The Universe is a Conscious Thought, page 1

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Topic started on 23-11-2012 @ 04:04 PM by neoholographic

The universe is a Conscious thought.

I first want to define Consciousness - Consciousness allows which path information to be known.

If you look at the double slit or delayed choice experiments, the sub atomic particle behaves like a wave when which path information isn't known and it behaves like a particle when which path information is known.

So the universe works just like the human mind/brain.

The wave function is the collective unconscious that contains all probable states and the Consciousness of the wave function is these branes or isolated probable states. When these isolated probable states become real subjective states this is a moment of Consciousness.

So the whole universe is conscious. Human beings are self conscious. We have quantum consciousness that allows us to observe, measure and know which path information of probable states.

So say you're going to Best Buy to get a computer. This is purely a wave of probable states. Will you get an Apple or a Dell? Will you get a laptop or a desktop? These things are a wave of probabilities in the Quantum Mind until you buy a Dell and this becomes a measured and observed event. After you buy the Dell, then which path information is known.

This isn't just esoteric or metaphysics. This is science. When you look at Quantum Mind theories like Orch Or and others. The Universe doesn't exist until which path information is known. This is what happens with us. You can imagine buying a bag of chips all day. This doesn't become a real event until you go to the store and buy a bag of Lays or Ruffles. Then which path information is known. We see this in the double slit and delayed choice experiments. Some see it this way.

The Unconscious Mind (Wave Function)---->Entanglement---->Quantum Gravity---->Consciousness (Branes/Universes)

It's good to see some in Science realizing the Quantum Mind and the Universe being Conscious or Alive is the only thing that makes sense in the face of Quantum Mechanics. Here's a good episode of Through the Wormhole that asks, Is the Universe Alive?

YouTube Link

reply posted on 23-11-2012 @ 04:35 PM by Axial Leader

Nice thread.

What I take away from your post is actually the second line of this post -- an explanation of "conscious thought". (That is a big enough challenge to explain without taking on the major challenge of explaining the universe itself.

)

I like your explanation of "conscious thought", but I want to make sure I understand the term "which path" -- it is a little confusing to me.

Are you saying that "conscious thought" is the same as information describing "which path" we end up on? I am taking your explanation to mean that "conscious thought" is nothing more than "quantum collapse", described at the link below:

en.wikipedia.org...

So it seems to me that you are saying "quantum collapse" is the same as conscious thought. This is interesting to me because my understanding (which isn't great) says that conscious thought causes quantum collapse, and you seem to be saying they are basically the same thing, or that I have the cause and effect backwards.

Anyway, let me get this part straight and then I can tackle the bigger question about the universe.

reply posted on 23-11-2012 @ 04:55 PM by MamaJ

I had booked marked this video to watch later as I do womans work. (clothes) lol

YouTube Link

I have this video bookmarked as well and can't wait to watch it as I have thought this for some time now.

Good to hear like minded people out there.

Jenn

reply posted on 23-11-2012 @ 05:10 PM by LesMisanthrope

Here's some more science which might lead you to question your theory:

Based on a calculation of neural decoherence rates, we argue that that the degrees of freedom of the human brain that relate to cognitive processes should be thought of as a classical rather than quantum system, i.e., that there is nothing fundamentally wrong with the current classical approach to neural
network simulations. We ﬁnd that the decoherence timescales(∼ 10 −13 − 10 −20 seconds) are typically much shorter than the relevant dynamical timescales (∼ 10 −3 − 10 −1 seconds), both for regular neuron ﬁring and for kink-like polarization excitations in microtubules. This conclusion disagrees with suggestions by Penrose and others that the brain acts as a quantum computer, and that quantum coherence is related to consciousness in a fundamental way.

The Importance of Quantum Decoherence in Brain Processes

reply posted on 23-11-2012 @ 05:10 PM by AthlonSavage

reply to post by neoholographic

i believe is is Consciousness is the universe. I wrote a thread on this once, and cant remember what thread was titled. Its not a new idea and it does make sense.

reply posted on 23-11-2012 @ 05:13 PM by rollsthepaul

I am not religious but fully believe in God. God is beyond our comprehension; he is completely unchangeable which means that he cannot be added to or subtracted from. This means that we are not part of God's essence and nothing ever will be. All of creation exists in the mind of God and that is our relationship to him. The beings he has created, that have fully developed to the epitome of their possibilities, now create universes, to maintain the balance in all creation. Yes, the universe is a conscious thought and that includes all creatures and everything. My speculation is simply that he enjoyed developing us to a very high level, so that we would be better able to comprehend him and he could do wonderful things for us because that is who he is. It is true that everything is consciousness and that includes every atom. There is no such thing as anything unconscious in our universe or the many others that exist. We are much too undeveloped to step out of the agenda and, of course, we shouldn't. About 200,000 years ago the creatures we call angels, had a schism due to their truly magnificent nature and about one third succumbed to pride. Unlike us, angels never change their mind, once it is made up. This means that they are truly lost forever. Similarly, the remaining two thirds committed to God, will likewise never change their mind. As humans and when we rise above 3D, we very much need to practice true humility, so we don't experience the fate of the lost angels. Our mission never changes; grow our aura, help others and create love. This looks after our personal responsibilities and engages our eternal commitment to the common good. Regardless of how high we grow, this must never change and we must accept it, if we want to be as close to God as we possibly can be and there is every reason to accept his agenda because it nested in love of his creation, in his mind.

reply posted on 23-11-2012 @ 05:14 PM by LesMisanthrope

Originally posted by AthlonSavage
reply to post by neoholographic

i believe is is Consciousness is the universe. I wrote a thread on this once, and cant remember what thread was titled. Its not a new idea and it does make sense.

The universe is the universe. That is the only thing that makes sense here. Consciousness can be extinguished by sleep or drug or injury or death. That's how weak consciousness is.

reply posted on 23-11-2012 @ 05:21 PM by MamaJ

Originally posted by LesMisanthrope

Originally posted by AthlonSavage
reply to post by neoholographic

i believe is is Consciousness is the universe. I wrote a thread on this once, and cant remember what thread was titled. Its not a new idea and it does make sense.

The universe is the universe. That is the only thing that makes sense here. Consciousness can be extinguished by sleep or drug or injury or death. That's how weak consciousness is.

Have you watched the video?

Do you get into the anatomy of the human body and the Universe? If so.... do you not see similarities?

"The Universe is the Universe". What makes sense of a statement that deserves many questions asked and answered?

What do you really know about consciousness as you seem to know very little. I am no way trying to offend you I am simply trying to understand your knowledge of perception thus far because it makes no sense to me.

reply posted on 23-11-2012 @ 05:36 PM by LesMisanthrope

Originally posted by MamaJ

Originally posted by LesMisanthrope

Originally posted by AthlonSavage
reply to post by neoholographic

i believe is is Consciousness is the universe. I wrote a thread on this once, and cant remember what thread was titled. Its not a new idea and it does make sense.

The universe is the universe. That is the only thing that makes sense here. Consciousness can be extinguished by sleep or drug or injury or death. That's how weak consciousness is.

Have you watched the video?

Do you get into the anatomy of the human body and the Universe? If so.... do you not see similarities?

"The Universe is the Universe". What makes sense of a statement that deserves many questions asked and answered?

What do you really know about consciousness as you seem to know very little. I am no way trying to offend you I am simply trying to understand your knowledge of perception thus far because it makes no sense to me.

No offense taken. I write with slight negative tone and expect it in return. It brings out the best in people.

I know the same as you. We are both endowed with something you call consciousness. We are both perceivers of ourselves and the world around us. There's no difference between you and I in this aspect (unless you are missing an eye). The only difference is the way we explain such phenomena.

The universe as a conscious thought is a poor and unverified interpretation of the goings on in the universe. Consciousness as a thing, as something real, as something capable of applying force, doesn't exist. There's no one thing we could properly apply that label to. So how can one conclude that the universe is actually that one thing?

ETA: Your video in regards to the universe being one giant organism is more likely and more relevant than the theory that the universe is consciousness or a conscious thought.

edit on 23-11-2012 by LesMisanthrope because: (no reason given)

reply posted on 23-11-2012 @ 05:42 PM by neoholographic

reply to post by LesMisanthrope

Tegmark response to Penrose makes no sense and it's been refuted.

Tegmark stresses that the crucial factor for quantum theories of consciousness is the ability to sustain quantum coherence in the conditions of the brain. This much is accepted by Hameroff. However, Tegmark says that the purpose of his paper is to calculate the rate of decoherence in the brain, which he boldly states as something that will settle the whole matter.

An unexpectedly long section in the paper is devoted to discussing the speed of decoherence at the level of neurons, which is not the basis for any of the main theories of quantum consciousness. However, Tegmark finally goes on to examine the more rellevant matter of decoherence on the scale of microtubules, which is central to the Penrose/Hameroff model. Tegmark arrived at a decoherence time of 10-13 seconds, which would be too short to be of use in neural processes. However, Tegmark assumed a model involving a superposition of solitons 24 nm apart, whereas Penrose/Hameroff are working on the basis of the much smaller separation of nuclei within the tubulin protein subunits of the microtubules. It remains a mystery as to why Tegmark selected a model that is not only different from the Penrose-Hameroff model, but does not resemble any of the principal modern quantum consciousness models.

www.quantum-mind.co.uk...

Again, we're talking about sub-units of microtubules. Tegmark uses 24 nm apart when the separation of sub-units is 2-8 nm apart.

Some just want to lock Consciousness into an emergent property of the brain, which makes no sense, but they do it because any connection of Consciousness to quantum mechanics opens up doors to twin telepathy, life after death and more.

It's a good thing that more theories of quantum consciousness are being looked at and you have the emergence of quantum biology where there looking at quantum effects involved in bird migration, photosynthesis, DNA, sense of smell and more.

So, it's silly to say that quantum consciousness didn't evolve and give our species an advantage within the population.

edit on 23-11-2012 by neoholographic because: (no reason given)

reply posted on 23-11-2012 @ 05:44 PM by jiggerj

reply to post by neoholographic

The universe is a Conscious thought. I first want to define Consciousness - Consciousness allows which path information to be known.

So, how does the numerical path meet with the thought path that will put the numbers together to form the equations that formed everything? Are there emotional pathways for this consciousness to determine (to feel) what is right or wrong? Or is it just a machine that created this universe without purpose, deliberate design, and without love?

Like the human brain, does this consciousness have a logical side and a creative side?

edit on 11/23/2012 by jiggerj because: (no reason given)

reply posted on 23-11-2012 @ 05:54 PM by LesMisanthrope

reply to post by neoholographic

I'll take your word for it. I cannot bear to read anymore about quantum physics.

I wonder if Hamerhoff also believes that everything disappears when he goes to sleep?

reply posted on 23-11-2012 @ 05:59 PM by MamaJ

No offense taken. I write with slight negative tone and expect it in return. It brings out the best in people. I know the same as you. We are both endowed with something you call consciousness. We are both perceivers of ourselves and the world around us. There's no difference between you and I in this aspect (unless you are missing an eye). The only difference is the way we explain such phenomena. The universe as a conscious thought is a poor and unverified interpretation of the goings on in the universe. Consciousness as a thing, as something real, as something capable of applying force, doesn't exist. There's no one thing we could properly apply that label to. So how can one conclude that the universe is actually that one thing? ETA: Your video in regards to the universe being one giant organism is more likely and more relevant than the theory that the universe is consciousness or a conscious thought.

reply to post by LesMisanthrope

Ok good, I was hoping not to come across as a biotch.

True, there is no difference than you and I... well... hold on.... I guess that would be up to the observer.

What we can observe is what there is according to perception of said individual. Consciousness is something that interests me as I have always wondered if the Universe itself is not an intelligent life which we are obviously a part of... and it seems as it is as it indeed contains life... or does it?

We have a lot to learn as the cosmos is complicated, in its own right. Just as a human being.... but there is something driving life in my opinion and I want to know what it is... calling it God just seems to simple.

When you say:
"Consciousness as a thing, as something real, as something capable of applying force, doesn't exist. There's no one thing we could properly apply that label to. So how can one conclude that the universe is actually that one thing?"

I agree.... consciousness is not just one "thing"... it is everywhere.

Its funny.... the video I posted is exactly the same video as the one in the OP. Talk about synchronicity.

reply posted on 23-11-2012 @ 06:12 PM by LesMisanthrope

Originally posted by MamaJ

I agree.... consciousness is not just one "thing"... it is everywhere.

I like your attitude. Very inquisitive.

We already have a name for everything and everywhere, the universe. Calling the universe consciousness is what we call in philosophical jargon a tautology—using a different word to describe the same thing.

Consciousness is a non-entity. It is a state of appearance. When a person appears conscious, we call that instance of appearance 'consciousness.' Nevertheless we are still merely talking about that person being awake and not something called consciousness.

The title of the OP should be The Universe is Conscious, because the universe cannot be anything other than what it already is.

reply posted on 23-11-2012 @ 06:23 PM by neoholographic

reply to post by Axial Leader

Thanks for the response.

You asked:

I like your explanation of "conscious thought", but I want to make sure I understand the term "which path" -- it is a little confusing to me.

Are you saying that "conscious thought" is the same as information describing "which path" we end up on? I am taking your explanation to mean that "conscious thought" is nothing more than "quantum collapse", described at the link below:

en.wikipedia.org...

So it seems to me that you are saying "quantum collapse" is the same as conscious thought. This is interesting to me because my understanding (which isn't great) says that conscious thought causes quantum collapse, and you seem to be saying they are basically the same thing, or that I have the cause and effect backwards.

When I say Conscious Thought, I'm saying Conscious(brain) Thought(wave function).

We see Conscious Thought in the double slit and delayed choice experiments as well as the universe itself.

So Consciousness(brain) collapses the wave function of the Quantum Mind. So after an event occurs, it goes from being a wave of probabilities to an observed event. So which path information is known.

So if I'm going to the store to buy a pop, then Mountain Dew, Coke and Sprite exists as a wave of probabilities in the Quantum Mind. Let's say I buy a Sprite, then this becomes a measured and observed event and which path information is known.

This Conscious Thought is embedded in space-time geometry at planck scales. So the universe is Conscious

We see this in the double slit experiment. Before which path information is known, the photon behaves like a wave of probabilities(Coke, MD, Sprite). When which path information is known the photon behaves like a particle(Sprite).

So I see Consciousness as a fundamental property of the universe rather than something esoteric. So when probable states of the Wave Function become isolated, this is going from the Unconscious Mind(Wave Function) to the Consciousness (Branes, universes, humans).

reply posted on 23-11-2012 @ 06:27 PM by neoholographic

reply to post by LesMisanthrope

Of course you will ignore it because it sounds like you would rather blindly debate rather than read about what your debating.

So damn the facts, your mind is made up.

reply posted on 24-11-2012 @ 02:16 PM by alumnathe

Is "consciousness" the only way for the universe to experience itself? Consciousness may be unique to humankind. There could be states of awareness that we are unable to experience, but that the universe prefers.

reply posted on 24-11-2012 @ 02:53 PM by supergravity

reply to post by neoholographic

Since all atoms are breaking apart faster than we can measure, into sub atomic particles that fly off faster than the speed of light, we should consider that the universe is not only conscious but light itself is not a constant.This points to the possibility that all atoms are holographic and we could be in a MULTIPLEXED universe that is generated within our perception. Another words , When our synapses disappear WHERE DO OUR THOUTHTS AND MEMORIES GO?
I suggest are thoughts are down linked or CARIED ON THE REASIMBLING SUB ATOMIC PARTICLES FLYING IN FASTER THAN LIGHT.TIME STOPS AT THE SPEED OF LIGHT,GO FASTER AND TIME REVERSES.
example , when we drive down the road it is generated in front of us so fast we perceive it to be solid mass.

reply posted on 24-11-2012 @ 06:37 PM by MamaJ