Originally posted by Raideur
You all still believ that the human spirit is something special, that it is something amazing and intangible and defies all logic, yet must exist..
Well, yes. I belive that the point of being human is to be more than the sum of your parts, more than just the same all singing, all dancing crap of
the world. More than the same decaying matter as everything else.
I feel we are defined by our human behavior, and that our pursuit of the unknown has been the only reason we have come as far as we have.
I also know that improbable events tend to occur with human interaction. Anamolies... humans, more than any other creature, break the mold more
often. Nature itself surely did not intend some of the feats we have accomplished, or some of the aberrant behaviors we've developed.
I have found that believing in the goodness of mankind, and the higher spiritual calling does tend to disappoint me more than I like. But, would you
call Socrates foolish? Plato? Aristotle? Copernicus? Einstein? Feynman? Nietszche? Heidegger? Hume? Edison? Franklin?
You know, I could keep going with names. All these men believed in human spirituality ("Zer Wille Der Macht" for Nietszche) for humanity's sake.
If these men can believe in the mysterious and be called great minds, who are you to call them fools? Perhaps they are fools. Can you prove it?
Because we WANT to believe it rather than what the evidence points to.
Listen... and listen VERY carefully, and I sincerely mean this...
Lack of Evidence is not evidence to the contrary.
As such, you have provided no EVIDENCE that states magick is impossible or has never happened, you have not conducted any experiments that
definitively prove that the phenomenon doesn't occur, you have not interviewed or pursued the possibility of the real existence, and you have
discounted or ignored evidence in SCIENCE ITSELF of possible phenomena which are incurred by A) Observation, or B) Sheer willpower.
Just because you do not have evidence does not mean that you can so cleanly close a case. The Questions remaining unanswered is what drives the human
passion, the human spirit. The things we don't understand is what pulls us and fulfills us.
If you honestly want to believe in this, it is hopeless for me to present any evidence to contradict it, as is life and the world, since it feels
better to believe, thus, science is pointless in this arguement.
Science isn't pointless, it is a valuable tool if used correctly. Science is not a hammer to smash all things which do not fit in your pervue...
science is a scalpel applied gently to the skein of mystery to cautiously reveal each layer of truth.
Giving up, in the end, is JUST giving up, and you fulfill nothing, prove nothing, and only serve to disappoint and encourage the concept that you will
give up when things don't go your way.
Don't give up, only cede if you find you should.
Oh, and there is ALWAYS hope.
I've just about had it trying to have you look at this from an objective view, because you just want to believe it and thus it can be blatantly wrong
and as long as the world is happy believing it, it will be real. Just disgusts me.
You haven't been objective, you have been trying to prove to others that their beliefs are wrong. You push on the wall, and it pushes back, it is
common physics knowledge. The more energy you put into punching the wall, the more energy hits your hand.
You haven't even responded to some very good, scientific evidence in this topic which is rather supportive of "Will Empowered Change". If you
don't address the things which are local to your understanding of the universe, how can we accept that you are being "OBJECTIVE"?
Also, an idea getting more and more support in quantum physics is that we are leaving the scientific era of particle physics behind us, and start to
realize that all that exists can be defined as wave functions. Even our physical atoms are build of vibrating energy, wave functions. Our thoughts are
also wave functions. Can you see how thought can interact with all other 'material'? I know, I do not post any scientific references here, but the
open minded person will be able to find the information needed
Wave form interference is an excellent supportive argument for "Will powered reality alteration". This is why I brought the field of quantum
physics to the fore, this is cutting edge research providing some rather spooky realizations to most physicists. Recall, Physicists are often very
static in what they understand, it is necessary for what they do. Imagine the years of training and learning that went into their field, and imagine
what Quantum Physics is doing to their brains.