Egyptian Stone Vases-The Smoking Gun In The Advanced Technology Debate?

More unverified claims made by a person with an agenda, as I said.

Can you show a microscopic view of these "spiral" grooves? No.

Do you believe that, if you use a hand-driven tube drill, no grooves would be left on the stone? They would.

Will stopping and replenishing the sand not result in a new spiral groove on the wall of the hole that has already been cut? Absolutely.

Harte

reply to post by Harte


you're getting desperate and the moron giving you the star is just as bad.

Petrie is the one who described the spiral groove feed rate data, Dunn verified it and then went on to suggest it was done with ultrasonic drilling methods and diagramed how it would work which makes this even more high tech than Petrie could have imagined.

Originally posted by Hanslune

Originally posted by mcx1942
reply to post by Harte

 

I never said I 'refuse' to accept the evidence.

All though well put together evidence, it is still theoretical.

Just like all the other theories put forth for the history of Ancient Egypt.

I have logged all the information that Hans has provided under theoretical because that is what it is.

You don't seem to know what theory is and what fact is

physical marks on the stones are facts. hand working stones leaves marks that are different from marks left by tooling- that's a fact and if you need someone to verify that then you are just stonewalling a lost cause.

reply to post by Hanslune

that link resolved nothing. you're such a poseur

Hand waving, this time with a few arm flaps.

Harte

Originally posted by Harte
Hand waving, this time with a few arm flaps.

Harte

I'll take that as a concession. You know you can't dispute the marks because there is no way around the fact they were caused by high speed tools and that is the slippery slope you guys just don't want to go down. It's simple but impossible to get around and you know it.

Originally posted by bottleslingguy

Originally posted by Harte
Hand waving, this time with a few arm flaps.

Harte

I'll take that as a concession. You know you can't dispute the marks because there is no way around the fact they were caused by high speed tools and that is the slippery slope you guys just don't want to go down. It's simple but impossible to get around and you know it.

More hand waving again.

These marks have been completely explained, according to every detail you've provided.

Of course, you can't provide any of the requested detail.

Just the waving.

Harte

reply to post by bottleslingguy


These marks could have been done slowly, there was some guy buzzing holes in a rock a while back. It was not fast but could do the job. The tools are there in the museums. Sure wasn't going to be done with a drill

Will

Originally posted by Harte

Originally posted by bottleslingguy

Originally posted by Harte
Hand waving, this time with a few arm flaps.

Harte

I'll take that as a concession. You know you can't dispute the marks because there is no way around the fact they were caused by high speed tools and that is the slippery slope you guys just don't want to go down. It's simple but impossible to get around and you know it.

More hand waving again.

These marks have been completely explained, according to every detail you've provided.

Of course, you can't provide any of the requested detail.

Just the waving.

Harte

what are you talking about? nothing you've provided has been conclusive. could you do me a favor and show me where someone demonstrates how hand tooling leaves high speed marks?

reply to post by bottleslingguy


I can provide a link to low speed marks of that ilk but seems this forum is dedicated avoiding uncomfortable possibilities

seen it done , there are also vids of the process, of course the orthodixy prefers people to debate high end machines and advanced tech, carry on it keeps the mystery trade running

Will

Originally posted by will2learn
reply to post by bottleslingguy

 

I can provide a link to low speed marks of that ilk but seems this forum is dedicated avoiding uncomfortable possibilities

seen it done , there are also vids of the process, of course the orthodixy prefers people to debate high end machines and advanced tech, carry on it keeps the mystery trade running

Will

what are we in third grade? I have the answer but I won't show you. Every thing these guys provide as proof always says "inconclusive"

reply to post by bottleslingguy


Its not inconclusive when you can see tools that the ancients clearly possessed burrowing into stone. Seems posting a link to such things got Mr Jordan booted from the site. wouldn't want to go the same way

Will

Originally posted by bottleslingguy

Originally posted by Harte

Originally posted by bottleslingguy

Originally posted by Harte
Hand waving, this time with a few arm flaps.

Harte

I'll take that as a concession. You know you can't dispute the marks because there is no way around the fact they were caused by high speed tools and that is the slippery slope you guys just don't want to go down. It's simple but impossible to get around and you know it.

More hand waving again.

These marks have been completely explained, according to every detail you've provided.

Of course, you can't provide any of the requested detail.

Just the waving.

Harte

what are you talking about? nothing you've provided has been conclusive. could you do me a favor and show me where someone demonstrates how hand tooling leaves high speed marks?

How about you support the claim that these are "high speed marks?"

And not with another quote from Dunn.

You criticize the evidence I and others have provided, while providing absolutely nothing to back up your own claims.

This is called trolling.

Harte

Originally posted by will2learn
reply to post by bottleslingguy

 

Its not inconclusive when you can see tools that the ancients clearly possessed burrowing into stone. Seems posting a link to such things got Mr Jordan booted from the site. wouldn't want to go the same way

Will

have you ever seen those tools recreate high speed tool marks? those links say at one point or another it was inconclusive, I'm not saying it is inconclusive.

Originally posted by Harte

Originally posted by bottleslingguy

Originally posted by Harte

Originally posted by bottleslingguy

Originally posted by Harte
Hand waving, this time with a few arm flaps.

Harte

I'll take that as a concession. You know you can't dispute the marks because there is no way around the fact they were caused by high speed tools and that is the slippery slope you guys just don't want to go down. It's simple but impossible to get around and you know it.

More hand waving again.

These marks have been completely explained, according to every detail you've provided.

Of course, you can't provide any of the requested detail.

Just the waving.

Harte

what are you talking about? nothing you've provided has been conclusive. could you do me a favor and show me where someone demonstrates how hand tooling leaves high speed marks?

How about you support the claim that these are "high speed marks?"

And not with another quote from Dunn.

You criticize the evidence I and others have provided, while providing absolutely nothing to back up your own claims.

This is called trolling.

Harte

edit on 12/8/2012 by Harte because: (no reason given)

"evidence" you've provided has been baloney. take one of the diagrams for example of the core drill bow saw. Don't you think the wooden stick shaft would grind down before the granite? This all sounds easy on paper but so far I haven't seen anything actually being replicated to these levels of sophistication.

Originally posted by bottleslingguy

Originally posted by Harte

Originally posted by bottleslingguy

Originally posted by Harte

Originally posted by bottleslingguy

Originally posted by Harte
Hand waving, this time with a few arm flaps.

Harte

I'll take that as a concession. You know you can't dispute the marks because there is no way around the fact they were caused by high speed tools and that is the slippery slope you guys just don't want to go down. It's simple but impossible to get around and you know it.

More hand waving again.

These marks have been completely explained, according to every detail you've provided.

Of course, you can't provide any of the requested detail.

Just the waving.

Harte

what are you talking about? nothing you've provided has been conclusive. could you do me a favor and show me where someone demonstrates how hand tooling leaves high speed marks?

How about you support the claim that these are "high speed marks?"

And not with another quote from Dunn.

You criticize the evidence I and others have provided, while providing absolutely nothing to back up your own claims.

This is called trolling.

Harte

edit on 12/8/2012 by Harte because: (no reason given)

"evidence" you've provided has been baloney. take one of the diagrams for example of the core drill bow saw. Don't you think the wooden stick shaft would grind down before the granite? This all sounds easy on paper but so far I haven't seen anything actually being replicated to these levels of sophistication.

Are you proof reading what you're typing? I suppose if you're trying to drill into granite with a wooden shaft/boring bit, you will probably grind down the stick, you're right. However, the thread is discussing using copper tubes as the boring bit, and with abrasives and time you will erode/drill the stone away.

Perhaps you would be better off trying to explain how Ed Leedskalnin created coral castle. I think if you can explain how he drilled and moved the stones there, you could then compare his technology to the egyptians.

Coral Castle

Please explain why power tools weren't used on this unfinished calcite vase.




Note the exterior - it's rough-hewn. The vase was never cored.

Think a power tool leaves marks like that?

Why used pounding tools to shape the exterior, when power tools are lying around unused?

Harte

reply to post by bottleslingguy


You guys keep biting on the red herrings of high speed tools and hard materials but many of the marks and finishes that can not be recreated with the tools advocated by the mainstream abrasives, chisels and hammer stones can be explained by intense beams of light. Chris Jordan was graciously showing the methods.

Intense beams of light can be created with lasers, lenses or parabolic dishes. The dishes were the most potent up until a decade or two ago. There are plenty of guys showing whats possible with each on the net. The laser etching of granite can be carried out nice and slow so can the dish work. No hard materials or high speed mechanics is needed. The Ancient Solar Premise puts it all into the ancient perspective, explaining countless mysteries with the techniques. Glazing, vitrifying, vaporizing, fracturing and even writing in stone are all possible.

These devices are on display in the museums there is not a single high speed advanced or precision mechanical device as advocated by Dunn. Nor is there a single working device based on Dunn's principles. Watkins, Lindroth and Jordan's devices work. What museum pieces has ever been brought out to support advanced precision tools.

Will

Originally posted by Philippines

Originally posted by bottleslingguy

Originally posted by Harte

Originally posted by bottleslingguy

Originally posted by Harte

Originally posted by bottleslingguy

Originally posted by Harte
Hand waving, this time with a few arm flaps.

Harte

I'll take that as a concession. You know you can't dispute the marks because there is no way around the fact they were caused by high speed tools and that is the slippery slope you guys just don't want to go down. It's simple but impossible to get around and you know it.

More hand waving again.

These marks have been completely explained, according to every detail you've provided.

Of course, you can't provide any of the requested detail.

Just the waving.

Harte

what are you talking about? nothing you've provided has been conclusive. could you do me a favor and show me where someone demonstrates how hand tooling leaves high speed marks?

How about you support the claim that these are "high speed marks?"

And not with another quote from Dunn.

You criticize the evidence I and others have provided, while providing absolutely nothing to back up your own claims.

This is called trolling.

Harte

edit on 12/8/2012 by Harte because: (no reason given)

"evidence" you've provided has been baloney. take one of the diagrams for example of the core drill bow saw. Don't you think the wooden stick shaft would grind down before the granite? This all sounds easy on paper but so far I haven't seen anything actually being replicated to these levels of sophistication.

Are you proof reading what you're typing? I suppose if you're trying to drill into granite with a wooden shaft/boring bit, you will probably grind down the stick, you're right. However, the thread is discussing using copper tubes as the boring bit, and with abrasives and time you will erode/drill the stone away.

Perhaps you would be better off trying to explain how Ed Leedskalnin created coral castle. I think if you can explain how he drilled and moved the stones there, you could then compare his technology to the egyptians.

Coral Castle

I was talking about the stone on the top part of the stick that puts the down pressure on the drill bit. Petrie said at one time you'd need like two tons of pressure to make some of the cuts or maybe it was the feed rate of the bit, either way once you put the wooden stick in the middle of all that friction and pressure the stick is gonna loose every time. there's also the problem with cleaning out the debris as you cut. in many situations the stone should have been turned either on it's side or upside down and you never see it depicted or demonstrated that way.

as far as the Coral Castle guy he said he knew the secrets of the Pyramids. I agree with Dunn on many points as far as in many cases ultrasonic drilling was used and Leedskalnin probably knew how to do it and it most likely had something to do with that box on top of the tripod. I see Leedskalnin and Marko Rodin on the same page. Leedskalnin's flower of life electron pattern is very similar to Rodin's wave propagation across a torus.

reply to post by will2learn

I support the idea that a wide range of high tech tools were used early on and later after the owners of the technology left the people tried to emulate their work.