Romans 10:9

reply to post by Aesir26


Okay. The verses have been laid out and we have some meaning behind the names. Paint a mental picture of all of this and connect it to our day and age. Show the players in the story and why this means for us today in your opinion. After you get the story presented, connect it to salvation for the world.

reply to post by EnochWasRight


When I have more time, I will do my best to paint the canvas.
For now, regarding salvation, it is important to understand that the Hebrew word for it is made up of the character Yodh (hand of god) + Esau.

Originally posted by Aesir26
reply to post by EnochWasRight

 

When I have more time, I will do my best to paint the canvas.
For now, regarding salvation, it is important to understand that the Hebrew word for it is made up of the character Yodh (hand of god) + Esau.

You guys know too much about this compared with me.. I very much wait your response.

Me being slow again..

Hand of God + the "bad" one?

Salvation = God reaching for you in the dark?

Hmm. Does this mean Salvation isn't the end point? It's the beginning point?

Once you are saved you are connected (consciously) and through that connection you will grow closer to the Goodness?

reply to post by Dustytoad


Esau is only bad from Israel/Judea's pespective.

Favoured by Isaac ("He laughs"), grandson of Abraham ("Father of many nations" -- Gentiles included);
prophesized to overthrow the burden of the yoke of Israel in the name of El Elyon, God Most High. A point of interest is that the name "Elyon" is actually "Olion", in Hebrew עליון . Which is "God Most High" or "Mountain dweller", an appellation of Orion the Hunter.

Seir is the place occupied by the Edomites, the dwelling of Esau.

Wikipedia: "Seir"

The term "Seir" was also used by the Egyptians to refer to the constellation Orion, which was considered to be a representation of the god Osiris in the heavens.

In Biblical Astronomy, Seir refers to the name of a star in the constellation Orion, which is considered to be a Messiah figure representing Christ.
In the Dendera Zodiac, the hawk symbol for Canis Major is identified by the term “Naz Seir”. This hawk symbol represents the star Sirius in Canis Major. In Egyptian, “Naz” means “Sent,” while “Seir” means “Prince” or “Chief.”
Therefore, the title “Naz Seir” can mean “Sent Prince.” Since “Naz” and “Zar” both mean “Prince” in Hebrew, Naz Seir could also mean “Prince of princes,” a fitting title for Jesus as the King of kings. This may also be the hidden origin of the term Nazarene used to identify Christ, the Naz, Zar, or Prince of Peace.

Originally posted by Aesir26
reply to post by EnochWasRight

 

When I have more time, I will do my best to paint the canvas.
For now, regarding salvation, it is important to understand that the Hebrew word for it is made up of the character Yodh (hand of god) + Esau.

I checked my lexicon and didn't see anything like that, but I did see the morphology of salvation as interesting. It starts with watch, as in the shepherd watching the sheep. It then moves from the root to rescue, cry, redeem and so on. From what I know of the thread that runs from Jacob to Christ and from Esau to Nimrod and then by connection to Babylon, I would see the distinction as being Jacob as the giver (Framer for truth - receiving as a gift from God) and Esau as the Hunter for truth (Taking - Mystery School). It originates with our hand stretching out for the tree of knowledge when God desired to give it to us as a gift.

Originally posted by Aesir26
reply to post by Dustytoad

 

Esau is only bad from Israel/Judea's pespective.

Favoured by Isaac ("He laughs"), grandson of Abraham ("Father of many nations" -- Gentiles included);
prophesized to overthrow the burden of the yoke of Israel in the name of El Elyon, God Most High. A point of interest is that the name "Elyon" is actually "Olion", in Hebrew עליון . Which is "God Most High" or "Mountain dweller", an appellation of Orion the Hunter.

Seir is the place occupied by the Edomites, the dwelling of Esau.

Wikipedia: "Seir"

The term "Seir" was also used by the Egyptians to refer to the constellation Orion, which was considered to be a representation of the god Osiris in the heavens.

In Biblical Astronomy, Seir refers to the name of a star in the constellation Orion, which is considered to be a Messiah figure representing Christ.

Orion, hunter, esau, being saved...

My mind just got blown by what just happened to me... I was reading over your post and I couldn't figure it out.. Why is this guy talking about Orion? As I am thinking this William Henry was in the background tallking about the Ark of the Covenant...

My thoughts went too fast, so I have to go all back through it, and will miss pieces. That was one Powerful flash.. C2C show with William Henry The part im on started at 51:00, but I think he starts at 45:00...

So he was talking about Solomon's temple about the main room, and then the room behind the veil. He just called the first room the holy place, and the room through a Stary veil (curtain) was the most holy. That was where the Ark was, with the Lord on the throne. He was like a luminous being or a rainbow being, a rainbow bridge between here and heaven.

So you must travel through the star gate to get to heaven. He was saying they could only enter on yom kipur. And that they actually go to the celestrial Zion.. William Henry is taking this all literally, and thinks this celestrial Zion is the center of the milky way.

Now it get's more interesting when he mentions that the Egyptians said you had to go through Orion to get there. Orion was the gateway to the throne.

Must go through him? Orion?

"none will get into the kingdom of heaven except through me"

Is it all so literal? Is the Messiah Some Orion, or Jesus who would be an edomite from the constellation Orion..

Or is there a deeper meaning here?


Seriously that just blew my mind having so much mythology hit me all at once, even involving terms from games long ago I played, while at the same time reading the exact same thing in your post...

I don't know if I said that all right, but I am still in Awe, and excitement.


So now, then... I cannot get to the Ark. I cannot go through any active temples. Parts of mythology tell me that you cannot pass through a star gate and live without having a full light body. This is something one must purify quite literally. The temple I am looking for is MY BODY... It houses the growing light body. Once I have that I can travel through Orion, on my way to the kingdom of heaven within.

Jesus came to me in a dream within a dream.. He said all these things in judgment of me, but not in condemnation.. And then he said to me (with his mind?) "You will be enlightened!" He said it so matter of factly and then he showed me my avatar (green spinning circle Mandala? Portal?)... I had fear in my heart and he left me.. Jesus is super intense/a little scary by the way..

One time in meditation I accidently had the thought and then found my mouth saying "Jesus come inside my heart." and then I said "Hi God." Saying those things in meditation sent energy surging through me like golden water light.. I must have actually connected with God as I always say...

Well maybe that's all I needed to do to create the portal the stargate within that let him in? So later on when he came into my dream within my dream that's how he got in..

So God's hand reached out to me.. I was reached.. I was touched.. Now it's up to me to "bridge" the gap..



Could there be forces here trying to keep men's souls dark so as to never leave?

I have a statement to make... I think I may have just turned into a Christian, or Egyptian.... ??

reply to post by Aesir26


So is this stuff in the bible?? I'm thinking about solomons temple and it's true meaning.. The most holy, and the holy?

Could you guys tell me which places to look broadly? Like is it Ezekial or where??

I think my girl has a bible somewhere...

My understanding has warped so hard in just one thread, and yet it as a whole it hasn't changed, but all the pieces are arranged better now..

Thanks guys.

reply to post by Dustytoad


I would say stargate is a good way to think about the relationship between your spirit and Christ. I like to think the Holy Spirit is always present in us but at times it does feel that we have received some extra power from the Holy Spirit.

Could there be forces here trying to keep men's souls dark so as to never leave?

Of course there are. They are your demons. Doubt, Fear, Anxiety, Greed, Envy. These are spiritual demons that we invite into our lives when we do the things we know we should not do. Or come into our lives because of the many lessons that have been taught us throughout our lives. Example the thief is filled with greed.

The bible makes it clear that we are born into sin and thus will inherit at least one if not all of these qualities. We were born broken, and there is only one repair shop. And it's through the stargate.

If you believe you have gotten this far let me know. I will try to keep up with this thread because I may have more to share, if you are interested.

reply to post by sacgamer25


I would like you to share way more... Did you notice the last bit of my post where I just said I am now a christian?

Do you know how weird that is to say for me? Or I mean how weird that would have been for me to say judging by my past, but now I am.??


I am that far and then some. It's a funny thing... I did it all on my own.. I'm a thinker.. I tested things out. Things work better in certain ways, and those ways are the ways that are not "mean, bad, unthoughtful, lazy"

Many Christians have a tendency to block god out of a shared experience (talking) by judging people and acting in false holiness..

So even though every thing Jesus ever said, and all the morality agrees with me, it took me this long to realize my thoughts were Christian thoughts...

More like I came from the beatles "Love is All and love is everyone" than any "holy" thing...

In response to EnochWasRight: עשו is "Esau". יעשו (Yodh + Esau) is "to bring about; to fulfill; to accomplish".
ישוע is "Yeshua". יושע is "saviour", both anagrams of such.

In response to DustyToad: ועיש is an anagram of Yeshua, meaning "Arcturus"
"Which maketh Arcturus, Orion, and Pleiades, and the chambers of the south." (Job 9:9)
"Canst thou guide Arcturus with his sons?" (Job 38:34)

Arcturus can be found in the "left knee" of the constellation Bootes, meaning "the Coming One," depicted as a plowman coming to harvest. The Hebrew word translated as "Arcturus" in Job comes from the same root word found in the Book of Joel discussing the return of Jesus (Joel 3:11) meaning, "to come to save/assemble".

Bootes, the shepherd/herdsman holds a sickle in one hand and a spear in the other. This is a sign of the coming Christ. Who is the herdsman, the man of the field: Esau/Jesus.

"And I looked, and behold a white cloud, and upon the cloud one sat like unto the Son of man, having on his head a golden crown, and in his hand a sharp sickle. ... And he that sat on the cloud thrust in his sickle on the earth; and the earth was reaped." (Revelation 14:14-16)

Another Arabic name of Arcturus is Haris-el-sema, from حارس السماء ħāris al-samā’ "the keeper of heaven."
(Wikipedia)

reply to post by Aesir26


Jacob/Israel is the Serpens Caput, or "Serpent's Head", which is crushed under the Herdsman's (Bootes') heel.
It is for this reason we assign the word, "caput" the meaning of, "to break"; "to fail"; and "to be destroyed".

Further still, Jacob, the "Heel-Catcher", is described as "smooth" and "bare", these being serpentine characteristics.

Destiny is written in the stars.

Originally posted by Dustytoad
reply to post by sacgamer25

 

I would like you to share way more... Did you notice the last bit of my post where I just said I am now a christian?

Do you know how weird that is to say for me? Or I mean how weird that would have been for me to say judging by my past, but now I am.??


I am that far and then some. It's a funny thing... I did it all on my own.. I'm a thinker.. I tested things out. Things work better in certain ways, and those ways are the ways that are not "mean, bad, unthoughtful, lazy"

Many Christians have a tendency to block god out of a shared experience (talking) by judging people and acting in false holiness..

So even though every thing Jesus ever said, and all the morality agrees with me, it took me this long to realize my thoughts were Christian thoughts...

More like I came from the beatles "Love is All and love is everyone" than any "holy" thing...

Hold on tight to the Truth, brother. Do not allow anyone, or especially anything, rip it from your grip. You now have a target on your back, thus I say with all respect, be extremely careful of practicing meditation.
The key is to not open your mind, lest you simply be a revolving door, whoring your spirit to whatever comes along. That is why most believers simply "pray", because it is a focused effort between yourself and God. As long as you are focused on Him and mindful of His parameters, nothing can interfere.
The closer you draw to the Holy Spirit, the greater the hedge of spiritual protection around you.

However, as you sincerely work out your salvation it will not be without trials, brother. But what price can you put on eternal life, especially in light of the mere moment we exist in this flesh?
Be wary of deception and test all things. Take it one day at a time. We are ALL works in progress because we are ALL flawed.

Continue to move towards Him, and He will never leave you or forsake you.
You seem like you would get along well with the ATS member Randyvs. He is a believer who is a down to earth, regular guy.

Originally posted by Aesir26


In response to DustyToad: ועיש is an anagram of Yeshua, meaning "Arcturus"
"Which maketh Arcturus, Orion, and Pleiades, and the chambers of the south." (Job 9:9)
"Canst thou guide Arcturus with his sons?" (Job 38:34)

Arcturus can be found in the "left knee" of the constellation Bootes, meaning "the Coming One," depicted as a plowman coming to harvest. The Hebrew word translated as "Arcturus" in Job comes from the same root word found in the Book of Joel discussing the return of Jesus (Joel 3:11) meaning, "to come to save/assemble".

Hmm Arcturus...

Sounds kind of like one of the rivers in the greek underworld.. Archeron.. Are the rivers maybe something in space? parts of the milky way maybe...

The five rivers of Hades are Acheron (the river of sorrow), Cocytus (the river of lamentation), Phlegethon (the river of fire), Lethe (the river of forgetfulness) and Styx (the river of hate), which forms the boundary between upper and lower worlds.

The more I think about it, what if each galaxy has a god... If this is taken literally we then see that we can get to the kingdom of heaven through Orion and all of that the Stargate thing..

The Earth isn't very close to heaven in this case.. Makes a lot of sense to me... A LOT. What's a little scary is that there are planets further out than where we are on one of the spiral arms... As bad as things are here, could be worse hahaha...

Or is it all metaphor?

Or is it both metaphor and literal (as above so below) ?

However if you take it literally it reads like Aliens are coming to abduct us (save) and bring us to their planet... Then destroy the "bad ones" and start us over.. Then theyed come back 1000s of years later and do it all again. Another word for aliens here could be angels, or gods.

Destiny is written in the stars

And what do you see?

Originally posted by rigel4
9 If you declare with your mouth, “Jesus is Lord,” and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.

Is it really this simple?

It is true. Also read John 5;19 Jesus gave them this answer: "I tell you the truth, the Son can do nothing by himself; he can do only what he sees his Father doing, because whatever the Father does the Son also does." That way you can say Jesus is like God. Thus Jesus is Lord, in spirit.

Congratulations.

reply to post by rigel4


Without conviction and repentance there is no conversion. The Holy Spirit was sent to convict the world of sin this conviction causes a pricking of the heart which crysout what must I do to be saved. Upon convictions comes salvation which is predicated upon repentace. The bible says that the demons in hell know who Jesus is and they trimble because of that fact. Many people know who Jesus is but they have not been convicted and have repented of their sins.

Originally posted by Aesir26
reply to post by EnochWasRight

 

In the Book of Enoch, the Son of man (ben-Adam) is the "Righteous One" who will preside over the final judgement of the wicked, i.e. the worldly kings and the mighty, who will beg for His mercy.

Jesus identifies himself as the Son of man in the NT saying, "you shall see the Son of man sitting at the right hand of Power, and coming with the clouds of heaven. (Mk 14:62) He is known as the last Adam.

Esau (Isa/Iesous) is of Edom/Adam. He is true to his father, and is loved by Isaac yet despised by Rachel (name meaning "ewe"/"yew": sheep or tree of poison/death). Esau lives in the open under the sky unlike his homely brother, Jacob (the 'heel-biter"), a tent-dweller and a deceiver. Jacob is described as bare, smooth and simple, which are the characteristics of the Hebrew letter, Zain/Zayin, or "Seven", which means "weapon; phallus; lie; deception; destruction". Gen 36:18 lists "Jeush" as a "son of Esau", which is an anagram of the same letters composing the name, "Jesus" in Hebrew, and means "Gatherer". Further, Esau is the archetypal brother who forgives Jacob for all his transgressions, welcoming him home with an embrace instead of the attack that Jacob is expecting and deserves.

The original story of Job of the Theraputae begins with: "4Know then my children, that you are the generation of a chosen one and take heed of your noble birth.5For I am of the sons of Esau."

Throughout the entire Old Testament, it is Yahweh, lord of worldly wealth, power and war, who is hell-bent on the destruction of Esau/Edom:

“… the people of my curse, to judgment. The sword of the Lord is filled with blood, it is made fat with fatness, and with the blood of lambs and goats, with the fat of the kidneys of rams: for the Lord has a sacrifice in Bozrah [a city in Edom], and a great slaughter in the land of Idumea [Edom]. And the unicorns shall come down with them, and the bullocks with the bulls; and their land shall be soaked with blood, and their dust made fat with fatness.” Isaiah 34:5-7

edit on 28-11-2012 by Aesir26 because: (no reason given)

Romans 9:13 As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated.

reply to post by guitarplayer

Without conviction and repentance there is no conversion.

Conversion is (according to the New Testament) going from being a pagan gentile, to believing in Jesus and becoming a Christian. It is used to describe what the Apostles did, in Acts. The word does not come up in any other context in the NT.

The Holy Spirit was sent to convict the world of sin this conviction causes a pricking of the heart which cries out what must I do to be saved.

You are apparently running two different NT quotes together to create an innovative concept. The text for the convivtion part is:

When he comes, he will convict the world of guilt in regard to sin and righteousness and judgment: in regard to sin, because men do not believe in me; in regard to righteousness, because I am going to the Father, where you can see me no longer; and in regard to judgment, because the prince of this world now stands condemned.

That is saying Jesus is righteous and good, and Satan is evil and the doer of evil deeds (sin).
The other part is from a quote, also in Acts, of the jailer of Paul and Silas asking them what he must do to be saved, and the answer was to believe in Jesus.

Upon convictions comes salvation which is predicated upon repentace.

Salvation is when a person believes in Jesus. "Salvation" meaning to be brought into the church, so to speak, the congregation of the Lord, the "Lord" being Jesus. The purpose of salvation is to live a righteous life, rather than the deeds of unrighteousness engaged in before coming to this belief.

The bible says that the demons in hell know who Jesus is and they trimble because of that fact. Many people know who Jesus is but they have not been convicted and have repented of their sins.

Jesus did not come to save demons, so they have no choice concerning salvation the way we do.

reply to post by Dustytoad


The truth in the doctrine is this.

We are all born sinners; there is nothing we can do to change this. Because of this we will all fall, commit sin deserving of death. And indeed we do die, spiritually. Most religious people agree that the innocence of youth is why children can often appear closer to God than adults. It is not until a child becomes willfully disobedient to the law of love that they fall. And Jesus tells us we must become like the children to enter heaven.

We may, especially as children sin without realizing it, or because we reacted without thinking first. This sin is not counted against us the same and does not necessarily lead to death. Adam and Eve may have done many things that we would consider sin but they only did one willfully disobedient act. This is the act that leads to death.

We were made to eat from the tree of KNOWLEDGE OF GOOD & EVIL. When you sin you are typically hurting others and causing them pain that you can see. It is when we understand this and continue to deliberately sin that we fall. I imagine the age for everyone is a little different, but I think around 4-5 years old is when most children will begin their struggle with sin.

As we go through our adolescence we justify our sins. And how easy it is when literally everyone is doing it. At some point most if not all of us begin to see the harm we have committed in this world and guilt and fear enter our lives. The bible says woe to the one who sins come through, funny thing is that would be woe to all of us. But many people justify their sin and judge and condemn others, especially those who call themselves Christians but do not follow Christ. We fear because we know that we deserve death. This is what we were born to do.

The fundamentalist who teach the law have basically nullified the effect that Christ can have in one's life. I love Mormon's they are some of the nicest people I meet. But they live their lives by a set of rules trying to earn heaven on merit. The bible says that it is Grace alone that saves a man. Since we know that we were born to fall and that only Grace can save a man we can see that it is impossible, by design, for us to earn heaven by obeying rules.

The problem is most churches stop teaching at Grace. Thus sending its audience back into the real world in no better shape than they walked in the door. Does this sound like what was happening in acts? Do you think the apostles asked the people in the crowd to raise their hand if they believe? Or patted themselves on the back because they had a good number of hands raised?

The truth is although we were born to fall we were also born to be risen. We fall as physical bodies and rise as spiritual bodies. We cannot overcome sin on our own. By design, without help from the Holy Spirit we will continue to be a slave, addict, to sin. This is why Paul says we are not to judge those outside the church. It is not possible for them to live life without sin. The world is full of miserably depressed, violent people. But they refuse to acknowledge the truth that God is judging them, TODAY.

One must truly repent, this means to be utterly disgusted with the sin they have committed in their lives and commit to living a life for Christ. Christ left us basically one command, love your brother. This is where Christianity fails miserably in my opinion. The church is constantly using the term brother to only relate to fellow believers. The parable of the Good Samaritan should be enough to dispel this myth.

Jesus says there is only ONE FATHER and we are all brothers. Jesus calls the Pharisees sons of the Devil not because they were not created by the same God but simply because they have chosen to ignore his commands and follow the commands of Satan. You see Pharisees were blameless under the law but they failed to love. Instead they believed they had obtained a certain righteousness thus condemning those who were law breakers. Sound like any Christians you know?

I know for me conversion did not come at first when I repented. Instead I continued doing the things that I knew I shouldn't be doing. Sin was an addiction that I could not get free from, but I kept reading in the bible that anyone born again does not sin. I believed God and wanted that for my life. I even prayed that if it was impossible for me to stop sinning that I would rather be in hell because I was tired fighting against God. This is when the conversion came.

You see I gave my whole life to God that day. I did not want to fight against him and knew that I was not strong enough on my own. This is when I was born again; understand that I was incapable of eliminating sin from my life. This is what it means that you are saved by Grace and not acts. If it was possible for me to become free from sin on my own, Christ died on the Cross for nothing and Grace has no value. But I wasn't, and this is where Grace comes in. Being filled with the Holy Spirit brings life to my body and gives me the strength to overcome sin. I have been sealed with the promise of eternal life and I have a helper that guides me to understand how to love.

Free will, sin, pain that we cause and receive as we learn, Grace, Salvation. The greatest Jigsaw puzzle ever created. We are all pieces in that puzzle fit perfectly together so that our transgressions can be judged righteously and that we may all learn to love one another. This is my way of understanding free will, election, the body of Christ. Concepts that are too spiritual to fully understand. God placed us in the exact right place at the exact right time for us to experience exactly what we were supposed to. Yes we have free will but he knows what we will choose before we choose. Thus he is capable of putting the puzzle together perfectly.

There are only 2 things that I think I have left for you but want to know if you're interested. First I can answer any questions you have about this post. Second if you are willing to read Roman's I will give you a very basic study guide. With the help of my guide and the guidance of the Holy Spirit I believe that what I am saying will make even more since to you.