Finlands education system ranked number one. #2 South Korea #3 Hong Kong.

Finlands education system ranked number one. #2 South Korea #3 Hong Kong.

www.bbc.co.uk

The UK's education system is ranked sixth best in the developed world, according to a global league table published by education firm Pearson.

The first and second places are taken by Finland and South Korea.

The rankings combine international test results and data such as graduation rates between 2006 and 2010.

(visit the link for the full news article)


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If you go on to read the story you can you a picture of South Korean parents praying for their children's grades.

I never had my parents pray for my grades...

So one could argue that it's a difference in culture and work ethic.

But

Oh no, on the other side of the world Finland is ranked #1, so it's a not a east vs west issue.


Thoughts ATS.


SS

www.bbc.co.uk
(visit the link for the full news article)

I wonder how much money these places put in their school systems and how qualified the teachers are?

Call me crazy, but there just might be a correlation.

Lol now i have national pride We do respect a lot teachers and they have a good eduacation to start with.

In Finland, a master's degree is required to be a teacher at any level, including the primary grades.

Mostly the classes are about 20 pupils in size, no one is left behind, if some one needs more help in learning he/she gets that without waiting. I guess the most important thing is in a view how kids needs to be teached, all kids are equal and no one gets special attention by the wealth or social status. Teachers want kids to do much team work and bond with each other and they make new groups so they get to know and respect every member of their class.


Also there is a free meal to everyone at school, its healthy food, no hamburgers or pizzas are served here and in schools there is a stand-up tables for vegetable salad. You can eat as much as you want. If schoolday is long there is also a fruit as a snack.

at 1st and 2nd grade schoolday is only 4 hours long,

If your homework takes more than a hour then you get too much homework and teacher slows down the speed, in lower grades.

My kid is 8 and he has allready read one mathbook this season, 2 books of readings, he have read his reading diploma for this year ( contains 6 books ) and starts his super diploma soon ( voluntary ).

Originally posted by TheOneElectric
I wonder how much money these places put in their school systems and how qualified the teachers are?

Call me crazy, but there just might be a correlation.

Finland is a relative new comer to the top of the education league and has a completely different system to either South Korea or Hong Kong (which have similarities )

Another interesting article on the topic:
What Americans Keep Ignoring About Finland`s School Success

reply to post by TheOneElectric


Not much more as a percentage of GDP than the US

23 Finland: 6.4%
37 United States: 5.7%

But looking at that list you'd think money spent has no real affect on returns at all given who is spending the most and who is spending the least. www.nationmaster.com...

Great that Finland can boast 100% literacy rate. I dont even think universities in the US can make that claim.

reply to post by thisguyrighthere


That's a huge difference... .7% of GDP...if the US were to equal Finland's spending they would be putting something like another hundred billion into education.

US GDP = 16T x .007 = 112 Billion



Finland pays higher taxes, which probably accounts for some of the difference.

reply to post by PatrickGarrow17


That's not a huge difference at all.

That 100 billion gets gutted by bureaucracy, spread across over 100,000 public schools, tens of thousands of other state and community colleges and universities.

In a pile it seems like a lot of money. Once spread out over every pair of grubby mitts grabbing at it it's barely statistically significant.

Tax me 100% for education and I guarantee all else equal that our education system would suck just as bad except every classroom would have neat white boards and every student will have an iPad to pawn.

Money is not the solution. Not by a long shot.

Asking for more money to fix the schools is like asking for an AWB and a registry to fix violent crime. It's the last refuge of a man without ideas.

reply to post by PatrickGarrow17


You don´t serve free meals in US to all students there, if we take away the money which is used to kids meals we propably spend less than US. Eduacation to one student cost 6604 euros by year.

I just peeked in my sons mathbook, they learn mathematical thinking a lot and play math games with that book. Today his math homework took 3 minutes and usually all homeworks takes 5-15 minutes totally per day,

If parent wants to see what they do at school they are welcome to spend a day or week or hour in the classroom. So parents know exactly how they kid works in the group and how teaching is done. Working in the groups kids also help each others and when learning is fun they love school.

Hello all.


Thanks for the great replies so far, I would like to add this as I think it could add to the discussion.

Major difference in Finland's and America's education system ( the west )

- They rarely take exams or do homework until they are well into their teens.

- The children are not measured at all for the first six years of their education.

- There is only one mandatory standardized test in Finland, taken when children are 16.

- All children, clever or not, are taught in the same classrooms.





- Finland spends around 30 percent less per student than the United States.


Here's a link to the full article. Why Finland's Unorthodox Education



stars for all


SS

Originally posted by Spike Spiegle
- Finland spends around 30 percent less per student than the United States.

Their teachers are paid less too.

The average starting salary for a Finnish teacher was $29,000 in 2008
The average starting salary for a Finnish teacher was $29,000 in 2008

Compared with $36,000 in the United States.

Read more: www.businessinsider.com...

It's not that Finland's teaching system is that good, it's just that the Finns learn easier than other people Hey, I'm a yooper Finn, We are the easiest people to potty train in the world. We learn how to drink very easily too.

reply to post by Spike Spiegle


From the article in your OP.. I think this is one key bit..

Looking at education systems that succeed, the study concludes that spending is important, but not as much as having a culture that is supportive of learning...........
........
Looking at the two top countries - Finland and South Korea - the report says that there are many big differences, but the common factor is a shared social belief in the importance of education and its "underlying moral purpose".

I can't say I've ever been to Finland or South Korea. However, I live in the US, and the quoted above goes a loooooonnng way to explaining why the US is 17th out of 20 on the list. The US is just above Hungary, Slovakia and Russia. I'd expect at least one of those to pass the US soon as I just don't see the current culture of the US placing much value on education.

I am from Australia and as a counselor who specializes in children I see a lot of educational problems.

In Australia we have both private and public schools. There are differences but not necessarily the ones you think. We have many great public schools that teach and teach well. But, we are slipping, in public schools only.

So ask the important question. What makes the difference between schools.

In the US, so much of the education system is driven by profit. So many times we see school decisions based on getting the students to school so they can be counted as in school so the budget is maintained. Education driven by profit sucks big balls.

There are two primary things that Finland is doing right. The first is that the education system is based on learning outcomes for the entire population. Learning outcomes are vastly different from test outcomes. Test outcomes are based on which school is better / which school gets more children and thus we are back to profit.

Finland does not care about profits because there are not any profit generators in the system.

So, back to the important question, what makes the difference.

Parental attitude

In Australia, the parents that send their children to a private school want their children to achieve. Provide a whole school where the attitude of the parents as a collective is that the children need a good education and you can let peer pressure do the rest for you.

It is not only peer pressure on the children but it is peer pressure on the teachers and the whole school by the parents.

Finland has a system based on achievements in learning, they have engaged the children to do their best, whatever that may be and critically, they have engaged the parents.

Of course their scores will be at the top. That is a function of averages. In the US, the top % of students who work to achieve score well, the middling students keep the scores at an OK level and then the bottom % drag the scores way down.

OP, thank you for a great thread, It is of great interest to me.

Finland, well done, well done indeed.

I have always been happy with my children as long as they do their best. Scores do not matter. All children are different and we should celebrate those differences.

P

And to think that US was number one in education back in the 70s and school lunches were free for all and made from with fresh ingredients.

I guess as the lunches has deteriorated so the level of education in the nation along with the modification of school material by certain watch dog specific groups.

I am glad that at least other nations put their children education at the top over bureaucracy.

Originally posted by pheonix358

Parental attitude

Finland has a system based on achievements in learning, they have engaged the children to do their best, whatever that may be and critically, they have engaged the parents.
***
I have always been happy with my children as long as they do their best. Scores do not matter. All children are different and we should celebrate those differences.

P

You are absolutely right ! Parents are guided too. First thing what happens when kid comes from school is taking a break, playing and kinda resetting the day after school, one to two hours is recommened and then small snack and homework. When kid has done his homework parents check them so teachers don´t have to waste teaching hours to check everyones homeworks. Well this doesn´t take much time as kid didn´t spend much time either, if you feel that he/she needs a bit more focusing on some subject you tell teacher about it and write it in the small notebook kid has in his schoolbag, but you are not recommened to teach yourself, only checking, observing and giving notes.

South Korean Education system.

System and School Organization Education Finance School for all children between the ages of six and fifteen is free. Senior high schools, for students aged fifteen to eighteen, do charge tuition fees in order to supplement government funding, but these fees do not appear burdensome enough to prevent students from attending. School funding is very centralized, with local school systems deriving 80% of their revenue from the central Ministry of Education, Science and Technology (MEST) budget. The local systems are also funded to a much smaller degree through revenue transferred from local governing bodies, internal assets, locally issued bonds, school admission fees and tuition. The Metropolitan and Provincial Offices of Education can spend the money from MEST as they see fit, though it is a matter of funds being transferred to a lower level of the same overall organization rather than an intergovernmental transfer of funds. The central ministry directly funds teachers’ salaries in elementary and lower secondary school as well as preschool programs.

Education system





SS

I have two years teaching experience in the South Korean High School System and let me tell you, it is a prison for the mind!

I have never met so many students with grey hair, there is also a very high rate of teenage suicide related to the pressures of high school. Many students, including middle school students are required to study for around 12 hours a day. It is all rote learning. The students work extremely hard during High School years to achieve entry to university, then they can relax and party.

How can this be a good system?

While I realize that my experience is totally anecdotal, I struggle to comprehend that their system is ranked in the top three.

reply to post by deessell


Thank you for the perspective, yes school is very harsh in South Korea.

I have a friend who moved there to follow a professional gaming career, as you most likely know they have the biggest and fastest growing gaming culture on earth.

Internet cafe's are really all you see in downtown Seoul.


They game a lot to relieve the stresses and demands of modern Korean life.


SS

Originally posted by TheOneElectric
I wonder how much money these places put in their school systems and how qualified the teachers are?

Call me crazy, but there just might be a correlation.

Finland has very good programs, equalizing ones, and college/university is free. The only downfall at all to the country is the mandatory military service, but they have a history of invasion by Russia and Sweden.