You have to ask yourself, why THIS video outraged Rush Limbaugh

reply to post by onthedownlow


I don't think you can call outlining what has happened to us as a country for the past 30 years political ideology.

Originally posted by 11235813213455
reply to post by openminded2011

 

The taker class is growing while the maker class is shrinking.

This fairy tale is amazing. When you breed people like animals you have to expect nature to take its course.

The "makers":

Made America weak by selling her to the world bankers.
Made a non-sustainable ecology for short-term gains.
Made this problem by installing the consumer programming into the mind of this nation. Frankenstein's monster comes for them now.
Made a government that does their biding with legislature and military force.
Made other nations into wanna be Americas and now those nations also want their fair share.


The makers will reap what they have sown.

Originally posted by 11235813213455
reply to post by openminded2011

 

Why wouldn't it upset him? The taker class is growing while the maker class is shrinking. Asking those that already give more than their fair share to give to those that are giving nothing is just a slap in the face.

Just what IS the maker class and why do you consider them makers, please be very specific.

Originally posted by 11235813213455
reply to post by openminded2011

 

Why wouldn't it upset him? The taker class is growing while the maker class is shrinking. Asking those that already give more than their fair share to give to those that are giving nothing is just a slap in the face.

I would like to know what fantasy world that is happening in. I understand you buy into whatever some talking head tells you but, you could if you really cared do the research and from plenty of non partisan sources and get a closer idea of what is really going on. Just a hint the gap between the rich and everybody else is at and all time high and they are pay the lowest amount of taxes in history.

Good post s&f. It truly is sad that the very people who have stolen the nation's wealth from us are being defended like they've done nothing wrong by the very people they screwed over. Also how can anyone still believe that trickle down economics actually works?

reply to post by Hefficide


It doesn't make any sense to raise taxes on those who create jobs...

No one wants to address the real issue =

SPENDING.

, welfare and food stamps are out of control.

This is not a revenue issue, it's a spending issue. Liberals are pushing their same old agenda = Tax & Spend.

The problem with Socialism is that eventually you run out of other people's money. - Margaret Thatcher

reply to post by Signals


When I was young what is now called "Job creation" was called "A company is forced to hire somebody", the reason was invariably "because they have too much work"

Originally posted by Hefficide
To me the saddest part of it all is that the propaganda in this argument has allowed the right to convince the middle class and small business owners that they are the ones under attack. Those with billions are now wearing the middle class like a bullet proof vest - or a suicide bomb, take your choice.

The old saying about always being able to hire half of the poor to kill the other half is so clearly visible here. The rhetoric has most people who are barely hanging on, firmly of the belief that it's those beneath them who are dragging them down - and not that those above them are actually standing on top of all of us.

One of the truest things I've ever seen on these boards. I can only speak about Britain, but the majority of the media here is right wing and all I ever see is right wing spin. In fact, I've literally had to get up to turn off London Broadcasting Company (the only large-scale talk format show I can pick up on my radio) because, for about the 4th time today, they're doing a feature on 'benefit scroungers'.

We don't call it the American Dream in Britain, we call it 'aspiration'. This idea that if people really want to succeed, they will do; that if they just work hard enough, it will happen. When it doesn't happen, the fingers are pointing to the unemployed and the disabled. Benefit fraud is a real problem that's dragging the country to its knees, apparently, despite the fact that tax fraud dwarfs it by multiples. The real problem with unemployment is that people don't want to work, apparently, not that even the government's best statistics show there's only one job available for every four people, and that job is likely to be temporary, zero hour or part-time.

Maybe the middle classes would rather believe all this than the reality: the system, the whole kit and caboodle, that train they think is going to come in one day for them, has actually gone off the rails.

Originally posted by onthedownlow
reply to post by openminded2011

 

This socialist propaganda seems to be aimed at children, that seems to be the problem. Political indoctrination should never be geared towards children, and it definitely should not be taught in our schools.

www.conservativechildrensbooks.com...

Yup, I agree. Political indoctrination should not be forced at a young age..

Originally posted by clay2 baraka

Originally posted by onthedownlow
reply to post by openminded2011

 

This socialist propaganda seems to be aimed at children, that seems to be the problem. Political indoctrination should never be geared towards children, and it definitely should not be taught in our schools.

www.conservativechildrensbooks.com...

Yup, I agree. Political indoctrination should not be forced at a young age..

Thats laughable, you post a site dedicated to conservative childrens books.........ill do you one better for far left indoctrination......

Public school system.........and just about every college across the United States........

Hows that for indoctrination just look at the last election.......

But thats all besides the point...........I do not agree with this administrations and the ideology of Tax and spend........its unsustainable.......

But we dont have to wait to see this..........its GOING to happen, those that agree with it are going to get their way this time around........

I guess we will see how well it works..........

Lots of conspiracy theorist out there talk about the one world gov and the big agenda to break the world of her currencies in order to implement a one world currency so that all countries are on the level........

Yet they cannot see that this is clearly a plan to do just that, bring America down, break her back and break her dollar and destroy it, in order to make it apart of a single monetary system.......

I honestly believe this is whats going on.......this administration and people in gov who are pushing this, want this.......

They dont want to save us from any cliff, they dont want to raise America back up..........they want us broken so that we submit.........

They have failed at every turn to hold the FED accountable, infact they have gone even more into the pocket of the fed and allowed them to monotize the debt, which the fed swore they wouldnt do, they have ALLOWED them to do whatever they want despite the out cry from the people to hold them accountable........

Its as plain as day whats going on here

Mark my words, this policy thats being implemented ......WILL NOT HELP THE US, it will not help us prosper economically.......

Talk is cheap anymore, you will see when its implemented........

reply to post by Signals


That rhetoric - job creators? It's so patently false and misleading. It's absolute double speak. That phrasing seems to suggest that the owners of companies are doing us a favor by allowing us to work for them.

It's just as true to say that the working class are the wealth creators. Without a labor force no "job creator" is going to get get rich. For some reason, or another, the conservative agenda has been tweeked to ignore the symbiosis inherent in commerce and focus upon only one aspect of it.

Besides, for the last 32 years we have been kissing the backsides of the "job creators" and they've created tons of jobs in Thailand, China, and India - while leaving many US cities virtual post apocalyptic nightmare realms - where only minimum wage service industry jobs survive. I keep hearing the regurgitation of this bizarre mantra endlessly. Job creators... Where are these jobs they create and why are we currently so beholden and enslaved to their whims?

My best guess? Because Fox news tells us to be.

We have record unemployment. The highest cost of living in memory. Fewer people own their own homes now than in years past. And, yet, some still want to insist that the policies of the past 30 years are sound and treat those policies, quite literally, like a religion. Guns, Jesus, and Bush era tax cuts. The NEW holy trinity. The God of the United States.

This irrational approach to the problem never ceases to make my mind twitch. We, literally, have a large segment of the population who blame the poor for having too much, and live only to make sure that their rich masters get more and more and more and more and more and more.

When Reagan took office, there were less than 600,000 people with a net worth ( excluding their primary home and business value ) of more than a million dollars. Now there are roughly 3,100,000 in that bracket. A 500% increase in the number of rich people. During that same time period our economy has tanked, our infrastructure has crumbled, and our nation has fallen from #1 in just about every category to being towards the bottom of the list in most "living standards" qualifications.

Yup. Those job creators. God bless them. They are doing a bang-up job.

~Heff

Originally posted by Signals
reply to post by Hefficide

 

It doesn't make any sense to raise taxes on those who create jobs...

No one wants to address the real issue =

SPENDING.

, welfare and food stamps are out of control.

This is not a revenue issue, it's a spending issue. Liberals are pushing their same old agenda = Tax & Spend.

The problem with Socialism is that eventually you run out of other people's money. - Margaret Thatcher

I'm only replying to this because you're quoting Thatcher. Unfortunately, for Britain, Thatcher was the problem. Britain's welfare bill is spiralling. Why?

Firstly, a massive chunk of the welfare bill is on 'housing benefit'. Thatcher basically kicked started a housing bubble that is making housing unaffordable for most people. The massive house building programme after WWII was ostensibly council housing. It solved three problems: created employment and rebuilt lots of bombed towns which had often been run down houses built in the 1800s. Thatcher thought it was a good idea to convince the working classes to buy these council properties. Of course they couldn't actually afford them at market rates, even then, so she sold them off at knock down prices. Sounds good so far? The string was that the local councils couldn't build any new houses to replace the ones bought as she wanted the private market to do the building. Which meant that ever since, there's been less and less council (now 'social') housing available.

During the early and mid 1990s, (the Tories are still in at this point) the credit bubble appeared. This hid the council/social housing problem by allowing people who really couldn't afford to buy private housing any other way (and don't forget, there's a shortage of council/social rentings at this point) to buy privately built housing through crazy credit schemes. Lot's of greedy people suddenly awoke to this housing problem and the 'buy to let' mini-landlord bubble started - encouraged by wall-to-wall television programmes encouraging the already comfortable to get even more comfortable by exploiting the housing crisis of low earners.

By 2012 we're in the situation where more people in work are now claiming housing benefit because they can't afford private rents or even social landlord rents (as most social housing is now run by social housing authorities). Worse still, the current Tory-lead government has decided to pitch all social housing rents at 80% the private rent market, which is artificially driving up the rental cost of these kinds of properties. The only people gaining here are landlords - incidentally, many politicians have property portfolios.

Another conservative scheme that Thatcher was keen on was the privatisation of 'national' utilities. Basically she helped sell off our previously state-owned gas energy, electricity, telecommunications, water and railway. We were told that market competition would drive our bills down and that costly future reinvestments/maintenance would be borne by the private firms. The opposite actually happened and, in the case of the railways, the state/taxpayer are spending more money propping-up private railway companies (who keep massive profits - we have some of the most expensive railway fares in the world) than we did when they were state run. Fuel poverty is a serious issue now in this country. These sell offs were useful for Thatcher at the time though as, typically, Tories like to sell off the family silver for when they get their budget sums wrong. The current government have just sold our TV/radio frequencies for the 4G mobile network in a similar kind of deal.

Because the cost of all these essentials (water, gas, electric) has rocketed, just like housing benefit above, this has to be reflected in the welfare benefits or people would be living in shanty towns in a country known for its cold and rain.

In the meantime, like America, but possibly more so, we've seen all our manufacturing go abroad, all our IT, lots of call centres, lots of administrative work and the like all just disappear. All the traditional lower income and working class jobs have just vanished in 30 years and much of it beginning under Thatcher. What jobs are left for these people are so poorly paid now, that their incomes are so low that they have to be topped-up by 'working tax credits': another part of the welfare bill.

If short-term greed and profit wasn't such an issue for Thatcher and her big business friends, there would still be proper jobs for people to actually do instead of claim benefit and affordable housing to live in.

reply to post by openminded2011


"It's a Big Club and you ain't in it! You and I are not in the Big Club."

George Carlin ~ The American Dream

Originally posted by Signals
reply to post by Hefficide

 

It doesn't make any sense to raise taxes on those who create jobs...

No one wants to address the real issue =

SPENDING.

, welfare and food stamps are out of control.

This is not a revenue issue, it's a spending issue. Liberals are pushing their same old agenda = Tax & Spend.

The problem with Socialism is that eventually you run out of other people's money. - Margaret Thatcher

if spending is the problem,
then massive spending cuts (austerity) would have made greece the most wealthy country on earth.
they have cut spending and all it has done is caused a second downturn.

the medicine you prescribe will kill the patient, and make the doctor even richer.

can you explain why during ten years of war the tax rates on the wealthy have dropped,
when in times past the rich acually paid more taxes to support the war effort.

are the rich no longer patriots?
the 70% top tax rate during the war was for COUNTRY,
not 15% for SELF

if you love war so much why is it that you expect the poor to fight AND PAY for these wars.

if corps and the rich PAYED WHAT THEY HAVE IN THE PAST THERE WOULD BE NO DEFICIT

trickle down has had 30 years to work,
there is no evidence i have seen that proves sending money to the cayman islands helps anyone get jobs,
except maby banks in the caymans.

the job creators are the middle class,
the consumers are the middle class
the money the rich hoard in tax havens, will not create jobs

xploder

reply to post by Hefficide


In your opinion then, the poor create jobs, start small businesses, grow wealth?

Originally posted by Signals
reply to post by Hefficide

 

In your opinion then, the poor create jobs, start small businesses, grow wealth?

Nobody "creates" jobs.
Business sometimes have so much work (Because of customers demanding services or goods) that they are forced to hire somebody (Something nobody in their right mind would want to do out of their free will, but sometimes you just can't ask for another hour of uncompensated overtime, no matter how bad the jobmarket)

Rush is mad because all of a sudden, someone pointed out how we are all equals;
I owe you my survival, you owe me yours.

Seems twisted to think such a thing...as economics being tantamount to our survival, doesn't it?

Is there a compromising medium?

Originally posted by Signals
reply to post by Hefficide

 

In your opinion then, the poor create jobs, start small businesses, grow wealth?

Actually, most folks are employed by small businesses, more than 50% of the population. Small business owners have been reported to earn anywhere between $25,000 to $250,00 a year:
goodcreditscore.dnb.com...

The bulk of job creators in this country fall into the income brackets of middle and upper middle class people.

As for the wealthy, there's little evidence to show that cutting taxes for them will cause them to create more jobs and trickle down wealth. To start, the idea that tax cuts will motivate the wealthy to hire more people in an economic slump is ludicrous, we've seen billions in tax cuts go to the wealthy over the last 30 years and all this has done is created a larger economic disparity between the classes. What good are tax cuts going to do to wealthy people who would much prefer to horde money and invest it?

Originally posted by Signals
reply to post by Hefficide

 

In your opinion then, the poor create jobs, start small businesses, grow wealth?

Consumer demand creates jobs. Fulfillment of that demand generates wealth. A balance of distribution of that wealth ensures that the machine continues to function.

It is not complicated. Tie a noose around the neck and the body dies, but so does the head. The head cannot live without the body.

Directly speaking - the poor not only start businesses ( think the person who mows your lawn, details your car, babysits your kids, trims your tree branches is a 1%'er? ) but they also make up the consumer base. They are the body that the head cannot live long without.

We've reached this point where the guy from McDonalds works so that he can eat at Taco Bell. And the guy at Taco Bell works just to have enough to eat at McDonalds. If they're frugal then the might have enough to visit Wal Mart so that the cashier there can eat too.

All that aside, however, I reiterate my prior question.

Why are we worshiping these all mighty job creators when they are not creating jobs?

~Heff

reply to post by ldyserenity

Taker class? The real taker class IS the wealthy, taking the money right out of OUR country and reinvesting it off the shores of the Caymen Islands.

This sentence explains a lot of the crazy left thinking. They simply don't understand how things work. How do you invest in the Cayman islands? You mean all the rich people store their money in the Cayman islands? Do they go visit it and roll around in it? Maybe a "cash bath." Boy the rich sure are dumb. You have to wonder how they made money in the first place? Probably taking it from poor people, since poor people have all that money to take right?


V