basement.

I will go get my seed box out of the crawl space to share some of the varieties that I have tried and am going to try. You will have to forgive my inability to remember offhand, my mind is cluttered with who got their Christmas cards sent and have I done all my shopping! (no)

Hey thanks, I'd love to know what varieties you recommend.

reply to post by new_here


'Golden Bantam' is one of the first sweet corn varieties that people ate as a fresh veggie,developed in 1902, it was mostly feed and meal corn before that.

I have not tried it yet, but I have seed for 'Orchard Baby' developed around 1947, it may be on the fence for alteration. It is the youngest developed seed that I am willing to try myself.

reply to post by new_here



I live between a zone 6 and 7 and i have grown the following heirloom corn

Six Shooter corn
howling mob corn
golden bantam
black mexican
black aztec
Bloody Butcher

I live in a mountainous region and have rocky/crappy soil. All of those varieties have grown pretty easily for me except six shooter. It took forever to germinate and it did not live up to its description (six ears per stalk). Keep in mind NO heirloom corn will ever be as sweet as monsanto's mutant crap. We live in a high frutose fantasy land and for most people, the old timey stuff will have a slight taste of sweetness.

What you intend to do with your corn matters to. Is it entirely to be eaten fresh as sweet corn or do you intend to let it harden and make corn meal out of it in the fall? IMO, bloody butcher is one of the best all purpose corns for my soil type and climate which is what you would expect since it was an heirloom developed in my region during the civil war. You can eat it early before it turns red as a semi sweet corn and then make cornmeal out of what you don't eat fresh. I'm still eating cornbread made out of the bloody butcher i grew last summer.

I disliked golden bantam because the stalks were flimsy and it didn't stand up to our wind very well. The black aztec/mexican comes up quick and has a nice sweet taste if you eat it before it starts to turn black. The howling mob is a standard white heirloom sweet corn. It grows slowly though.

This summer i'm growing the following varieties:

Pencil Cob Corn
Bloody Butcher
Stowels evergreen
Blue Hopi
Howling Mob
Country Gentleman

Originally posted by woodsmom
reply to post by davjan4

 

I am currently using the square foot gardening method too. I have adapted it to my space as well. It is hard to find one method that is all encompassing. My broccoli works best with this method. I am able to plant 36 to 40 plants in a 2x4 ft area. That provides all my boys can eat and I managed to freeze 3-5 lbs this season ( I don't weigh it, I just fill up a bag). On the other hand, my cabbage hates it. I get nice firm, small heads every year, but AK is known for it's 700 plus pound cabbages. The sq ft method confines them too much to make the most of the season.

I am still trying to load your link, thanks!

WHAT!!

36 to 40 broccoli plants in a 2x4 area? These must be some sort of mini-broccoli.

I planted 1 broccoli in each square foot. They got so large I had to thin out half of them. They had 2" "trunks" and are literally 3 FEET TALL! Because they were so close together, and too much nitrogen, they did not produce. I just got a couple of pounds from everything.
Last year I planted them in a row with proper 18": spacing and I got a huge head off of each one and many weeks of side shoot type heads.

I think the Mittleider method has a lot of potential. At first I thought it to not be sustainable, but I just got 4 packs of the pre-mixed micro nutrients, and a 25lb bag of epsom salts. Once I get the 100lbs of 16-16-16 to mix, I'll have enough for several years of fertilizing. It will store forever, and you can stock up 10 years of the stuff in a small area.

This year I am adding 4 chickens for the eggs. To heck with the neighborhood association. There's about a million ducks wandering around our neighborhood, and they don't say anything about that, so I figure what can they say about chickens that I keep?
I did try keeping some of those ducks in my backyard. I lured some back there with bread. But that lasted about 3 hours before they flew away.
IF I every really get hungry, all I would really need to do is walk up behind one of those ducks and...

reply to post by davjan4


Nope, just a standard broccoli, di cicio (spelling?) I did not bring that one upstairs with me.
I pack them in, by the time they start florets the harvest begins

I continually harvest all summer long and the plants continue to produce. I will let a few plants grow good big heads but those are the one's the kids can't reach either! They graze on it all summer, 36 plants was my magic number to have some to harvest finally.

I do prune off some of the large leaves as they fill in too much. That helps them all get the sun they need, otherwise the middle plants would never make it.

My brussels sprouts can be packed in like the broccoli, it helps them too by encouraging them to grow up. I take their leaves almost completely away when the sprouts are starting to round out.

reply to post by grownshow
Well I have certainly come to the right thread! I was just 'not knowin' on the whole heirloom corn... thanks so much, guys!

I ventured into container gardening this year, about 20 buckets from a local bakery got it started. Ended up adding a raised bed by summer's end. My roma tomatoes did well and so did the cucumbers! Been getting seeds from a friend who is active in a seed trading site on fb. She has also shared greasy grit green beans with me. We will both be raising plants just to get them to go to seed, so the following year we might actually save enough to have decent yield. One of the things she swears by and I am testing is freezing the seed. She says she rarely has germination failure because it mimicks the wintering over some seeds require before the will germinate. So part of my saved seeds are stored boxed in cool darkness and some in the freezer. Will check back in the spring and let you know how it turns out for me. In KY here, green and red peppers, pimentos (which I dearly love), and jalepenos took off like wildfire!
All this gardening has led to dehydrating and waterbath and pressure canning. Pickles dill and bread and butters, cowboy candy sweet pickled jalepenos, jams from gleaned berries, made for a busy harvest season. And I am just getting started can't wait to see what happens next year. We have a small chest freezer but in winters here we can't trust the electricity not to go out on us. But the other option on some of those days is just take it outside, if its an ice storm and ambients aren't due to go over 28 degrees then I trust it in critter safe containers. Only had to do this a time or two, but saved loosing the whole lot. That's why I now have two dehydrators running right now with oranges and lemons, cause they gift so well with the mints I grew for teas.
One more thing....On the weekly ATS Survival show there is a gardening segment. Airs on Thursday nights. Look it up, informative and entertaining. It's about skills and knowledge building. Bushcraft on Fire is the show's sister website and has lots of videos and how to's. There's alot about learning the old ways our ancestors used. Tried and true with also a flare of new tools and materials and technology. Kind of a marrying of old and new.
I have saved seeds from flowering bushes, but missed getting the rosehhips to add to my teas. FYI the red bulbous formation after the rose fades is the hip. Just carefully remove the seed interior before drying, back in the day boys would use that for itching powder! But just thinking, can that seed be germinated too? I know we generally get roses from started root balls but just saying.

The two main problems i have with gardening is mold on squash/pumpkin plants and japanese beatles getting on corn silks. As mentioned earlier in the thread, i've read that skim milk will retard fungus on squash though i've never gotten a chance to try it.

If anyone has an organic way to keep beatles off corn silk and fungus off squash i'd like to hear it.

reply to post by grownshow


Skim milk might create favorable environment for fungus growth. A vinegar water spray would retard or kill fungus spores. Also a light soap water mix misted on plants for insect deterrent is effective.

Originally posted by SunflowerStar
reply to post by grownshow

 

Skim milk might create favorable environment for fungus growth. A vinegar water spray would retard or kill fungus spores. Also a light soap water mix misted on plants for insect deterrent is effective.

Several garden forums seem to swear by the milk method


davesgarden.com...

www.ehow.com...

Then again I'm sure i can find some forum on the internet where a poster says darth vader traveled back in time to kidinap the lindbergh baby. That's why i'd be interested to know if someone has personal experience using it.

Regarding soap, have you tried it before on corn silk? I assume you would use natural oil based soap as opposed to something like dial.

I would be very hesitant to use vinegar on any plant even with it watered down. Vinegar is a well known herbicide and i've used it many times to kill unwanted weeds along fence rows.

Thanks for this thread, it is important knowledge, but also knowledge that takes time to fully understand. You chose a very broad topic with "survival gardens", but I suppose that is what it is, if you're living off of it =D

Around these mountainous parts, where there is no freeze, the most common things planted here nearly year-round are (varieties of each):
- Cabbage
- Peanuts
- Bok choy / chinese cabbage
- Sweet potatoes and potatoes
- Chayote
- Corn
- Green beans
- Squash
- Carrots
- Taro root
- Rice
- Many many many other seasonal things

I have never heard the 3 sisters term here, but it's common here to see corn planted in rows with green beans using the cornstalks as the "sticks" for the beans to climb on. Sometimes squash will be planted in between, but I see peanuts used more often as ground cover than squash, maybe because a heavy squash could break the corn down... but not sure, I'll have to ask =)

Originally posted by grownshow

Originally posted by woodsmom
reply to post by grownshow

Edit: Have you ever tried direct planting corn? I've never heard of anyone attempting to transplant corn and its generally discouraged to start heirloom corn indoors.