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Romans 10:9

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posted on Nov, 27 2012 @ 05:48 PM
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Originally posted by rigel4

9 If you declare with your mouth, “Jesus is Lord,” and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.

Is it really this simple?


Yes. Belief is the starting point of faith. Faith is God's work in us. Once we seek and knock, the rest is a gift of God. Belief changes you from being on the wrong side of truth to the right side of truth. The heart is then remade and your life is changed. Faith is merely the starting-point of the larger journey.

Taking the name of Christ includes taking the character. Taking the name in vain is taking it apart from the character. The will of God and the Character of Christ is giving and receiving. Taking is pride and is the thing that faith removes over time. Once you love others as yourself, you are expressing love and fulfilling the law.

Law is for the thieves that take. Faith is for those who move past the need for law.

Galatians 3

23 Before the coming of this faith, we were held in custody under the law, locked up until the faith that was to come would be revealed. 24 So the law was our guardian until Christ came that we might be justified by faith. 25 Now that this faith has come, we are no longer under a guardian.

26 So in Christ Jesus you are all children of God through faith, 27 for all of you who were baptized into Christ have clothed yourselves with Christ. 28 There is neither Jew nor Gentile, neither slave nor free, nor is there male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus. 29 If you belong to Christ, then you are Abraham’s seed, and heirs according to the promise.

Baptism is symbolic of our repentance. In reality, we are baptized into the water of life to repent of something that came before. We are under a veil and do not know what that thing we repent of was, but we know that we are living in a place for the fallen. Salvation is restoration to where we were before this place.




posted on Nov, 27 2012 @ 05:51 PM
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Originally posted by DISRAELI
reply to post by andy06shake
 

Paul uses the word "saved" in the context of expecting a future judgement;
"...Jesus who delivers us from the wrath to come"- 1 Thessalonians ch1 v10



Why do i require judgement?

Who gets to judge God?

What makes you thing there is somekind wrath to come? Seems rather harsh, i think Christianity has its own agenda to satisfy with all these control constructs it keeps chucking in our direction, aka the bible(A book written by Men).

Essentially the bible would have us believe God requires us to do this or do that in this way or that way or he/she/it will spank you in the next life!

God is our friend not our master! He/she/it requires companionship not dominion, after all eternity is a long time. Then there is free will, as far as i can see the bible is not to big on this idea.
edit on 27-11-2012 by andy06shake because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 27 2012 @ 05:52 PM
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Originally posted by Wonders
reply to post by rigel4
 


Good question. I don't believe it's that simple at all.

Luke 14:33 So then, any of you who does not forsake (renounce, surrender claim to, give up, say good-bye to) all that he has cannot be My disciple.



The idea of giving up what you have is dedication to giving to others. To forsake what you have is to recognize that you do nothing in this life apart from movement and thought. Possessions can be used for service to others. Any other thought on our part represents taking as a thief. In reality, we own nothing. It's all Gods and given as a gift. Work a job and the reward of the gift you earn goes to your family. This is forsaking what you own for others.



posted on Nov, 27 2012 @ 06:00 PM
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I'm glad i started this thread, to be honest i Had reservations doing so. i got talking to someone on twitter
threw the gaza / israeli war a few days ago. i insulted the woman, and her reply took me by surprise , she got me thinking and a few days later i asked her a question, again she surprised me, i then started reading some verses
she sent me.

so here i am with a broken laptop asking questions a few weeks ago i would have laughed at. i thank you all for your answers so far, i have read every word.
edit on 27-11-2012 by rigel4 because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 27 2012 @ 06:07 PM
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reply to post by rigel4
 


Im actually trying to figure out what you're looking for here...

Are you looking for a religion?

Do you want spiritual knowledge?

Maybe just looking to stir the pot? ( one of my personal favorite past times
)

Do you fear for your soul? Perhaps you've heard some Christians preaching and it struck a cord?

Looking to be "saved" so to speak?

Please elaborate




posted on Nov, 27 2012 @ 06:11 PM
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reply to post by rigel4
 


Faith without works is dead. And most times conditioning/brainwashing/religious human dogma is counterproductive to connect to god.



posted on Nov, 27 2012 @ 06:15 PM
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Originally posted by UnaChispa

Originally posted by rigel4
9 If you declare with your mouth, “Jesus is Lord,” and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.

Is it really this simple?


I wouldn't say 'simple'. The hard part is believing in your heart.

Ephesians 2:8-10 says,
"For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith - and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God - not by works, so that no one can boast. For we are God's handiwork, created in Christ Jesus to do good works, which God prepared in advance for us to do."


Seekers of truth can believe in god but will seek the truth within and question all outside conditioning/religion. It is only within yourself you will truely find the answer and feel the grace (a physical thing/change).



posted on Nov, 27 2012 @ 06:18 PM
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Originally posted by windword
reply to post by Spike Spiegle
 


Repenting, from my understanding is being sorrowful for ones sins. That's a completely different vegetable than believing that Jesus is lord (God) and that he rose from the dead. Then there's the added component that his death was a payment for ones sins, but only for the sinful ones that believe in the above..


Who wrote that faith was enought? It was Paul wasn't it?



posted on Nov, 27 2012 @ 06:31 PM
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Originally posted by Akragon
reply to post by graceunderpressure
 



The part that most people leave out is that if you do the first thing (as stated by the OP, which actually is simple), God empowers you to do all the other things that Paul listed. AND, you want to do these things because you're changed on the inside, over time.


Uh huh... and of course the evidence behind pauls idea of grace is clear... right?

As we all know Christians are the most selfless and loving people in the world.... very giving... never judge others... etc etc...

What a joke... Just like pauls doctrine

edit on 27-11-2012 by Akragon because: (no reason given)


We should not judge Paul....... Ohh sorry I cannot even write this without laughting my ass off.
. Either he was manipulating liar or just a fool.



Rom 10:13 For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved. 14 How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher? See how he's bridging the act of "calling upon the name" with the act of "preaching"? And in the verse I cited how he is talking about the "preaching of another Jesus, whom we have not preached"? It's the "Christian preachers" who are guilty of destroying the earth:


Should I not put my faith in that god will find me even if I do not listen to preachers since they preach hate and ego and duality. If god loves me will he not seek me out not matter what? God never leaves a soul behind that is ready and have done the work no matter what his previous beliefs are. The blind leading the blind.
edit on 27-11-2012 by LittleByLittle because: Spellchecking



posted on Nov, 27 2012 @ 06:35 PM
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Originally posted by Akragon
Uh huh... and of course the evidence behind pauls idea of grace is clear... right?

As we all know Christians are the most selfless and loving people in the world.... very giving... never judge others... etc etc...

What a joke... Just like pauls doctrine


I agree that many Christians do more to harm Christianity's reputation than anyone else because they just don't get it, or they're not willing to go through the pain of letting God transform them. They're all "saved" yet, most never mature spiritually beyond being fledgling saints still full of fleshly behavior and -- yes, what a horrid example they set! It's sad.

True Christians are not perfect people but you should be able to identify them by their "fruits" which are love, joy, peace, forbearance, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness and self-control. But, expecting these fruits to immediately be present in their fullest form just because someone begins a walk of faith is unrealistic. If I went out back and threw down some pumpkin seeds and then got mad the next day because I didn't have a patch of fully-grown pumpkins, it would be similar to that expectation.



posted on Nov, 27 2012 @ 06:39 PM
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reply to post by LittleByLittle
 


Well lets see... he admitted being thief and murderer...

And his writing shows him to be a liar as well... Philippians 2:6

But i wouldn't say he was a fool by any means...

He wanted his own following... and found it by using Jesus...

That is why i would say a good portion of the Christian population is based around Paulianity....

NOT the words of their own God... who wasn't God either way




posted on Nov, 27 2012 @ 06:43 PM
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reply to post by graceunderpressure
 



True Christians are not perfect people but you should be able to identify them by their "fruits" which are love, joy, peace, forbearance, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness and self-control.


True Christians eh...

Interesting how many sects of said religion use that statement... You're only a true Christian if you believe what we believe... Yet with 34k different "flavors" of Christianity... is there really such thing as a "True" christian?

Heres a better quesiton... Do you need to accept the "label" Christian in order to have those qualities you listed?

Funny... i've found it quite rare to find those qualities in the populous of that religion

Perhaps thats just me though... i have a habbit of poking holes in their doctrine... so they don't usually like me much... Which is so very Christian




posted on Nov, 27 2012 @ 06:50 PM
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Originally posted by Akragon
reply to post by graceunderpressure
 



True Christians are not perfect people but you should be able to identify them by their "fruits" which are love, joy, peace, forbearance, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness and self-control.


True Christians eh...

Interesting how many sects of said religion use that statement... You're only a true Christian if you believe what we believe... Yet with 34k different "flavors" of Christianity... is there really such thing as a "True" christian?

Heres a better quesiton... Do you need to accept the "label" Christian in order to have those qualities you listed?

Funny... i've found it quite rare to find those qualities in the populous of that religion

Perhaps thats just me though... i have a habbit of poking holes in their doctrine... so they don't usually like me much... Which is so very Christian



Do you mind me if I poke
. The true Christians are of course of all faith and none who work in harmony (symbiosis) with each other and nature (or at least tries
). Many Christians will never call themselves Christians but are more or less close to Christ Conciousness

Akragon I think I have a crush on your mind.
. Thank you for being.




NOT the words of their own God... who wasn't God either way


Depends on you definition of god. He was aware and connected I think but not the big ONE who judges himself and makes sure the purpose follows the highest ideal.

Paul would probably loved if I called him king, but Jesus would have hated it, I think since it causes distance between ous that should not be.
edit on 27-11-2012 by LittleByLittle because: Spellchecking



posted on Nov, 27 2012 @ 06:59 PM
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Originally posted by Akragon

True Christians eh...

Interesting how many sects of said religion use that statement... You're only a true Christian if you believe what we believe... Yet with 34k different "flavors" of Christianity... is there really such thing as a "True" christian?

Heres a better quesiton... Do you need to accept the "label" Christian in order to have those qualities you listed?

Funny... i've found it quite rare to find those qualities in the populous of that religion

Perhaps thats just me though... i have a habbit of poking holes in their doctrine... so they don't usually like me much... Which is so very Christian



I don't care a whit for a "Christian label," and certainly don't believe that it's necessary for the fruits that I listed. (Good luck trying to exhibit those "qualities" on a regular, meaningful basis without God's help, though! It's human nature to be the exact opposite.) As for me, I love Jesus, and I follow what I know in my heart to be true. I don't require that others see things exactly as I do.

And, you missed my point when you said " i've found it quite rare to find those qualities in the populous of that religion." That's exactly what I was saying in my post. I agree that it's rare. And it's sad.



posted on Nov, 27 2012 @ 06:59 PM
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reply to post by LittleByLittle
 



Do you mind me if I poke


Please feel free...


The true Christians are of course of all faith and none who work in harmony (symbiosis) with each other and nature (or at least tries ). Many Christians will never call themselves Christians but are more or less close to Christ Conciousness


Interesting... I find it quite amusing that many that claim to be Christian really have no idea what Jesus actually said... I've presented passages from Jesus to many of my so called "christian" friends... and they usually just look at me with a blank stare... As if to say... "uhhh... whups i didn't know that"

Heres a passage to chew on...

42 For I was an hungred, and ye gave me no meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me no drink:

43 I was a stranger, and ye took me not in: naked, and ye clothed me not: sick, and in prison, and ye visited me not.

44 Then shall they also answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, or athirst, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not minister unto thee?

45 Then shall he answer them, saying, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye did it not to one of the least of these, ye did it not to me.


Akragon I think I have a crush on your mind. . Thank you for being.


Aww.... you're sweet


Thank you for letting me indulge in my passion




posted on Nov, 27 2012 @ 07:50 PM
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Originally posted by graceunderpressure

Originally posted by Akragon
reply to post by rigel4
 


No its not that simple... bloody paul eh




27But I say unto you which hear, Love your enemies, do good to them which hate you,

28Bless them that curse you, and pray for them which despitefully use you.

29And unto him that smiteth thee on the one cheek offer also the other; and him that taketh away thy cloke forbid not to take thy coat also.

30Give to every man that asketh of thee; and of him that taketh away thy goods ask them not again.

31And as ye would that men should do to you, do ye also to them likewise.

32For if ye love them which love you, what thank have ye? for sinners also love those that love them.

33And if ye do good to them which do good to you, what thank have ye? for sinners also do even the same.

34And if ye lend to them of whom ye hope to receive, what thank have ye? for sinners also lend to sinners, to receive as much again.

35But love ye your enemies, and do good, and lend, hoping for nothing again; and your reward shall be great, and ye shall be the children of the Highest: for he is kind unto the unthankful and to the evil.

36Be ye therefore merciful, as your Father also is merciful.

37Judge not, and ye shall not be judged: condemn not, and ye shall not be condemned: forgive, and ye shall be forgiven:

38Give, and it shall be given unto you; good measure, pressed down, and shaken together, and running over, shall men give into your bosom. For with the same measure that ye mete withal it shall be measured to you again.


And that ain't easy...


The part that most people leave out is that if you do the first thing (as stated by the OP, which actually is simple), God empowers you to do all the other things that Paul listed. AND, you want to do these things because you're changed on the inside, over time. It's not at all like depriving yourself or "trying to be good so Santa will bring you something."

I think the notion that Christians must live up to a bunch of edicts on their own power is what drives many people away from the faith. It's a shame.


Very well said. It is simple, yet paradoxically difficult, in the beginning due to the constraints of time.

And to address the OP, we can not always give you the best answer, partly because we are looking for answers ourselves. Some, myself included, delude ourselves in thinking that we have everything solved and figured out when we've only scratched the surface. Take things with a grain of salt, and ask Father about anything. When dealing with scripture, I sincerely advise you to talk and listen to Father.



posted on Nov, 27 2012 @ 08:09 PM
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To the OP,

A video you may find relevant and interesting.




posted on Nov, 27 2012 @ 10:22 PM
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Originally posted by micmerci
IMO Yes it is that simple because it is not based on anything that we are capable of doing but on what Jesus has already done.

Don't want to waste my time on the whole Pauline Doctrine, salvation by grace debate, which is why I led with- IMO.


The demons in hell beleive too but are not saved.



posted on Nov, 28 2012 @ 01:40 AM
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Originally posted by rigel4
9 If you declare with your mouth, “Jesus is Lord,” and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.

Is it really this simple?


Sort of

If you believe Jesus is Lord than you will listen to him and do what he says. That is what will truly save you. Many people say they believe he is lord but they don't listen and do what he says.

One must repent and be reborn into the spirit of Christ. It is the man who can say Jesus is Lord by both his words and his actions that is assured of his salvation.



posted on Nov, 28 2012 @ 02:56 AM
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Originally posted by EnochWasRight

Originally posted by rigel4

9 If you declare with your mouth, “Jesus is Lord,” and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.

Is it really this simple?


Yes. Belief is the starting point of faith. Faith is God's work in us. Once we seek and knock, the rest is a gift of God. Belief changes you from being on the wrong side of truth to the right side of truth. The heart is then remade and your life is changed. Faith is merely the starting-point of the larger journey.

Taking the name of Christ includes taking the character. Taking the name in vain is taking it apart from the character. The will of God and the Character of Christ is giving and receiving. Taking is pride and is the thing that faith removes over time. Once you love others as yourself, you are expressing love and fulfilling the law.

Law is for the thieves that take. Faith is for those who move past the need for law.


This I agree with. And if it wasn't clear in my first post I did mean it this way..

Funny thing is I didn't arrive at faith through jesus or church..

I got there through things I cannot talk about on this forum, and through god directly, by meditation...

Rome's not built in a day, so why would a soul be??

It took almost 30 years for me to grow up and become what I am now which is a much better person than when I was 3... Why would spirit be quicker??

But yes I agree with this post I quoted.
edit on 11/28/2012 by Dustytoad because: (no reason given)





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