Where does the idea that Freemasons worship Lucifer come from??

reply to post by pepsi78


Hi Pepsi 78

It seems you are a tad confused about the idea of Baphomet (Sophia / Wisdom) and the Freemasons and their 33rd Degree which impinges upon the use of the term and the image of Baphomet in the rite...

Again, the term BAPHOMET (‘wisdom’) is a reverse Gematrial ATBASH cipher for SOPHIA (and is often represented as a horned goat with a pentagram on its forehead and hooves – thereby giving mediaeval imagination to the idea of an antichristian Devil picture…but obscuring the idea of it being a Solar Creative Fertility Deity not unlike the hooved god Pan (Gk. For ‘Nature’ or, lit. ‘The All’)

Here is the Mishphar AtBash Hebrew Letters which show that Baphomet is Sophia- with the letters ‘reversed’ i.e. going from Aleph to Tav making them 'Tav to Aleph' and also reversing their values too

'Aleph = Tav = 400
Beth = Shin = 300
Gimmel = Resh = 200
Daled = Quph = 100
He = Tsadeh = 90
Vav = Phe = 80
Tzayin = 'Qayin = 70
Chet = Samek = 60
Tet = Nun = 50
Yod = Mem = 40
Kaph = Lamed = 30
Lamed = Kaph = 20
Mem = Yod = 10
Nun = Mem = 9
Samek = Chet = 8
'Qayin = Zayin = 7
Phe = Vav = 6
Tsadeh = He = 5
Quph = Daled = 4
Resh = Gimmel = 3
Shin-Sin = Beth = 2
Tav = 'Aleph = 1

Thus: S-V-Ph-Y-A (Samek – Vav – Phe – Tod – Aleph) (=SOPHIA ‘wisdom’ or ‘understanding’)

= B-P-V-M-T (Beth – Phe – Vav – Mem – Tav) (=BAPHOMET)

Where here the Hebrew letter Vav is (traditionally) used for the long O vowel. (it can be used for the vowel U as well..)


Here is a quote from Manly P. Hall regarding BAPHOMET (which he equates with the Bringer of the Light i.e. the sun god, i.e. LUCI-FER (lit. ‘bearer of the Lux, or Light’) , which is the same Title that used also for ‘Jesus’ in the so-called Book of Revelation, aka the Apocalypse of Yohanon the Levite (see Rev. 22:16 and 2:28) and in the anonymous Greek Epistle of 2nd ‘Peter’ 1:19)

"The Day has come when every Fellow Craftsman of Freemasonry must know and apply their Secret Wisdom.

The lost Key to their grade is the total Mastery of Emotion, which places the energy of the Universe at their unlimited disposal.

Man can only expect to be entrusted with great power by proving his ability to use it constructively and selflessly. When the Mason learns that the key to the warrior on the block is the proper application of the dynamo of living power, he has learned the mystery of his CRAFT.

The seething energies of BAPHOMET are in his hands, and before he may step onward and upward, he must prove his ability to properly apply the Energy of the Light Bringer himself, even LUCIFER.

He must follow in the footsteps of his forefather, Tubal-Cain, who with the mighty strength of the Warrior god hammered his sword into a plowshare."

--Manly P. Hall, 33rd Degree Mason, K.T., The Lost Keys of Freemasonry or The Secret of Hiram Abiff

It is interesting that the title LUCIFER is generally now attributed to the bad-god or devil of the Christians, as opposed to its original title of ‘bringer of the light’ represented often by either the SUN or by the planet VENUS which planet appears at its brightest often just before sunrise, thereby drawing the sun or light in its train…

‘Illumination’ (i.e. being illuminated by Gnosis or Sophia or Wisdom etc.) was a tenet of the Ancient Mystery religions e.g. the ‘Mysteries of Attis & Kubaba’ or the ‘Mysteries of Persephone & Kora’ (i.e. the Eleusian Mysteries) or the ‘Mysteries of Wusir & Hapi (or, Osiris & Apis aka Serapis) or the Mysteries of Aset & Wusir’ (Isis & Osiris) or the Mysteries of Dionysius or the ‘Mysteries of Zeus Pater’ (i.e. Jupiter) or the Mysteries of Orpheus or the ‘Mysteries of Mithras’ or the ‘Mysteries of Christ’ even…

I am not sure you are understanding any of this basic connexion between the Masonic BAPHOMET Goat Image with its 33rd Degree Ritual & the idea of 'Illumination' connected with SOPHIA ('wisdom' or 'arcane knowledge') from what you wrote just now…

Let me know if you need any more clarification about these links between them - and there are plenty of them to share on this thread if you really want to see them !

reply to post by pepsi78

So you think that an organization that was founded around 1118 founded an organization that may have possibly started in 926 AD? You believe something historians cannot prove?

reply to post by pepsi78

Our Templar rituals are to commemorate the values of the Templars.

reply to post by pepsi78

Being a history nerd, I wouldn't mind being from that Order. I wish it were so, but there is no real evidence. There are far too many gaps of knowlegde, and too many take rumor and myth for truth. Robert Cooper has published some excellent work on the subject, particularly about Rosslyn.

reply to post by pepsi78

As I sad and as it has been said, allegory and commemoration is not historical evidence. I'm doing research on early Templary rituals, so far nothing you say holds any merit to history.

A common problem is that anti-Masons is that not only do they see black and white, but they take everything face value, you judge books by their covers.

reply to post by pepsi78

Other than the name there is no connection. Fact.

reply to post by Agape

Another example of blind ignorance and arrogance. I love because we disagree with your assault on Freemasonry that we're automatically "low level". If only the "high levels" know then how do you know? If we base this argument of logic, reason, and common sense, then in the line of knowledge you would know much less than "low level" Masons. You guys think yourself so clever that you think you have some knowledge of how Freemasonry works when you don't. Your views are skewed and misguided.

"lucifer" means different things to different people. To many christians lucifer is the emperor of hell, the anointed cherub who fell from grace, the prodigal son etc. depending on what exegesis used on what biblical verse.

The qualitative emotional factor identified with lucifer is Pride.

Others view lucifer as the missing Female half of the creative equation.

lucifer the word may have been coined by the early church father Jerome in reference to Venus the morning star.

As for mastering one's emotions I HAVE accomplished this to a high degree although i am not a freemason but I can fathom Righteous Pride and Self Mastery. Still I can tell you this has not made me into a deity.

We humans are frail, barely sane, self destructive, hardly exalted animals and all we can do is Lie.
All of our institutions, beliefs, and sciences are perverted by our selves. We can only perceive a very small band of the massive wavelengths that make up the multiverses. We are not gods and most likely will never accomplish anything except an illusion of gods.

There: the great secret revealed.

Hi Pepsi 78

It seems you are a tad confused about the idea of Baphomet (Sophia / Wisdom) and the Freemasons and their 33rd Degree which impinges upon the use of the term and the image of Baphomet in the rite...

I am not confused about anything.

It is interesting that the title LUCIFER is generally now attributed to the bad-god or devil of the Christians, as opposed to its original title of ‘bringer of the light’ represented often by either the SUN or by the planet VENUS which planet appears at its brightest often just before sunrise, thereby drawing the sun or light in its train…

I can't see how Baphomet can be good, the goat is the big bad wolf, "the same" you should study mithology, and about Venus(same o) what the word "I am coming means", You adore darkness ? Study Latin , mythology, see what Friday means.

She is Venus in Saturn, she kills her sons then morns like a hooker over them, she is the hooker were told about, the mother of harlots. The control freak controling everything, she is the collective.
Behind her is King Saturn (Satan) How can the dark goat be a good thing, you people lost your mind.
She is he Satan, the feminised man, it's a she male, a man.

Let me know if you need any more clarification about these links between them - and there are plenty of them to share on this thread if you really want to see them !

What clarification do I need for Satan ?

reply to post by KSigMason

Everything that you posted has been explained in the thread over and over.
I have told you, I think masonry is a satanic organisation.

Our Templar rituals are to commemorate the values of the Templars.

Yes, you comemorate them because you adore them, they are also part of your symbols and your rituals.

Originally posted by pepsi78
I am not confused about anything.

Study Latin...

The sweet, sweet irony.

Angels on the sidelines again,
Benched along with patience and reason.
Angels on the sidelines again,
Wondering when this tug of war will end...

reply to post by AugustusMasonicus

we are off topic, and it is not ironic, I don't see how it is.

Originally posted by pepsi78
You are off topic, and it is not ironic.

I think it is extremely ON topic when you admonish others to educate themselves in something that you yourself have failed to learn (Latin) and is consequently germain to current discussions. This also makes it extremely ironic.

Edit to add: It is also extremely hypocritical.

Originally posted by AugustusMasonicus

Originally posted by pepsi78
You are off topic, and it is not ironic.

I think it is extremely ON topic when you admonish others to educate themselves in something that you yourself have failed to learn (Latin) and is consequently germain to current discussions. This also makes it extremely ironic.

Edit to add: It is also extremely hypocritical.

edit on 7-7-2011 by AugustusMasonicus because: Networkdude has no beer.

On the contrary I showed you in other threads how things are for Latin, and what the connections imply to the words.

Originally posted by pepsi78
On the contrary I showed you in other threads how things are for Latin, and what the connections imply to the words.

As I recall your final post was that it was your 'opinion' and that you did not want to discuss the matter further. Shall I dig up your post for you? Latin is not your strong suit, do not create another hole for yourself by pretending you have anything but a ting grasp on it and you should not be admonishing others to study it when you yourself have failed to heed your own advice.

As I recall your final post was that it was your 'opinion' and that you did not want to discuss the matter further.
[/quite]
Not because I was wrong, but because it was getting boring with you repeating the same non sense.

Latin is not your strong suit, do not create another hole for yourself by pretending you have anything but a ting grasp on it and you should not be admonishing others to study it when you yourself have failed to heed your own advice.

Latin is a strong suit of mine and that is just your interpretation.

Originally posted by pepsi78
Latin is a strong suit of mine and that is just your interpretation.

Sure. Particularly when you used Star Trek, The Lord of the Rings and J.J. Abrams to support your point. All Latin scholars use them as source material. Reopen the thread if you feel froggy.

Sure. Particularly when you used Star Trek, The Lord of the Rings and J.J. Abrams to support your point.

Those things were in context, as I told you the movie industry is part of the occult, I used solid sources as dictionaries and other relevant sources.

Originally posted by pepsi78
Those things were in context, as I told you the movie industry is part of the occult, I used solid sources as dictionaries and other relevant sources.

Fictional cinematic endeavors and their directors are NEVER in context when one is attempting to learn Latin, nor or they a 'solid source'. I would never be that delusional to think otherwise.

reply to post by AugustusMasonicus

Those were in context, besides those of course there are other sources.

Originally posted by pepsi78
Those were in context..

Fictional movies are NEVER in context when one is learining or explaining Latin. Are you going to start using the Smurfs to explain calculus next? They were only in context for you because of your inability to grasp the subject at hand. If you feel otherwise feel free to reopen the thread and explain to everyone how Captain Kirk taught you Latin.

reply to post by AugustusMasonicus


Among those, were sources from dictionaries and other valid sources among them ancient Latin writers and writings that said the same thing,

reply to post by pepsi78

It may have been posted, but you haven't proven anything. You may THINK Masonry isn't satanic, but you haven't PROVEN it.

Commemoration and adoration is not historical connection.

reply to post by KSigMason

It is proven along the recent threads, anyone who reads them with a sane mind will come to the same understanding, that masonry is satanic.