'Witches' link to Cornwall sex abuse case

Originally posted by soficrow
reply to post by Merriman Weir

 

I really do not think pedophilia has had quite the reach historically as it does today, nor do I think pedophilia is caused by "backward beliefs." imho - sexual/erectile dysfunction is a common symptom of our globe's "Chronic Disease" Pandemic. Unfortunately, neither the pandemic nor the commonness of erectile dysfunction are properly acknowledged so a lot of confused guys are running around looking for the 'right' stimulation to themselves up and off. Hence we have concurrent pandemics of pedophilia, S&M, etc.

You're missing the point of the thread. I don't believe that 'backward beliefs' are the issue. I actually stated that I was posting this in contrast to the all the accusations I read regarding Muslim paedophiles where people try and link their Muslim beliefs with the acts of paedophilia in a kind of 'oh noes, their Muslimistic ways lead to fiddling with kids!!!!1'. Sometimes people forget (or ignore) that good old 'British' beliefs like Christianity or, like here, some form of Witchcraft, also have followers that are too fond sexual intimacies with under-age people.

Originally posted by Watchfull
I would be very surprised if the witches child sex abuse ring were anywhere near as blatant as the Rochdale Muslim ring.

How do you not know if they were associates of the Illuminati? They do this stuff all the time.

After all, the judge did want it kept hushed...

The case started on Monday but Judge Graham Cottle imposed a legal order postponing coverage of the case until an undetermined future date.

Originally posted by Freeborn
reply to post by Merriman Weir

 

There IS a disproportionate problem with paedophilia and sex abuse within those of rural Pakistani origin - there's nothing racist about recognising and accepting this, it in no way implies that there is a disproportionate problem with all Muslims.
And we will never begin the process of reducing the risk and instances of paedophilia until we ALL accept the facts and realities without rancour and bigotry.

I think I was the first on the threads here to really argue the specifics about the Rochdale case(s), that not only was it not a Muslim issue, it wasn't even a Pakistani issue as a lot of the men came from the same poor, relatively rural area and seemed to have transplanted a community (and their 'way of life/thinking') from one place to another. Unfortunately, I was having to do that because, people do see this as a "disproportionate problem with all Muslims."

This process ceased with the apparent mishandling of the McAlpine affair - the facts of which just don't make sense when any reasonable level of scrutiny is applied.

I agree and I've commented on this myself on several threads. Baffling, truly, baffling.

The public were convinced of the BBC's malpractice and the appointment of a new overseer seems to have reigned the Beeb in.

Well, to be fair, all the right wing press didn't really give the public an alternative. It's been open season on the BBC since 2010.

And then a dead, fat, Liberal politician who conveniently represented an already tainted community has been offered up as a lamb to slaughter which seems to satisfy the publics lust for blood.

Not so sure about this. As I've said before, I'm only a couple of miles from Rochdale, and there's nothing really convenient about Cyril Smith. It was an open secret up here and one which Smith had threatened to sue small local press over on a couple of occasions. The 'lust for Smith's blood' existed before the Rochdale Muslim cases and before most people were aware of the Savile stories.

It seemed to me that the revelations were part of an organised process whose purpose has yet to be revealed, however, this process was hamstringed by the McAlpine affair with the overall result of a few dead or has-been minor celebrities and an irrelevant MP's reputations tarnished and discredited - but no more discussion about the doings of both past and present politicians and their nefarious associates.

Having worked in a local propaganda unit, I can't deny that this happens. The overall aim of this is not unique to this kind of scenario though, it's the nature of elitism. Think how many middle-managers will always be thrown under the bus before a director gets the push. There will be a whole dressing room of Freddie Starrs banged-up before someone of MacAlpine's stature gets to see the inside of a prison.

MSM leap on instances like this in Cornwall to maintain the illusion that paedophilia is a rare occurrence and generally only practiced by those already outside of the usual social norms or the poor and depraved - whereas the troth is unfortunately much different.

Not sure about this, I think any story only increases the public's awareness and underline the fact that it's not a rarity. If anything these stories work the other way. It creates the impression that they are everywhere: whether it's paedophiles, Muslim terrorists, benefit cheats, or communists (included the latter for the Americans following the thread).

The conspiracy theorist in me can not help but wonder that there appears to be two seperate agenda's at play and not being able to resist the odd piece of wild speculation I can't but help wonder if there is some sort of schism or disagreement within the ranks of 'the establishment'?

The conspiracy theorist in me thinks this all the time. 'Unified conspiracy theories of everything' don't make any sense to me. The idea that one cabal can ever really run anything doesn't make sense and disregards human nature. People shaft each other constantly, or will try to, wherever there's power or money. Look at the history of Royalty, the history of the mafia, the boardrooms of Big Business. Reptilian overlords aside, even our elites are human with all human flaws. We acknowledge they're greedy bastards from the start, it's not unreasonable to think that some are greedier than others and are willing to sell out even their own kind.

Originally posted by Kandinsky
reply to post by Merriman Weir


The best way we have, to tackle them all, is on a case-by-case basis with no prejudice regarding status, colour or religion.

The whole point of the thread was to point out that as this cuts across all strata of society: rich, poor, black, white, 'native', 'foreigners', Muslim, Christian, 'witches'. It was offered in contrast to all the 'Muslim paedo menace!!!1 stories I'm sick of seeing here and elsewhere.

As it impacts all areas of life and demographics we can't do anything else other than look at this on a case-by-case basis.

Originally posted by Rapha
This sounds like 2 stupid old country bumkins got bored and tried to rape someone.

Country bumkin police force notices a book on witchcraft and then join imaginary dots together.

At this rate we will soon have a lynch mob.

Look, its cold here in Cornwall. It gets dark early at 16:30 and people are bored.

i live 6 miles from Falmouth and these idiots probably wouldn't even know what a demon looks like let alone doing their own witchcraft.

Shallow minded old men are often turned on by young girls.

edit on 28-11-2012 by Rapha because: (no reason given)

Yeah, because you only get people interested in witchcraft, paganism, heathenism in them big cities with their cars and their buses and their big fancy shops that don't sell pasties or scones.

I live along the edge of the Pennines, it gets cold and dark here, too.

Originally posted by Charmeine
Why are people so quick to judge an entire race or religion when this case seems to only involve a few sick and twisted individuals? Just because these men claim they are Pagans, doesn't mean that all Pagans are involved in cult rituals like this. As someone who has personally studied various religions and practices, I find it disheartening when people are so quick to blame religion, rather than laying blame where it belongs - on the few disgusting men who committed the crime.

Most people who claim to be witches practice white magic, and work on healing others. As for Pagans, the only difference there is Pagans believe in multiple deities, instead of just one God. This part might be a little off topic but I find those who are quick to judge things they don't understand.

edit on 28-11-2012 by Charmeine because: (no reason given)

edit on 28-11-2012 by Charmeine because: (no reason given)

Nobody is here. I created this thread because of the amount of stories (here and elsewhere) where entire religions and races are getting smeared. There's a lot of people determined to join too many dots regarding Muslim paedophile stories.

Also, I probably know a lot more about 'paganism' than you might think I do.

Originally posted by icmom
Why on Earth is religion always brought into the mix with child molesting? I was a foster parent for a few and most of the children in my care had been molested at some point. There was no difference between religion, income or race. The only thing these adults had in common was their sickness.

Most people don't point fingers at religion, to be fair. Nobody is seriously trying to tie Savile's activities to any belief in a sky-god somewhere (although some people have tried to pin this on him supposedly being a super-secret Mason). However, all that said, there are some vocal people trying to make a big deal about some paedophiles Muslim religion. Which is why I started this thread.

I don't have time to reply to all the other posts on this thread but there's some confusion here that I'd hoped to avoid with the initial posts on the thread. I'm not blaming witches, pagans, or any religion for the acts of paedophiles. In fact, that was the point of the thread: people have been very quick to try and draw a link between religious beliefs and acts of paedophilia, or rather a specific religious belief.

reply to post by Merriman Weir

people have been very quick to try and draw a link between religious beliefs and acts of paedophilia, or rather a specific religious belief.

There is most definitely a link there. Any belief system that regress sexual needs end up producing a large number of paedophiles

reply to post by Merriman Weir

OK, so your thread is not about the article you linked in your OP. I still think the idea that the BBC are pointing the finger at "witches" should be addressed as these scumbags probably are not even witches.

Is it just part of the divide and rule or are they hoping to distract us from their own wrongdoings?
It seems to me that all paedophiles have always been protected, even when they end up in prison it's often a joke how long they get.

We need to be looking at who is protecting them, in my view only a paedophile would protect a paedophile.

I would never put down a whole group of people for the actions of a few unless that group are a paedophile ring of course.
I don't like talking about these things but thanks for giving me a chance to get that off my chest.

reply to post by Merriman Weir


I didn't mean you specifically - was referring to the article itself. Media always tries to make people who practice the Occult out to be Satanists or "weirdos" mainly because they lack information. People are afraid of things they don't understand.

Originally posted by dominicus
reply to post by Merriman Weir

 

people have been very quick to try and draw a link between religious beliefs and acts of paedophilia, or rather a specific religious belief.

There is most definitely a link there. Any belief system that regress sexual needs end up producing a large number of paedophiles

Unfortunately for your argument, I'm not really aware of any form of witchcraft or paganism as it's practised in the western world that sees sex in a repressive or regressive way.

Also, unlike Abrahamic religions, the vast majority of people aren't born into witchcraft traditions (despite the ZOMFG! my mother and grandmother were witches and my great-grandmother was burned at Salem! type claims): they go into it knowing what it all entails.

Originally posted by LEL01
reply to post by Merriman Weir

 

OK, so your thread is not about the article you linked in your OP. I still think the idea that the BBC are pointing the finger at "witches" should be addressed as these scumbags probably are not even witches.

Is it just part of the divide and rule or are they hoping to distract us from their own wrongdoings?
It seems to me that all paedophiles have always been protected, even when they end up in prison it's often a joke how long they get.

We need to be looking at who is protecting them, in my view only a paedophile would protect a paedophile.

I would never put down a whole group of people for the actions of a few unless that group are a paedophile ring of course.
I don't like talking about these things but thanks for giving me a chance to get that off my chest.

No offence, but your post is a little confusing. Firstly, the BBC story is hardly a 'burn the witches' story. It doesn't really sensationalise witchcraft at all. All the elements in the story ring true for me, even the hand binding, and knives/athame are a basic of witchcraft rituals as anyone with a passing knowledge of forms of withcraft understands. They claim they're witches, why couldn't they be, because they're also charged with paedophilia? That's an argument that I've seen used with Islam and Christianity: they're not 'real' Muslims or 'real' Christians because a real Muslim/Christian wouldn't be a paedophile.

Or is it because they're not women and comform to some stereotype: ex-Buffy viewer, middle-aged ex-hippy 'earth goddess', cat owner, PhD student in Mediaeval Studies and so on?

You can make the same accusation against anyone who says they're a witch: well, they say they are...

We have to accept that paedophiles come in all shapes and sizes and might be atheists, cargo cult members, or whatever.

Again, neither I nor the BBC are guilty of generalising and ascribing the acts of the few to a broader demographic. It wasn't in this story and I've been arguing against such a thing throughout all the paedophile threads on here.

Where are the BBC actually "pointing the finger" here? By actually reporting that these people claimed to be witches? They can't win. Usually the argument is what's the BBC hiding? Why aren't they telling us these bastards are black/Asian/Muslims/whatever, they're in league with them! They're hiding them! The BBC are all black/Asian/Muslims/whatever or are scared of black/Asian/Muslims/whatever.

Originally posted by Charmeine
reply to post by Merriman Weir

 

I didn't mean you specifically - was referring to the article itself. Media always tries to make people who practice the Occult out to be Satanists or "weirdos" mainly because they lack information. People are afraid of things they don't understand.

edit on 29-11-2012 by Charmeine because: (no reason given)

I didn't see any of that in this story though. No real sensationalising at all or reporting anything that might not appear in any kind of ritual or appear in anyone's house if they had an active interest in witchcraft (books, athame, gowns, etc).

Were the BBC not to mention the witchcraft element at all? If they didn't and the witchcraft elements reported elsewhere, the BBC would have been accused of hiding something. If these men are paedophiles, why shouldn't the mechanism in which they were able to abuse kids (the lure/grooming technique looks to have been the witchcraft itself) be mentioned. Try and imagine how the Savile stories would have looked if all the paedophile claims were made but the part as how he was gaining access to kids and exerting influence over the kids was missed out? The public would be understandably furious.

reply to post by Merriman Weir


Now I'm confused and I feel insulted by your post, please see my first post in this thread on page 2.
I don't need you to tell me that paedophiles come in all shapes and sizes.

Getting involved in coven/ritual type scenarios is a minefield at any stage. Naive youngsters will always be easy pickings sadly. Obviously most groups would keep their house clean and in good order, but at some point or other you'll always find the odd heavy breather that's there for the titties and little too enthusiastic over the five fold kiss.

Originally posted by Suspiria
Getting involved in coven/ritual type scenarios is a minefield at any stage. Naive youngsters will always be easy pickings sadly. Obviously most groups would keep their house clean and in good order, but at some point or other you'll always find the odd heavy breather that's there for the titties and little too enthusiastic over the five fold kiss.

Yep. That's why it's best to just stick with the goblet/athame symbolism. The only person I give a pentacle "salute" to is my wife.

Well it looks like the witches have been found guilty and will probably die in jail.

news.sky.com...

Two men have been jailed for a total of 32 years after sexually abusing several children as part of a witches' coven in Cornwall during the 1970s.

Peter Petrauske, 72, and Jack Kemp, 69, were said to have donned ceremonial robes and pagan paraphernalia before abusing young girls.

Police believe one of their victims may have been as young as three.