Ok, who can prove magic exists?, page 21
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reply posted on 14-9-2005 @ 02:24 PM by plop
Here is a 13-year scientific study of Near-Death-Experiences, published in The Lancet in 2001:

profezie3m.altervista.org...

PDF file:

www.zarqon.co.uk...

The shocking conclusions:

62 (18%) patients reported some recollection of the time of clinical death (table 1).


Several theories have been proposed to explain NDE. We did not show that psychological, neurophysiological, or physiological factors caused these experiences after cardiac arrest. Sabom22 mentions a young American woman who had complications during brain surgery for a cerebral aneurysm. The EEG of her cortex and brainstem had become totally flat. After the operation, which was eventually successful, this patient proved to have had a very deep NDE, including an out-of-body experience, with subsequently verified observations during the period of the flat EEG.


With lack of evidence for any other theories for NDE, the thus far assumed, but never proven, concept that consciousness and memories are localised in the brain should be discussed. How could a clear consciousness outside one's body be experienced at the moment that the brain no longer functions during a period of clinical death with flat EEG?22 Also, in cardiac arrest the EEG usually becomes flat in most cases within about 10 s from onset of syncope.29,30 Furthermore, blind people have described veridical perception during out-of-body experiences at the time of this experience.31 NDE pushes at the limits of medical ideas about the range of human consciousness and the mind-brain relation.


Research should be concentrated on the effort to explain scientifically the occurrence and content of NDE. Research should be focused on certain specific elements of NDE, such as out-of-body experiences and other verifiable aspects. Finally, the theory and background of transcendence should be included as a part of an explanatory framework for these experiences.


I know it may be hard to accept, especially for people who dislike the idea of a 'soul', but here u have it: a scientific study which basicly proves that consciousness can survive the death of the brain.


reply posted on 20-9-2005 @ 12:11 AM by rizla
Majic is not getting a fair trial here.

The thread author unfairly dismissed the Uri Geller study as too old and not backed up by further research.

Here's some further research:
www.mysteriouspeople.com...

A lot of guys can 'bend spoons' and Geller's and Manning's ability were scientifically proven to exist.

If you want to collect your own evidence, do some 'Magic'; Make a ouija board or do the party trick where you lift someone up with just fingers. I'm not saying it's ghosts, but it works and it is easily reproducable. (Interestingly, both examples I site require 4-5 people. Perhaps 'Magic' is social)

We are surrounded by magic . If you can't see it, it's because you don't want to.

Disclaimer: I'm not advocating anyone try the things I mentioned. They do 'work' but I don't know how and they might be dangerous. Strictly adults only and don't do it with a bad attitude.


[edit on 20-9-2005 by rizla]


reply posted on 26-9-2005 @ 01:13 AM by BlackGuardXIII
If one does not believe in the paranormal as real, of course they will not believe that spirits can have any effect on their life. Therefore a ouija board, seance, voodoo ritual, hex, spell, etc., are, in their view, unable to summon forces or spirits of any kind. I have no answers as to how any kind of magic works, other than to say that I am certain that much of what is called magic is sleight of hand, distraction, etc.
My beliefs are not answers, and they are only of importance to one person, me. I share them with others only because it seems like the right thing to do, but I do not expect to be agreed with, nor care if I am believed. That said, I see ouija boards, etc. as a tool, designed for a purpose, and as such it is neither evil, nor good. Just as a piece of lead can be made into a paperweight, or a bullet, both are neither good nor bad, and both can be used for good or evil. Water can save your life, or kill you, but is it either good or evil?
Since I have reason to believe in spirits, and find ouija boards 'creep me out', I don't play with them. That is my choice, and irrelevent to anyone else. If they have concluded that spirits are not real, that is what is true for them, and I support them on their life journey. I feel the world is big enough for everyone to have differing experiences, and therefore differing views, and at the same time all be on the right path. That in itself is kind of a magic thing in a way.
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