Power (Freedom) vs Acceptance - Being in the "Now" or breaking one's will!?

What do you think about these two paths?

On the one side, they want you to be in the now, quiet the mind, accept life as it is and embrace it. This seems very freeing, it seems like a huge release of suffering, but if you do not try to control your life, won't others manipulate you from behind the scenes? If you are "just in the now" what if you are a slave? Imagine if the slaves thought like this? Would they have fought for freedom? What if the ancients thought like this when a war started by those who wants to take their land and kill everyone? Would acceptance have done anything?


Now this path of Power (Freedom), doing what makes you feel free and respecting others freedom. This allows you and everyone to be their true self, it allows everyone to be their NATURAL self - what is NATURAL for THEIR nature. With one rule "let others be free (do not control another - free will)" - this will already be the moral to stay away from unmoral actions such as stealing, killing, rape, etc...

This would lacks freedom, and I am not just talking about a NWO conspiracy here. I'm talking about in the minds of people. People always want to control others... "if you loved me you'll do this...", "you are selfish if you do not do that... (which "I" want you to do)", " You are lazy, and idiot, whatever (when you do not agree with me or do what I say)...

So much control even in the minds of the average people, hidden through subtle words...


What do you think of this? Walk the path of acceptance - have no individuality, allow whatever happens to be without expectations and never suffer...

OR

do what makes you feel free, and allow others to be free, feel empowered, be yourself, and if life doesn't sometimes go the way you want - at least you tried, now you can stop thinking about that since it makes you feel "controlled" by life and focus on what other things in YOUR life you can control (not people!) - or do to feel free.....

Originally posted by arpgme

On the one side, they want you to be in the now, quiet the mind, accept life as it is and embrace it. This seems very freeing, it seems like a huge release of suffering, but if you do not try to control your life, won't others manipulate you from behind the scenes? If you are "just in the now" what if you are a slave? Imagine if the slaves thought like this? Would they have fought for freedom? What if the ancients thought like this when a war started by those who wants to take their land and kill everyone? Would acceptance have done anything?

Being in the 'now' is not an option, you don't get a choice in the matter, you have never been out of the 'now'.
Only the words that appear 'now' speak of 'past', 'tomorrow', '5 years ago' etc. You never leave 'now' but you hear talk of 'other times'.

When you realize you are the now, you stop time because you are where the real happening is happening. You are where the action is and you are aware of what is happening because you are not deluded by the speaking mind (the speaking serpent).
It is great to be here because not many are - they are lost in thought - lost in time.

Do not be a slave to the thoughts that appear and do not be fooled by what they say.

reply to post by Itisnowagain


So, there is no conducting of action that needs to be done? If a person does not have compassion, there is nothing that needs to be done?

Now is here and there is an awareness of "doing this" or "doing that" - the body moves towards one action. It doesn't matter if it is compassionate or not? Destructive or not?

A person in slavery should enjoy now as being a slave instead of getting away?

I understand being in the now - but where is there free-will? If actions aren't free-will the are thoughts? Where is the freedom? Should one just live silencing the mind?

reply to post by arpgme


I liked reading your thread. Thanks.

I have thought along the same lines. I am definitely a strong and assertive individualist. I live in the now, but I do not accept it. I never accept it because to do so would mean that I am accepting all the horror of the world, too.

However we decide to approach our existence others will not be on the same wavelength. For example, this morning I walked outside my house and yet again had people trying to push me off the sidewalk, not giving me room to pass by. I get that kind of behaviour from THEM a lot. Because I look different and dress different (according to my own taste and style and not theirs) they respond with rudeness and disrespect for some odd reason. I recall the "Easy Rider" film where it is remarked that people who are free are met with intolerance and fear by those who are not free. As we saw in the "Easy Rider" film the two riders got blown away because of their lifestyle.

Well I shook that guy up who nearly knocked me off the sidewalk. I made him jump with my response. I said "Give me room! You are not giving me room to pass by! That is neither polite or respectful!". He apologised. Jolly good, too. I get anxiety because of the way I am treated in the environment I live in. I am super assertive. I would never be physically violent, but if people cross me or show nastiness I will fight my corner EVERYTIME!

I have the RIGHT to be free. The Universe put me here. The Universe wants me here to live my life. I approach others, whoever they are, with politeness and blanket respect! I expect the same treatment. Yet there is a huge chasm because some people out there seem to think they have the right to behave like a rude and violent, oppressive brute! I am glad I am sensitive, articulate, free, creative and gentle. I am glad I am not an unthinking brute with hardly an original thought concept going on in his dull, enslaved brain.

I'm free! Are you???

Originally posted by arpgme
reply to post by Itisnowagain

 

So, there is no conducting of action that needs to be done? If a person does not have compassion, there is nothing that needs to be done?

Now is here and there is an awareness of "doing this" or "doing that" - the body moves towards one action. It doesn't matter if it is compassionate or not? Destructive or not?

A person in slavery should enjoy now as being a slave instead of getting away?

I understand being in the now - but where is there free-will? If actions aren't free-will the are thoughts? Where is the freedom? Should one just live silencing the mind?

edit on 1-12-2012 by arpgme because: (no reason given)

To just accept this dull world is not an option. We must express the colours of our imagination. We must express ourselves. If we don't then we will only make a desert. Too much control of human creativity and thought frustrates our evolutionary development, holds us all back, and leaves us in the vacuum of a cultural desert, just like this hell called English Society I am having to tolerate right now!

reply to post by arpgme


Life is happening, it will not stop just because you don't think it first. You believe you are doing life and it is a heavy load to carry. This is why humans suffer because they believe they have to manage and correct everything, when in reality life is just happening and you can watch it unfold beautifully when you realize this.

There is only now (presence).

reply to post by Revolution9


Yea, I know what you mean. I can accept many things but feeling like I am "trapped" not being able to be myself seems like too much....

reply to post by Itisnowagain


But what if the unfolding is suffering? Slavery to serve another being? Do you see that as the beauty also? You don't think negative you are embrace the unfolding of now? Do you have any desire that goes against what is?

Originally posted by arpgme
reply to post by Itisnowagain

 

But what if the unfolding is suffering? Slavery to serve another being? Do you see that as the beauty also? You don't think negative you are embrace the unfolding of now? Do you have any desire that goes against what is?

There is no 'other' being. This is it.
Now is being everything there is.
But you think there is a you that is separate from this.
There is only this and this is eternal.

Originally posted by arpgme

But what if the unfolding is suffering? Slavery to serve another being? Do you see that as the beauty also? You don't think negative you are embrace the unfolding of now? Do you have any desire that goes against what is?

edit on 1-12-2012 by arpgme because: (no reason given)

Where is the suffering?
Can you find the one that is suffering?

Originally posted by Itisnowagain

Originally posted by arpgme
reply to post by Itisnowagain

 

But what if the unfolding is suffering? Slavery to serve another being? Do you see that as the beauty also? You don't think negative you are embrace the unfolding of now? Do you have any desire that goes against what is?

There is no 'other' being. This is it.
Now is being everything there is.
But you think there is a you that is separate from this.
There is only this and this is eternal.

Are you a Budhist by any chance? I would just like to throw up Martin Luther King. If he had not disturbed the universe, the staus quo, would the plight of Afro American people ever have changed? Only human action can counteract human action. Inaction achieves nothing. Even to eat we must make some kind of effort. Survival depends upon it. So on the base level we need food and we also have other needs, too. We need to feel wanted, we need to feel secure, we need to feel loved. When we are lacking any of our needs then we become disturbed and we question; we want to do something about it because we want to survive.

Originally posted by Revolution9

Are you a Budhist by any chance? I would just like to throw up Martin Luther King. If he had not disturbed the universe, the staus quo, would the plight of Afro American people ever have changed? Only human action can counteract human action. Inaction achieves nothing. Even to eat we must make some kind of effort. Survival depends upon it. So on the base level we need food and we also have other needs, too. We need to feel wanted, we need to feel secure, we need to feel loved. When we are lacking any of our needs then we become disturbed and we question and we want to do something about it because we want to survive.

edit on 1-12-2012 by Revolution9 because: spelling.

I am not any 'thing', i wear no label or badge.
Action happens. Life is happening.
No one is doing it - it is done.

I don't know about heaven, but one this planet we believe in cause and effect and, people tend to take action because of a cause. The stomach growls - eat. The throat is dry - drink. Boredom happens - find something to do. Maybe on the other side it is all "Now" but we can see that actions here comes as a reaction from some sort of "cause".

Just as thoughts happen as a reaction to life...

Originally posted by arpgme

I don't know about heaven, but one this planet we believe in cause and effect and, people tend to take action because of a cause. The stomach growls - eat. The throat is dry - drink. Boredom happens - find something to do. Maybe on the other side it is all "Now" but we can see that actions here comes as a reaction from some sort of "cause".

Just as thoughts happen as a reaction to life...

edit on 1-12-2012 by arpgme because: (no reason given)

You are the cause and the effect.
But what are you?
The only thing there is; presence - which is not a thing - it is no-thing.

Out of no thing appear the every thing.
Emptiness is forming.

Originally posted by Itisnowagain

Originally posted by arpgme

But what if the unfolding is suffering? Slavery to serve another being? Do you see that as the beauty also? You don't think negative you are embrace the unfolding of now? Do you have any desire that goes against what is?

edit on 1-12-2012 by arpgme because: (no reason given)

Where is the suffering?
Can you find the one that is suffering?

edit on 1-12-2012 by Itisnowagain because: (no reason given)

Yes, here he is! It is me in the NOW! I am sufering because there is an utter chasm and disparity between my vision, my idealism, the requests my being makes upon me to have my basic needs met and the way the world is (in the NOW) and the fact that the world is not meeting, on a constant basis, my human NEEDS.

Is this the kind of suffering that keeps us trying? Are any of our basic needs really being met by the way we have made this world? If I could achieve a daily smile, have a loving partner, feel secure and respected I would gladly trade and forsake this plastic materialistic lifestyle full of spam that most everyone else seems to be wanting to live.

Self awareness is suffering. To love is to suffer. Yes, even in love there is also loss. Infact, they are two sides of the same coin. You throw up heads you are gonna have to have tails, too. For what we invest emotionally in another soul sooner or later we must part in this mortal world.

On that score, love well my friends! Make each second, minute, day and hour count and bask in the love of your loved ones! Amen, brothers and sisters!

reply to post by arpgme


The beliefs held are the minds chains around your freedom. The belief that you can do wrong or right are resistance to what is. 'What is' is happening presently (now) it cannot be changed. The belief is that you can time travel into the future and do the event before it happens to practice to do it correctly. All the time you are doing this stage play in the head you are missing what is really happening (reality).
Humans live in the world of 'What is not happening'.
The stage play in the head is happening because there is no faith, there is fear, i must protect myself attitude, i must do it right attitude. This state of affairs causes the body to contract and tense and it does not feel good, this feeling makes us want to protect ourselves. This contraction makes you feel separate and isolated and you feel alien. You want desparately to fit in because you feel apart (from the whole).
Come to this moment and you will be home free.

reply to post by Revolution9


There is no 'me' in the now.
Presence is 'your' absence.
The one that lives in time is the one who scares you with it's fear mongering.
What's wrong with right now......unless you think about it?

You feel lost and incomplete because you look outside yourself to complete yourself.
That which is looking and seeking is the one you should seek.

Originally posted by Itisnowagain
reply to post by arpgme

 

The beliefs held are the minds chains around your freedom. The belief that you can do wrong or right are resistance to what is. 'What is' is happening presently (now) it cannot be changed. The belief is that you can time travel into the future and do the event before it happens to practice to do it correctly. All the time you are doing this stage play in the head you are missing what is really happening (reality).
Humans live in the world of 'What is not happening'.
The stage play in the head is happening because there is no faith, there is fear, i must protect myself attitude, i must do it right attitude. This state of affairs causes the body to contract and tense and it does not feel good, this feeling makes us want to protect ourselves. This contraction makes you feel separate and isolated and you feel alien. You want desparately to fit in because you feel apart (from the whole).
Come to this moment and you will be home free.

You express yourself very well. It is a way to be and I could not disagree with you because this is your experience, your reality and your "approach" to existence.

Yet for me and my chattering, progressive soul, this would be too much of a vacuum for my mind to deal with. I can relate to much of what you say, but I chose a path of action and animation. Just to be is not enough. I have to do, too.

Originally posted by Revolution9

Yet for me and my chattering, progressive soul, this would be too much of a vacuum for my mind to deal with. I can relate to much of what you say, but I chose a path of action and animation. JUst to be is not enough. I have to do, too.

The mind is just noise in the vacuum that you are.
You are the silent witness to all that arises.
All seeing, all knowing and ever present.
Eternally presence.

Originally posted by Itisnowagain
reply to post by Revolution9

 

There is no 'me' in the now.
Presence is 'your' absence.
The one that lives in time is the one who scares you with it's fear mongering.
What's wrong with right now......unless you think about it?

Absolutely nothing is wrong with right NOW. Right now is ok because you are here and the OP and I have been able to relate with you and to you how I was feeling in the NOW before. Reading your words and the OP's words comforted me. You met a need I had as I was feeling very frustrated. I was able to express my anxiety and the causes of it and that eased the anxiety.

Lol, yet I can't have you and the OP there all the time can I? May be I should employ you both as lifetime companions??? Hahaha! I would not go far wrong with two advisors like you both, would I!

I love metaphysics. You and the OP both demonstrate a keen sense of the metaphysical. Rare people, truely!

Bless you both!

Originally posted by Revolution9

Reading your words and the OP's words comforted me. Yet met a need I had as I was feeling very frustrated. I was able to express my anxiety and the causes of it and that eased the anxiety.

Lol, yet I can't have you and the OP there all the time can I? May be I should employ you both as lifetime companions??? Hahaha! I would not go far wrong with two advisors like you both, would I!

The now is never absent so at any 'time' you can reach for it. It is your rock and anchor. It will lift you up.
The 'presence' is comfort and joy.