Originally posted by defcon5
Quite hostile, arenít we, what did I touch a nerve,
Nope. Just sick of the silly nonsense spread about Masons.
Well, sorry to say, there must not be many good masons out there, because I have been ASKED to join no less then 5 times in my life.
Must have been by guys who joined for the wrong reasons...or simply weren't paying attention.
You are correct, it was DeMolay, which is a Masonic organization, if not an actual mason. My point in the story was that this was where my interaction
with the masons, at any level, began.
That's fine. But again, DeMolay isn't Masonry.
Straight from the mouth of my church, and get off the spelling, see how good you spell after a 12 hour night shift, Also I use a spell checker that
occasionally tends to change what it is that I have typed on its own.
You say later it's the Lutheran Church. I've heard quite a bit of Anti-Masonry from various branches of the Lutheran Church. Missouri Synod
Lutherans in particular so I'm not surprised. Interestinly the District Deputy Grand Master of our District is a member of the Lutheran Church
here in town.
Next several quotes nothing but insults and not worth answeringÖ
Aw...I'm SO sorry that I struck a nerve...
ďGod doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil.Ē Genesis 3: 5 King
James Version, The Bible and King Solomonís Temple In Masonry By John Wesley Kelchner, Illustrated, 1924, 1925, 1929, 1930, 1940 by A.J. Holman and
My Grandfathers Bible.
Please note the difference in God and, ďas gods.Ē
Uhm...OK. So what?
Funny it is the symbol to the Order of the Eastern Star, by your own admission a club for masons and their wives.
Yep. A SYMBOL. SYMBOL. Not worshipped and not symbolizing Satanism. It CAN symbolize Satanism, but it doesn't in this case. Life is FULL of
symbols. One has to see beyond the symbol itself to the thing that is symbolized and remember that a symbol can symbolize different things to
different people. The Cross is a good example. It can symbolize Christianity. It can symbolize first aid (the Red Cross for example...or an
Funny I have seen a picture of him wearing one, I will get it to you later after I get back up.
If you did, it's a fake. Pure and simple. There are plenty of pictures of Pike in his Scottish Rite regalia, but none have him wearing (as you say)
BLAZING you say, kind luminous?
BLAZING I say. On fire.
Yep, too bad they hung it upside down, EH?
Yes we are all aware that when children drawn simplistic stars in the sky of a picture they do it with the point facing the ground, or maybe children
are just smarter then you, and draw them UPRIGHTÖ
Uhm. Who defines whether it's upside down or not? Is a triangle with a point down still a triangle? Or is it an upside down triangle? Is a
square standing on one corner and not sitting on a flat side still a square? Would it be sideways then? What about an ellipse? Should the long side
be horizontal or the short one? Oh, and I wasn't pointing out your spelling errors. We all are guilty of those. I'm pointing out grammar
errors because they drive me crazy. You say "maybe children are smarter THEN you" That isn't a spelling error. The word is THAN. Smarter THAN
you. Not THEN. If you want to sound intelligent, try to write that way.
Bethlehem is not spelled right.
Mea culpa! (See above)
Actually it only says the serpent, I will check in the psudopigraphial books later, and get back with you.
Forgive my ignorance. What are the "psudopigraphial" books? That word isn't in the Oxford English Dictionary...nor anything close to it. Do you
mean perhaps the Deuterocanonical books?
He is not even significant enough in the Bible to get more then a line, why is he significant to you at all?
He plays an important part in Masonic ceremony. What difference would it make how much stage-time he got in the Bible? Masonry isn't religion. It
does draw some (SOME) of it's ceremonies from Biblical stories and characters, but not all.
Zany is spelled incorrectly
Nope. There are several spellings.
From the Oxford English Dictionary.
Zany: Also 6-7 zani, zanie, 7 zane, zanee, zanni, (pl. zaneese), 8 zaney.
B. attrib. passing into adj. a. attrib. That is a zany, or characteristic of a zany; imitative; clownish; foolish, idiotic. b. adj. Comically
idiotic, crazily ridiculous.
The adjectival use of the word (as if an adj. formed with -Y1) is now the dominant one. In quot. 1938, Ďsimple-mindedí (cf. sense 2d).
ďThe final painting (page 8) illustrates the symbolic death and rebirth that candidates experience at later stages of initiationĒ Mysteries of the
Unknown, Ancient Wisdom and Secret Sects, Page 8, Time Life Books.
Oh. Excellent news. Time Life Books are an authority on Masonry! I wasn't aware of their Masonic stature. I have that set. Pretty interesting.
On page 9 (opposite the picture you reference) they mention the "ritual death and rebirth" of this degree (the Master Mason) Interestingly, Masonic
ritual, at the death of the Builder, specifically says his body will be borne to the Temple for more decent interment. Having grown up in the
funeral business I happen to know interment means "burial" Sounds to me like he's still dead. But wait, I'm referring to legitimate Masonic
ritual. I forgot I'm supposed to believe Time Life Books.
Actually I am a Lutheran, not a Fundamentalist. True they do not use the term, ďBorn AgainĒ, but that does not mean that I do not know what this term
implies, and as such shy away from any organization that is going to make me reenact such an event.
Well, as I've said, we DON'T re-enact being born again. We don't ACT being born again. But please shy away from us anyway.
Originally posted by senrak
Probably the silliest statement you've made. 32nd, 33rd, etc. etc. have nothing to do with anyone "running the whole organization" There is no
centralized Masonic Authority. Each Grand Lodge (one in every U.S. state) and one in every free country around the globe) is autonymous. And
members of the Grand Lodges (the officers) need only be 3rd Degree Masons (Master Mason) 32nd & 33rd are numbers of degrees but not higher degrees
than Master Mason (3rd Degree) This, too and the fact that there is NO "supreme" Grand Lodge etc. has been discussed over and over on this forum
and more information is readily available on the web, in libraries and bookstores from legitimate Masonic sources.
Humorously enough their world headquarters is in the town I am in here in Tampa on Memorial ave. SO, I guess that it is staffed solely by the members
of local lodges as full time volunteers, or is there a actual corporate hierarchy to the masons as well?
Who's world headquarters? There IS NO World Headquarters for Masonry. I've said that. The Grand Lodge of Missouri is the "headquarters" for
the Lodge I belong to. It's in Columbia Missouri (about 3 hours from here) The Supreme Council of the Scottish Rite that I belong to is in
Washington DC. The Shrine Headquarters is in Tampa. Shriners draw their membership from Masons, but the Shrine isn't Masonry. Their purpose is
to support the Shrine Children't Hospitals which provide free medical help to crippled and burned children (sounds EVIL, huh?) The Shrine is also a
"fun" organization. Overgrown children in some ways (I can say that. I'm also a Shriner)
I think you mean antonymous
I certainly don't think so. Particularly since there (once again) is no such word. I did however mean "autonomous" (Mea culpa on the
1. Of or pertaining to an autonomy.
2. Possessed of autonomy, self-governing, independent. In Metaph.: see AUTONOMY 1c.
3. Biol. a. Conforming to its own laws only, and not subject to higher ones. b. Independent, i.e. not a mere form or state of some other
Well, better to stick with something safe then go onto something that I donít think that even all the members fully understand. I have read as much as
I care to on the subject, and more then enough to make an informed decision for myself, many of my sources where YOUR OWN BOOKS, that were left after
my grandfather died.
I can't argue with that. Go ahead and "stick to something safe" You obviously don't understand Masonry (and I DON'T mean that as an insult)
You have preconceived notions and your church disapproves of it. Have a good time doing something safe. Whatever that may be.