first of all the first three that you listed have nothing to do with magik.

and i think you are taling about magik because magic is like the card trix, and so on and so forth.

magik is part of the paga/wicca art and religon.
all magik is basicly altering your concious state of mind in to different levels.

When I was 14 and crazy I conjured a demon (the demon of Thursday, I can't remember his name right now). I used an ancient recipy out of a magic book. Anyways, a tiny cloud emerged, growing and growing. I freaked out....and asked it to leave. Leave NOW. And it did, probably because it was still not totally formed. Demons can take on any kind of form, animated or not. I only had a tiny pentagram instead of the one drawn in the floor in which you have to hide.

So I would say: get yourself a book of demonic incantations. Be thoroughly prepared and then summon a demon.

I of course, will NEVER try this again. And no I was totally sober and not tripping and very very on the alert (I say this because I can become dreamy easily).

my palm reading experience

two years ago me my mother my step father and my aunt and her family went to blackpoole. my mother wanted to get her palm read and so she proceeded to do so. the palm reader said that her and my father would break up and she would find the man of her dreams again. she also said that one of her children would be succesful in her dream job (being me) and her son would become succseful in music. a month later, my step father (who i consider my father) cheated on my mother with the village sl*t. My brothers band is playing in huge festivals and is soon to be going on tour. I have just got a modelling job. My mother found the man of her dreams, who happened to be my step father again, who came running back and they have now renewed their wedding vows.

Your asking for physical evidence of something thats entirely nonphysical? AHAHAHAHAAHAHAHA!!! these people just get funnier every day!

firstly magic is just the manipulation of energy it's not pretty lights or anything physical although it can have physical results and why would u want proof why does everyone want proof can't soem thngs just reain a mystery???? geese louise papa cheese

You don't get it, do you? First of all, you don't want to know. You're comfortable in the world you live in. Just like people were comfortable with catholicism a few hundred years ago. Every small change to such beliefs creates a mess.

We live in the 21th century and people tend to believe that we are more illuminated, that science provided us the answers.

Fact is, science gave us no answers at all. It only theorizes on how part of the material world works yet we can't even know it does exist. In fact, for all i care, i don't even know there's existence beyond my own.

Get it?

I exist. I know that. And i don't believe in anything else. Sure i believe 1+1=2, but that doesn't mean anything. It's only part of this limited universe with so restricted laws.
____

I hope I'm not sounding confusing. Basically i don't believe in anything and i believe everything is possible.

There are no Dogmas besides myself. Everything else is questionable.

Magic? Who cares about proving magic when i can't explain my very simple existence? What's the point of having a "scientific" explanation for my "future" thoughts if i can't have the answer on "why do i have them?"

Science is limited. It explains many things inside the box. But it can't explain the outside, it can't explain the box itself and it can't even explain why are you inside the box and why is it a box and not something else.

Science tells us it was a "casual" thing... a lousy way nothing different from the religious explanation of the "big guy up there with super powers called God..."

sigh.
____

Open your mind.

I don't believe in magic. As a matter of fact, i don't even believe in non-magic.

I'm neutral to everything. As far as I'm concerned this could all be just a dream created by myself... Or maybe it's a dragon with pink wings and a charles chaplin-like hat hypnotizing me...

eh..

I would like to preface this response by stating that I am not a pagan, Wiccan or what have you. I am dedicated to the search for truth, whether that be through science or metaphysics. I must point out that there is now significant scientific evidence emerging from the field of quantum Physics, research that lends serious credibility to some the beliefs of all spiritual practices: Particularly the effects of human consciousness on subatomic particles i.e. electron probability wave collapse and the observer effect. There is a wealth of new discovery published by prominent scientists from around the world that would suggest our thoughts have a real physical effect on the world around us (however minuscule that effect may be). If you are truly interested and not just being antagonistic for the sake of ego fulfillment there are several books and video I can recommend.
The most easily understood and accessibly is a movie titled What the Bleep Do We Know.

Other book and videos include

Conscious Acts of Creation by Dr. William A Tiller Ph.D. Stanford University

The Physics of Consciousness by Dr. Evan Harris Walker Ph.D. University of Maryland

The Self-Aware Universe by Dr. Amit Goswami Ph.D. University of Oregon

The Hidden Messages In Water by Dr. Masaru Emoto Ph.D. this book discusses studies conducted to determine what effect if any human thoughts have on water molecules .

The Intention Experiment by Lynne McTaggart This book chronicles the many past and on going experiments being done to determine the effects of our thoughts when high levels of concentration are achieved.

Imagine an apple, and all its attributes in your mind.

Let me make it very simple for you.

If you want a demo from a telepath, good luck realizing it being done to you.

[edit on 13-4-2008 by Ihavenoidea]

Originally posted by depth om
Imagine an apple, and all its attributes in your mind.

You mean, become an apple, with all its attributes - and "see" the world from ITS perspective. (Not from the perspective of you being physically - in your mind - the size of the apple and on its location, but from the perspective of being an apple.)

If you can do that, most questions will be gone.
If you can't, you still got a LONG way to go before even starting to ask the right questions.

But being on a long and winded path is still better than not going anywhere.

Nope, we can't prove magic exists. At least, no-one has bothered to do so, yet, regardless of the massive prizes on offer, or the help it would offer other people. If a person can see/feel the outcome of magic, then it can be detected by scientific methods. Saying otherwise is a get-out-of-bullpoop-clause.

The fact no-one's demonstrated it in a "clean" environment is highly suspicious. You'd think every emo goth kid would jump at the chance to actually show off their mad skillz.

True magic I believe, is mysterious logic, aka mogic aka magic. It is only magical to the uninformed. The egyptian mystery schools and other similar institutions taught scientific and mathematical systems to those who were accepted, but to the layperson, they were learning "secret wisdoms", practicing the "magics" of the old. Many of the wisdoms studied in those days are now studied in school classrooms across the globe. Chemistry, physics, trigonometry etc. can all be referred to as "magical" systems.

There are shadowed logics not yet uncovered. Within the mind is the end of time, the light of birth and the ratio of worth.

The fact no-one's demonstrated it in a "clean" environment is highly suspicious. You'd think every emo goth kid would jump at the chance to actually show off their mad skillz.

Oh my...
What is a "clean" environment?
If it is what I think you mean, then consider the simple fact that LIFE is anything but a "clean" environment. And it's with the (natural) forces of the natural environment that magic works.

And besides... what makes you think that "every emo goth kid" would even KNOW about magic, let alone be able to perform it?

It does not work like that.

Anyone who would have it in him/her to even think of "showing off" is safe to rule out as the depositary of ANY real knowledge.

That's the way it works.

Originally posted by DeltaChaos
All right.

Who can submit, provide, produce, or otherwise procure any physical evidence of the existence of magic? Anyone?

I can disappear before your very eyes. Watch...

You might as well have titled the thread

"Ok, who can prove God exists?"

What I mean is, both God and magic lie outside of the realm of science, fact, proof, and/or evidence. It is impossible to come to an absolute existential conclusion of either, without relying on faith and "personal experience".

That is not to say both don't exist. That is not to both do. It is to say both can't be proven to exist. It is to say any existential argument either for or against both, is both futile and silly.


[edit on 12/6/2008 by prototism]

[edit on 12/6/2008 by prototism]

[edit on 12/6/2008 by prototism]

Magic is real and is not something that only those with a positive mind can experience. Anyone can know that something supernatural is taking place. If you'r looking for proof I can show you, but even those who see I have found doubt even the most obvious of miracles. If you really want to believe it, you have to do it. I'm NOT saying I won't show you and make some excuse. I hate all this jargin people talk about how magic exists but they don't have any evidence and can't show you either... So let me show you first. Whoever reply's to me, ask me something, anything, even something crazy. But when it happen's, lol, know it's because of this.
Magic is based on knowledge, and that knowledge must be DONE more then just thought of. You have to KNOW God, and you must know how He has set up governments of all kingdoms. Once you understand your place in creation, know Him and His Names, then you may tell Powers, Virtues, Demons, Angels, whatever governs the "air" according to the proper order and things happen... yo... ! ps. All magic and spiritual knowledge points to One thing, so for all those who want to stay pagans and reject the Son of Man, sucks for you... It all points to Jesus. Jesus is what everything we are a part of was created through and for. That, for future comments, is the key of ALL knowledge.