Understanding ATS's ignorance in the Middle East

reply to post by Honor93


Meow, meow, meow! You are the one that brought cats into it mate. All i said was opposable thumbs allow Humans to do what they do.

Need to go get my kid from School BBL.

reply to post by andy06shake

Cats dont build at all

i beg your pardon but they certainly do.
they don't build buildings, bicycles or cars but they certainly build shelters, monuments, nesting (as mentioned), relationships, families and a host of other things.

if you consider a "thumb" a built in weapon, that only applies if we are trained in and discussing martial arts, otherwise, it is never a "tool or weapon" independent of the other 4 phalanges accompanying it.

man does not build tools with thumbs alone

On another note Human beings have never built a weapon of tool that they have not used.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAA ... how many links to do you require to prove your statement nonsense ?

Another way of looking at it is Humans are the ultimate Virus at the macro level

and, if you asked my cats their political opinion of yours above, they'd agree, as do i.

that however, still doesn't make humans the ultimate predator ... even a virus needs a host.

Originally posted by andy06shake
reply to post by Honor93

 

Meow, meow, meow! You are the one that brought cats into it mate. All i said was opposable thumbs allow Humans to do what they do.

Need to go get my kid from School BBL.

be careful out there, cya 'round.
and yes, i mentioned cats because you claimed only we did such things (kill for sport, kill for fun, kill for God), i simply pointed out cats do too and you set out to prove me wrong. can't, can ya ?

i also disagree that opposing thumbs places our capabilities above any other.
we can create and destroy just like the next animal on the block.
yes we create differently but that doesn't make us better or superior.

reply to post by Shuye


I support neither country, I support the innocent people stuck between the two. I always have and I always will. Many Palestinians don't want this happening (obviously) and have nothing to do with the rocket bombings or Hamas. Many Israels don't want to keep screwing over the folks in the Gaza strip. But like all wars and conflicts, it's not the people who decide. It's their damn government.

Originally posted by Honor93
reply to post by andy06shake

 

Cats dont build at all

i beg your pardon but they certainly do.
they don't build buildings, bicycles or cars but they certainly build shelters, monuments, nesting (as mentioned), relationships, families and a host of other things.

if you consider a "thumb" a built in weapon, that only applies if we are trained in and discussing martial arts, otherwise, it is never a "tool or weapon" independent of the other 4 phalanges accompanying it.

man does not build tools with thumbs alone

On another note Human beings have never built a weapon of tool that they have not used.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAA ... how many links to do you require to prove your statement nonsense ?

Another way of looking at it is Humans are the ultimate Virus at the macro level

and, if you asked my cats their political opinion of yours above, they'd agree, as do i.

that however, still doesn't make humans the ultimate predator ... even a virus needs a host.

I dont think you understand or are even trying to understand. Cats dont build things people do. Except for nests when there pregnant. You tell me a tool Humans have invented and not used then, go on please do? This should be good!

As to how many links i require to prove my statement. Which statement do you mean? If its the opposable thumbs information i have brought to you attention i dont need to prove anything the anthropologists and social engineers of our scientific communities have allready done so! Goggle is your friend in that respect.

On that note i will leave you alone with you pussys and there political opinions. LOL LOL LOL LOL

Have a nice day to both you and your cats.

reply to post by andy06shake

here's just a few from a single collection ... www.trutv.com... ... need more ?

so, what bombs, bombers, grenades or any other such devices have any of the animals created ?
so, since we've become magnificient destroyers, that automatically makes us superior ??
how so ?

the question was ... how many links you need to prove your statement is NONSENSE ... fancy of you to avoid answering it
and your quoted statement read ...

On another note Human beings have never built a weapon of tool that they have not used.

this discussion is about our opinions, not those of anthropologists, archeologists or any other scientist. besides, science is wrong often enough, why would anyone put faith in that ??

thanks, enjoy your day as well, we sure are.

reply to post by Honor93

"so, what bombs, bombers, grenades or any other such devices have any of the animals created ? "

None thats my point. Animals dont usually employ tools short of sticks and rocks for any purpose. People do!

So in answer to you question i dont need any links pal. As i have said Goggle is you friend. Opposable thumbs allow Humans to interact with there environment in a way that no other animal on Earth can hope to emulate in a simalar manner. Thats a fact. So short of evolving an opposable thumb or similar appendage Animals are at a significant disadvantage in this respect.

Great post and I agree there is no difference between the two. As an outsider, you and I can see this.

If my father was killed in a war, it would be very difficult for me to not feel some resentment against the country that did this. This is the sad thing of war - it can get very personal and generate its own anger and hatred.

Those are the idiotic moderates who allow the fudamentalists to carry the world off to their shared apocalyptic desires. They get to have their cake and eat it to.

Theres a reason these people only make youtube videos.

Originally posted by Shuye


I'm glad you could see my point now.

which is exactly what it is. A point of view. and thats where it stops.

theres 7 billion points of view on this planet & we're not always going to AGREE....and if we did ALL agree than it means we got assimilated by the Borg Hivemind.

reply to post by infowarrior9970


What you didn't agreed with? Please share your thoughts, i'm curious.

reply to post by RiverRunsFree


Great post

Thanks for bringing a bigger perspective here, people are so focused on the small details sometimes, they forget to try and see things as they really are.

Originally posted by andy06shake
reply to post by Honor93

 

So in answer to you question i dont need any links because i am correct.

you're free to think so.

Opposable thumbs allow Humans to interact with [color=amber][don't you mean ABUSE?] their environment in a way that no other animal on Earth can hope to emulate in a simalar manner. Thats a fact.

i can agree with the ABUSE, not general interaction because the animals do far more to supplement and benefit the Earth than humans can conceive.
[ did you ever wonder why animal feces doesn't poison the land but human feces does ? ]

So short of evolving an opposable thumb or similar appendage Animals are at a significant disadvantage in this respect.

edit on 23-11-2012 by andy06shake because: (no reason given)

like i said, you are free to think so and i am free to disagree.
no matter how many responses insist otherwise, i know what i know and i wouldn't expect someone who doesn't to believe me.
one day, you'll learn for yourself.

ETA --> just for fun, i'd guess you think Tarzan was just a movie or a book, don't ya ?

I will agree that we use our abilities for nefarious purposes all be it to the downfall of our environment and species as a whole. I wont accept that cats have a political agenda sorry.

So you are correct in that assumption. Guess we will just need to agree to disagree on those grounds.

What is it you think i will learn for myself? Pray tell please.

Originally posted by andy06shake
I will agree that we use our abilities for nefarious purposes all be it to the downfall of our environment and species as a whole. I wont accept that cats have a political agenda sorry.

So you are correct in that assumption. Guess we will just need to agree to disagree on those grounds.

What is it you think i will learn for myself? Pray tell please.

hey now, i never said they had a political agenda with the humans but they certainly do amongst themselves.
i see it and reprimand it daily. the natural (elder/younger) hiearchy is constantly challenged.

good, at least we agree on the obvious ... it's the position of, how'd you say it ? ... top predator or similar ? to which i disagree. in the jungle, thumbs do not give us an advantage, if anything, they level the playing field.
thumbs or the ability to use them does not guarantee success in combat with any animal, not even a fire-ant

"hey now, i never said they had a political agenda with the humans but they certainly do amongst themselves.
i see it and reprimand it daily. the natural (elder/younger) hiearchy is constantly challenged."

I dont know if i would use the words political agenda while pertaining to cats. I would say they obviously form some kind of social hierarchical structure when in a group. Most if not all mammals exibit this trait

"good, at least we agree on the obvious ... it's the position of, how'd you say it ? ... top predator or similar ? to which i disagree"

Come on now is it not quite obvious to all that Man is at the top of the food chain? Short of little Grey aliens being proven to exist.

"in the jungle, thumbs do not give us an advantage, if anything, they level the playing field.
thumbs or the ability to use them does not guarantee success in combat with any animal, not even a fire-ant"

No but the ability to field and produce a weapon gives us the upper hand in combat. Also our cunning and capacity for evil pritty much decimate the playing field. As to fire ants well IMHO if nature has to start again i think Ants will be the lightly candidate for natures next attempt at a sentient species. They are just so versatile. I would have said the Bees but i dont think thats really lightly now.

reply to post by andy06shake

well since politics is often defined as ... the art of postponing a decsion until it is no longer relevant ... i would, i live with them.

i can live with ... you don't approve of my choice of words.
however, i will not accept that such a concept doesn't exist.
it is all about seeing the bigger picture.

top of the food chain does not equal top predator.
(although a few industries would like us to think so)
and, if we're counting aliens, that puts humans a few more rungs down, doesn't it ??

without the time to construct, you lose ... regardless your "ability".
sometimes, even without enough time to obtain a pre-constructed weapon proves fatal.
see, you/we/humans are dependant on our efforts to create alternate ability beyond that which comes naturally.

jungle variety animals ?? not so much.
place any human with only their thumbs as primary tools and most won't last long. there are a few who will do just fine but they are the exception, not the standard.

Also our cunning and capacity for evil pritty much decimate the playing field.

now you're making some sense ... our best and strongest weapon ever ... is our brains.
our inability to use them effectively is our downfall.

ATS is no different than any other medium of ingrained notions of reality.

If you disagree with the notion that Israel is the evil of the Middle East, then you are an agent of the Mossad, an IDF member, a Zionist, and a propaganda spreader. God forbid you might simply be someone who has a different view on the conflict. That would just be too simple.

On the other side of the coin you have people accusing the pro-Palestinian folks of being terrorist sympathizers. The fact is, if you support Hamas, Islamic Jihad or the Palestinian Liberation Army, you ARE a terrorist sympathizer.

If, on the other hand, you're simply against settlement expansion and wish to see more equitable treatment of the Palestinian people who have suffered much in this war between Israel and the Arab extremists, then such labels do not apply.

People are messed up. There's a lot of hate on both side. I support Israel in their efforts to kill every terrorist they can. But I don't support some of the Israeli leadership who seem to be ok with collective punishment. The thread you put out there, regardless of your intentions, was bound to bring up the boiling hatred of either side of this conflict.

It's not that the facts aren't out there OP. It's that positions based on the interpretations of those facts are entrenched.

reply to post by Honor93


"now you're making some sense ... our best and strongest weapon ever ... is our brains.
our inability to use them effectively is our downfall."

Our cognitive superiority is a given. But without opposable thumbs being really smart just dont cut it in the jungle or the Human jungle. Thats the point im making. Im not trying to paint our thumbs as some kind of super weapon but when combined with our brains well now you have the ability to do allmost anything, manipulate reality to a fashion. What animal can do that in the manner we do?

We do this in a way that no animal does(That we know about anyway). Take Dolphins remarkable beasts, arguably as intelligent as we are but how many Dolphin citys are there? Where's there technology? Where is there Art, history, science, philosophy? Lets face it Dolphins are not going to the Moon now are they? Everything Man has accomplished has required our opposable thumbs. Let me put it this way without said appendages we could not be having this discussion.

I dont believe i seem to be championing Man! I think as a species we are but children. Smarter than your average Bear(Animal) through.

if you hate the war, why aren't you protesting outside the knesset to give back all lands stolen from the '67 invasion.

you hate the war, but you don't fight the occupation which is the direct cause of that rocket landing 200m from your house.

what if everything was exactly the same, but completely reversed. it was 1.7 millions jews living under seige in gaza. what if it was 1.7 million jews who had to dig tunnels to get food from a neighbouring country.

and russia was vetoing every attempt to stop this military occupation peacefully thru the u.n.

and russia was giving your oppressor 3 billion a year to buy advanced military technology that was being used against you.

and every time you turned on the news, you saw putin and abbas posing together in pictures smiling, laughing and calling each other best friends forever, eternal allies etc.

and every time you talked to a friend in the west bank, he tells you how another jew got his home bulldozed.

and how there is a new settlement every week. how you fear they're won't be any more jews left. how he can't go three steps without a hamas soldier harassing him, stopping him for i.d. or asking him what he's doing or where's going. or taking him for interrogation without charges.

how's there's 40% unemployment, while hamas "settlers" a few hundred yards away get massive subsidies and aid. how you as a jew can't own a gun and have a curfew while hamas "settlers" can walk around with ak-47's strapped onto their backs.

and then to add further humiliation, hamas want's you to recognize their right to exist.

and for all this oppression, the only retaliation hamas has to deal with is a few homemade crude rockets launched from a desperate people trying to be heard, only to be called "terrorists".

and then have the full might of a state of the art military unleashing everything they got on your overpopulated ghetto to "defend" itself.

killing hundreds of women and children and thousands of other jews in the process. please grow up.