The Biggest Lie in Medicine: The Cholesterol Conspiracy

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posted on Dec, 4 2012 @ 12:53 PM
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You people keep mentioning these drugs have severe side effects....but you fail to mention the rate of these side effects....
the most serious one for statins is ALS.....it was found to have a rate of 9 in 60,000 people.
The memory loss that someone mentioned is found in rare cases. That means less than 1%.

Learn some science.
edit on 4-12-2012 by Ghost375 because: (no reason given)


Doctors are trying to help you!! and the Pharmaceutical industry IS trying to make money, just like everyone else in this country.....but they have high standards.
edit on 4-12-2012 by Ghost375 because: (no reason given)
edit on 4-12-2012 by Ghost375 because: (no reason given)




posted on Dec, 4 2012 @ 12:55 PM
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reply to post by Ghost375
 


whats one percent of the total peeps on statins again....?
science indeed

just sayin


would you link to solid scientific proof cholestorol is a proven cause of heart disease please?
thanks in advance
edit on 4-12-2012 by Danbones because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 4 2012 @ 12:58 PM
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It is, and always will be, the treatment of disease or symptoms, never addressing the underlying cause.
Big Parm makes billions treating symptoms, never the cause and God Forbid coming up with a cure.



posted on Dec, 4 2012 @ 12:58 PM
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reply to post by Asktheanimals
 


I think it comes in supplement form if hot sauce isn't your thing.



posted on Dec, 4 2012 @ 01:00 PM
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Originally posted by Danbones
reply to post by Ghost375
 


whats one percent of the total peeps on statins again....?
science indeed

just sayin


would you link to solid scientific proof cholestorol is a proven cause of heart disease please?
thanks in advance
edit on 4-12-2012 by Danbones because: (no reason given)

I didn't even say 1%. I said less than 1%. It's probably much less than 1%.

It's besides the point. People are trying to make it look like a big conspiracy to harm people. Just a fraction of people suffer from any severe side effect. Therefore, this is not a conspiracy.

People are using extremely bad science in this thread.



posted on Dec, 4 2012 @ 01:02 PM
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reply to post by Unity_99
 


Excellent point about the potassium iodide and iodine, which are vital to our thyroids.

I was just asking my husband yesterday, why do the foods that taste so darn good, are so darned bad for us? I was speaking, of course, of all the processed foods available for our consumption. I could eat a whole package of oreos, a few of those fettucine Alfredo frozen dinners, perhaps a frozen pizza or a huge cheeseburger with fries in a day, maybe a bowl of Cocoa Puffs or Cap'n Crunch, and still feel hungry (and fat as a cow) within the day. If I ate everything I liked, as much as I liked, I'm pretty sure only a crane could get me out of my house when I died a certain, early death.

The poisons are attractively packaged, taste amazing, and are exceptionally hard on our bodies. I'm not sure what the science is behind how they make this stuff addicting, but I'm sure it was years in the making.

I do the no-to-low carb diet, it is the only way I can get my appetite under control. When you eat enough foods that are truly satiating, your appetite gets under control. Unfortunately, grains are not part of it.



posted on Dec, 4 2012 @ 01:03 PM
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Originally posted by FissionSurplus
reply to post by NavyDoc
 


Thank you for your input, NavyDoc.

However, why isn't the medical establishment going after the root causes of CAD? According to all that I have read, inflammation is the key factor (albeit not the only factor, but the key one).

Hyperlipidemia appears to be hereditary, of course.....but is there a reason why? Is there something in the lifestyle that causes certain individual's bodies to flood the system with cholesterol?

I'm sure there are some people who need statins. My point is, they want EVERYBODY to be on them, and are demonizing cholesterol unfairly, while ignoring root causes of CAD. I also make the assertion that, by lowering everybody's cholesterol, it is a form of soft kill.

This, to me, is the worst part of western medicine. It's all about alleviating symptoms of disease, while ignoring the actual cause. This is a good way to make money, because there is never a cure.


The first one is a toughy. I'm not so certain that the medical establishment (not a monolithic entity like some people think) is not going after the root cause. I went to medical school quite a while ago, and even then we were taught about inflammation, anti-oxidants, a low fat diet with fresh fruits and veg, avoiding smoking, and nutritional counseling. Why so many meds given when we already know the benefits of all of these things? Multifactoral, I suppose. The older practitioners tend to be less hip to this sort of thing than the younger ones, when you have 15 minutes per patient, a long dietary plan and counseling on risk avoidance for a single issue takes up all of the time (and no, government healthcare will not make this any better), patients (at least in America) don't want to be told to eat better and stop smoking, they want a cure-all pill and they don't want to modify their lifestyle. I addition, consider that with the concept of evidence based medicine, many practitioners need to see a lot of double blinded placebo controlled trials before they make a change. All of this together seems to be the issue.

Inflammation is a very important factor which I why I mentioned good dental health. People who have low but constant inflammation somewhere have free radicals and inflammatory mediators throughout their bloodstream. Those are linked quite well to plaque buildup and well as increased sensitivity of the myocardium and intima (internal lining of the artery.) Anti-oxidants such as grape juice and so forth were discussed in medical school way back when I was there.

Why some people are genetically predisposed to produce cholesterol in excess? No one knows for sure. One thought is that it may be an evolutionary response to increasing carbohydrates in the diet. Sickle cell disease is a thought as an evolutionary response to endemic malaria, for example.

I'm not sure what you mean by "soft kill" but I agree that not everyone needs to be on statins. It makes no logical sense to give an 80 year old a statin drug or even tell him he must have a low fat diet--teh high cholesterol you have today would affect you 20 years from now. If I make it to 80, I'm probably going to sacrifice long term health for enjoyment of life right then.


A young person, absent risk factors, should have exhausted diet, exercise, niacin, fish oil, behavior modification (no smoking), and anti-oxidants before even considering a statin. Sadly, so many people just want a pill.



posted on Dec, 4 2012 @ 01:05 PM
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Originally posted by FissionSurplus
reply to post by Unity_99
 


Excellent point about the potassium iodide and iodine, which are vital to our thyroids.

I was just asking my husband yesterday, why do the foods that taste so darn good, are so darned bad for us? I was speaking, of course, of all the processed foods available for our consumption. I could eat a whole package of oreos, a few of those fettucine Alfredo frozen dinners, perhaps a frozen pizza or a huge cheeseburger with fries in a day, maybe a bowl of Cocoa Puffs or Cap'n Crunch, and still feel hungry (and fat as a cow) within the day. If I ate everything I liked, as much as I liked, I'm pretty sure only a crane could get me out of my house when I died a certain, early death.

The poisons are attractively packaged, taste amazing, and are exceptionally hard on our bodies. I'm not sure what the science is behind how they make this stuff addicting, but I'm sure it was years in the making.

I do the no-to-low carb diet, it is the only way I can get my appetite under control. When you eat enough foods that are truly satiating, your appetite gets under control. Unfortunately, grains are not part of it.


Well, it is also evolutionary. High fat and high carbohydrate foods are also very high energy foods gram per gram. Important when we were running through the savanna, not so much now.



posted on Dec, 4 2012 @ 01:06 PM
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I was given 8 different pills to take by my heart doctor, most were to lower my cholesterol. The thing is, I do not have high cholesterol. I went to see the doc because my heart was hurting one day while I was at the gym (I was sprinting like a mad man on the treadmill, doing some high-intensity interval training). I asked him why they were treating me for something I did not have and he said, "We prescribe the same regiment to all our patients for heart troubles." My diagnosis was, they did not know what was wrong with my heart. I was pretty blown away that they would prescibe me all those drugs when they did not know what was wrong. I asked him how many side effects would result from taking all those meds and he gave me a contemptuous look as though I was insulting his intelligence. I never took one pill and I never went back.

It was kind of funny because I remember the doctor coming into the room with his arms loaded with drugs, like he was carrying wood. He got to the table and literally let the drugs spew out of his arms and they spread out across the table like 52 card pick-up, it was kind of comical.

That was more then 5 years ago. I have found that my heart aches a bit if my heartbeat rate is too high, so I have had to tune down my workout intensity. I try to have a good diet and have lowered my suger intake. I must admit to having a mountain dew about once every other week though (I am addicted).

Am I unwise for questioning my doctors prescriptions? Time will tell. I generally maintain the view that doctors now-a-days are just legal drug dealers, taught to prescribe their masters wares on the populace. I know there are doctors and drugs that save lives and do great things, for which I am truely greatful, but sometimes they can create more problems then they resolve by handing out drugs like it was candy for children. And people are eating it up.

I will continue my diet and exercise routine and do all I can personally to stay healthy. Thanks for the thread!



posted on Dec, 4 2012 @ 01:08 PM
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Originally posted by Danbones
reply to post by Ghost375
 


would you link to solid scientific proof cholestorol is a proven cause of heart disease please?
thanks in advance
edit on 4-12-2012 by Danbones because: (no reason given)

There's tons of evidence.
It's probably not the only factor, but it is a factor.

Here's just one study.



posted on Dec, 4 2012 @ 01:10 PM
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This thread is extremely stupid and based on misconceptions about science.
reply to post by Ghost375
 


You insult the thread, but provide ZERO evidence to back that point of view, which has been fairly typical of the few naysayers who have appeared on here to pass out insults but nothing else.

I think your response is stupid, and typical of people who chant the mantra of "science" but can only parrot what the television tells them.

May I remind you that a lot of what is passed off as "science" is, in itself, junk science, in the guise of poorly-conceived and executed studies. But you can probably dredge up something to show that I am wrong, can't you?

As I have said before, if you disagree, show me the proof that you have which completely debunks what I have put forth...that high cholesterol is a symptom, not a cause, of arterial damage. Your post is typical of the type of poster on ATS who enjoys being mean and derogatory.

If 75% of people who croak of heart attacks have normal cholesterol, then perhaps there is something to this post, after all.

Put up or shut up, Ghost.



posted on Dec, 4 2012 @ 01:12 PM
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Originally posted by BuffDaddy
I was given 8 different pills to take by my heart doctor, most were to lower my cholesterol. The thing is, I do not have high cholesterol. I went to see the doc because my heart was hurting one day while I was at the gym (I was sprinting like a mad man on the treadmill, doing some high-intensity interval training). I asked him why they were treating me for something I did not have and he said, "We prescribe the same regiment to all our patients for heart troubles." My diagnosis was, they did not know what was wrong with my heart. I was pretty blown away that they would prescibe me all those drugs when they did not know what was wrong. I asked him how many side effects would result from taking all those meds and he gave me a contemptuous look as though I was insulting his intelligence. I never took one pill and I never went back.

dude, it isn't a perfect science. He probably was just trying to help you.
They check for drug interactions. He probably gave you a look that said you were questioning his integrity and care for your well being, not intelligence.

Obviously something was wrong with your heart to the best of his abilities. Sue him for trying to help!



posted on Dec, 4 2012 @ 01:14 PM
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Originally posted by FissionSurplus



This thread is extremely stupid and based on misconceptions about science.
reply to post by Ghost375
 


You insult the thread, but provide ZERO evidence to back that point of view, which has been fairly typical of the few naysayers who have appeared on here to pass out insults but nothing else.

I think your response is stupid, and typical of people who chant the mantra of "science" but can only parrot what the television tells them.

I've shown plenty of evidence...where have you been?

And I don't get my information from the TV.



posted on Dec, 4 2012 @ 01:17 PM
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Originally posted by heartlyte
One other important issue with statins is that in about March of 2013 the FDA added a little caution saying that statins may also cause problems with memory. Seems like a small thing but here's the rub. As mentioned in initial article, cholesterol helps with healing in the brain. Prolonged use of statins lowers this brain healing property of cholesterol and adds to plaque formation. The result is increases in dementia and Alzheimer symptoms. If you have elderly parents with these issues, look and see if they have been on statins. As an anti-aging doctor, I try to discourage statin use. I find a baby asprin, fish oil, vit d , curcumin or resveratrol are probably more heart protective than a medication. I'm not giving anyone medical advice here, but this is what I do for myself. Best indicator of longevity is in the genes. If your parents live till their nineties, you'll have a long ride. Make the best of it. Big Pharma is not here to help, just here to make money.


Wonderful post! There are many things that are available, most that are natural, that work just as well, if not better, if a doctor desires to see lowered cholesterol in a patient.

And you're right, a lot is in the genes. But making cholesterol the boogey man sells more pills, I suppose. Heart disease is certainly more complex than just blaming it on one thing.

My main point in the OP is that there are too many people who are told to lower their cholesterol, without addressing the other factors that are at the root cause of their problems. And one has to wonder, why??



posted on Dec, 4 2012 @ 01:19 PM
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reply to post by Asktheanimals
 


Yes, but the oils were contained in the nuts and seeds, etc... It is different when you eat nuts than when using peanut oil or soy oil. The nuts also contains fiber which slows the absorption of the oils. Eating sunflower seeds is a good source of oils but also contains fiber, selenium, and magnesium. Magnesium in the right proportion is needed to process these fats and selenium is an antihistamine, or if you prefer, it has antioxidant properties. We are used to eating these things because our ancestors ate them. In four to five generations we will change enough to properly process these things in our bodies.



posted on Dec, 4 2012 @ 01:20 PM
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Originally posted by FissionSurplus


My main point in the OP is that there are too many people who are told to lower their cholesterol, without addressing the other factors that are at the root cause of their problems. And one has to wonder, why??

Because they don't know all of the other factors, and cholesterol levels are easy to treat.
Doctors do tell patients to eat healthy, and they do tell them to quit smoking, and you know what? Patients don't listen!! They really are doing the best they can do. They aren't miracle workers.

Science isn't some know-all perfect doctrine. And no professional scientist/doctor will say it is. The only people saying scientists say that are people who don't know about science.
edit on 4-12-2012 by Ghost375 because: typo
edit on 4-12-2012 by Ghost375 because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 4 2012 @ 01:24 PM
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Originally posted by FissionSurplus



This thread is extremely stupid and based on misconceptions about science.
reply to post by Ghost375
 


You insult the thread, but provide ZERO evidence to back that point of view, which has been fairly typical of the few naysayers who have appeared on here to pass out insults but nothing else.

I think your response is stupid, and typical of people who chant the mantra of "science" but can only parrot what the television tells them.

May I remind you that a lot of what is passed off as "science" is, in itself, junk science, in the guise of poorly-conceived and executed studies. But you can probably dredge up something to show that I am wrong, can't you?

As I have said before, if you disagree, show me the proof that you have which completely debunks what I have put forth...that high cholesterol is a symptom, not a cause, of arterial damage. Your post is typical of the type of poster on ATS who enjoys being mean and derogatory.

If 75% of people who croak of heart attacks have normal cholesterol, then perhaps there is something to this post, after all.

Put up or shut up, Ghost.


I wouldn't necessarily agree that cholesterol is a symptom, not a cause of CAD. Excess cholesterol is an independent risk factor for plaque build-up. It would be looking at a brick wall and saying that it was the cement only and not include the bricks.



posted on Dec, 4 2012 @ 01:26 PM
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Originally posted by rickymouse
reply to post by Asktheanimals
 


Yes, but the oils were contained in the nuts and seeds, etc... It is different when you eat nuts than when using peanut oil or soy oil. The nuts also contains fiber which slows the absorption of the oils. Eating sunflower seeds is a good source of oils but also contains fiber, selenium, and magnesium. Magnesium in the right proportion is needed to process these fats and selenium is an antihistamine, or if you prefer, it has antioxidant properties. We are used to eating these things because our ancestors ate them. In four to five generations we will change enough to properly process these things in our bodies.


Going back to the fundimental problem that we eat too many processed foods.



posted on Dec, 4 2012 @ 01:29 PM
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reply to post by Ghost375
 


There's a lot of holes in the government's "plate" recommendation. For example, they are always pushing "low fat", which means that kids will get hungry faster. Yogurt? They don't say plain yogurt, they just say yogurt. Look on any yogurt label, and what does one see? High fructose corn syrup as a main ingredient. A few (Oikos, I think) use sugar instead. Point being, yogurt is a sugary treat, not a staple. As a country, when the low fat craze started, we became fatter than ever. Low fat processed foods tend to add a great deal more sugar (or aspartame) to make up for the lack of taste when they remove fat.

Some fat provides satiety, so that we're not hungry an hour later.

They also push grains a lot, saying it makes the kids "feel full longer". Is that the only reason? There are a lot of people who are gluten-intolerant. If they follow this advice, they're in for a lifetime of misery.

I have never, EVER, had one of my doctors give me nutritional advice.

Well, at least you attempted to give some back-up for your view. But there are a lot of nutritionists who are not fond of the government's advice. It's not all bad, but I don't agree with it. If you do, that's fine. Eat what the gubmint tells you to.



posted on Dec, 4 2012 @ 01:34 PM
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reply to post by Danbones
 


You got it! Cholesterol is brain food. To suggest that everybody needs to be on statins for low cholesterol is another way of suggesting that we all become brain-dead and forgetful.

I still maintain that it is a conspiracy, to keep us stupid, sick and headed to an early grave.

I'm taking the heat for taking this stand....again....but this time, there are a great many ATS'ers who also see it like I do.





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