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Fellow atheists, let's accept the free gift

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posted on Nov, 19 2012 @ 07:42 AM
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Originally posted by johngrissom
Feeling free to voice your waste your opinions on my thread because no one can prove religion is wrong nor Atheism because everything done on this planet is human nature.

www.abovetopsecret.com...
edit on 19-11-2012 by johngrissom because: (no reason given)
I agree with you to an extent. That's why I like to discuss these issues.




posted on Nov, 19 2012 @ 07:44 AM
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reply to post by Hydroman
 


If you read the "playbook" you will learn the rules. It's just like any sport you might fancy- you can "score" but you can acquire "penalties".

Here's a short breakdown of some of the major stuff:

The J man said if you believe in him you will get ever lasting life. That means you will not perish (in the eternal) but doesn't guarantee a stay in Heaven.

To be forgiven of your sins is easy- just ask the J man; however you have to sincerely mean it There are stipulations. Once forgiven you have to try your best to follow the rules of the "playbook". If you break rules (and everyone does) you have to ask for forgiveness again and mean it. You then get a "re-play", meaning a fresh start.

Just as you would have to learn the plays and rules in any sport it is the same with forgiveness and everlasting life. You wouldn't just jump into a professional sport game without learning and studying, such is the same for attaining salvation.

In other words, if you really want to know- study the playbook!



posted on Nov, 19 2012 @ 07:58 AM
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reply to post by mikelkhall
 


Your earthly father may have paid a monetary price, but our heavenly Father paid with the price of his own Son to give an even greater life to everyone.



posted on Nov, 19 2012 @ 08:08 AM
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Originally posted by johngrissom
reply to post by Hydroman
 


Stupidity at it's finest and shows you have no idea about religion in general.


HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA...The attempt by atheists here are amazingly off centered and borderline mental retarded.


The Apostle Paul used similar tact in reasoning with the non-believers he spoke to. The first words out of his mouth to the pagan Greeks was always, "You guys are borderline mentally retarded," which, of course, he followed up with, "Now, let me show you how to be humble like me." And, if that didn't work, laughing hysterically was always very persuasive.



posted on Nov, 19 2012 @ 09:06 AM
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Originally posted by Hydroman
We are told that we can accept this FREE gift of salvation by asking him for it.

Fine, I'll take this free gift.


Being an atheist just how exactly is it that you can accept a free gift by asking an entity that does not exist according to your absence of belief?

If you think you can accept this gift from a non-existent entity then you are not an atheist but more like an agnostic. The whole premise of the thread is a nonsense.



posted on Nov, 19 2012 @ 09:16 AM
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reply to post by CLPrime
 


Nice posts, Chris! Someone "accidentally" star-ed you a couple of times... (guilty face)

Hydroman likes attacking christians. I don't blame him, he just needs a bit of education before doing so and targeting the wrong people. Latin Church is all wrong, all right, but he may not know the difference between latin churches and other christians.



posted on Nov, 19 2012 @ 09:33 AM
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reply to post by swan001
 


Should I explain to you exactly why Hydroman feels the way he does?


If your beliefs are true then god created evil, set evil free, and creates life that will succumb to evil so he can damn the seduced to burn forever or burn a while then become nonexistant.

screw that god

I dont surround myself with lunatics why would I bow to one?


You can't argue with the above quote, and if you do, then you follow a very different doctrine than the general populace of Christians. Part of my distaste comes from the repercussions of making spirituality look so bad. I blame the Christians for the lack of spirituality in this world, because they dressed it up in such a ridiculous tale that they virtually guarantee no one will ever take the cosmic powers seriously.

I believe in a divine principle, but yours is a cartoonish rendition of it. And because of Christianity, many will block their ears before ever hearing a word of what I have to share, or what anyone who truly understands the balance between spirit and reality has to say, and if they do listen, they will constantly compare it to Christianity.

The Vatican has caused irreparable harm to the study of spirituality, and the Christians continue that work. Perhaps not all of them, but enough of them. I see it every day. I see the ignorance, the warmongering, the conjuring of demons and the fight for stagnation.

My heart aches for the spiritual path we have taken - or lack thereof.
edit on 19-11-2012 by AfterInfinity because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 19 2012 @ 09:35 AM
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Originally posted by AfterInfinity


You can't argue with the above quote, and if you do, then you follow a very different doctrine than the general populace of Christians.


Huh?


I don't follow any doctrine. Hey, Chris? reply to post by CLPrime
 
Do I follow doctrines?
edit on 19-11-2012 by swan001 because: (no reason given)




reply to post by AfterInfinity
 


The Vatican has caused irreparable harm to the study of spirituality.
edit on 19-11-2012 by AfterInfinity because: (no reason given)

Yup, they did.
edit on 19-11-2012 by swan001 because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 19 2012 @ 09:39 AM
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Originally posted by Hydroman

Originally posted by johngrissom
Feeling free to voice your waste your opinions on my thread because no one can prove religion is wrong nor Atheism because everything done on this planet is human nature.

www.abovetopsecret.com...
edit on 19-11-2012 by johngrissom because: (no reason given)
I agree with you to an extent. That's why I like to discuss these issues.


It's a non-issue. And everyone who has participated in this thread has wasted their time. Apparently, me included.



posted on Nov, 19 2012 @ 09:40 AM
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reply to post by swan001
 


My apologies. Your posts consistently give me the impression that you lean more toward Christianity than anything else. In fact, I believe I have discussed the topic with you on quite a few threads - and you usually defend Christianity.

It's not that I hate Christianity. I don't hate Christians, not in the least. However, they refuse to recognize a long list of fallacies that inevitably point to a number of incongruencies, all of which undermine their religion. And because they are desperate to cling to meaning, cling to hope, they refuse to acknowledge it.

And because of this, they are forever stalled. Because of this, they put their hearts in an illusion of prosperity, just so they don't have to feel as though life has no purpose. To look at Christianity, it gives me the feeling that Christians do it more for their own salvation and less for the salvation of the world.
edit on 19-11-2012 by AfterInfinity because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 19 2012 @ 09:43 AM
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Originally posted by AfterInfinity
reply to post by swan001
 


My apologies. Your posts consistently give me the impression that you lean more toward Christianity than anything else. In fact, I believe I have discussed the topic with you on quite a few threads - and you usually defend Christianity.


Well, I can't defend atheist, as they're the one attacking. I just want people to stop blindly inter-attacking each other. Both sides are not perfect.

Peace
edit on 19-11-2012 by swan001 because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 19 2012 @ 09:44 AM
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Originally posted by LesMisanthrope

Originally posted by Hydroman

Originally posted by johngrissom
Feeling free to voice your waste your opinions on my thread because no one can prove religion is wrong nor Atheism because everything done on this planet is human nature.

www.abovetopsecret.com...
edit on 19-11-2012 by johngrissom because: (no reason given)
I agree with you to an extent. That's why I like to discuss these issues.


It's a non-issue. And everyone who has participated in this thread has wasted their time. Apparently, me included.


Sometimes things can be changed. Other not.



posted on Nov, 19 2012 @ 09:44 AM
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reply to post by swan001
 


I added more, should you choose to address the rest of the post.



posted on Nov, 19 2012 @ 09:48 AM
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Originally posted by AfterInfinity
reply to post by swan001
 


I added more, should you choose to address the rest of the post.


Right. Thanks.


Originally posted by AfterInfinity
I don't hate Christians, not in the least. However, they refuse to recognize a long list of fallacies that inevitably point to a number of incongruencies, all of which undermine their religion. And because they are desperate to cling to meaning, cling to hope, they refuse to acknowledge it.

And because of this, they are forever stalled. Because of this, they put their hearts in an illusion of prosperity, just so they don't have to feel as though life has no purpose. To look at Christianity, it gives me the feeling that Christians do it more for their own salvation and less for the salvation of the world.
edit on 19-11-2012 by AfterInfinity because: (no reason given)


These are traditionalist christians, some of them are very blind, and selfish too.

But not all christians are like that! I met alot of christians who, just like me and you, rejects Latin Church's jokes, want to investigate further, go the the root of spirituality.

BTW I am not accusing you here, I'm just making a general statement.
edit on 19-11-2012 by swan001 because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 19 2012 @ 10:42 AM
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reply to post by Hydroman
 


I'd take that free gift. But I don't believe that I HAVE to.

If it is true that Jesus is GOD, or that he was sent by GOD to do this and the other things, why would my acceptance have anything to do with the deed? Either what Jesus did worked or it didn't.

It, supposedly, was a battle with the principalities of good and evil, so either Jesus won or he didn't. If China was to invade the USA and overtake the government, saying the USA is a now part of and an extension of China, what could I do? I'd be a Chinese citizen, period.

So, if Jesus won the war, why does he need me to believe it? Why do I have to do anything, if GOD already did it all? I think the Christian doctrine does nothing but diminish the act of salvation provided by their GOD and spits in the face of his victory, telling us that it wasn't enough, we have to fight against the (supposedly defeated) evil ourselves, too. "Jesus wasn't strong enough, he needs us to believe", just like Tinker Bell!



PS: Glad to see you back, Hydroman! I missed your witty posts.
edit on 19-11-2012 by windword because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 19 2012 @ 10:58 AM
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Originally posted by swan001

Hey, Chris? reply to post by CLPrime
 
Do I follow doctrines?


Nope. Swans (especially those of the Silver variety) don't tend to have much in the way of doctrines.



posted on Nov, 19 2012 @ 11:08 AM
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reply to post by windword
 


I agree with this wholeheartedly. Christianity in 2012 is one giant blasphemous mess. That's why Hydroman's point (and your point, as well) is actually a very important one.

What sort of victory did Christ win on the cross if the overwhelming majority of mankind will be unaffected by it? The Apostle Peter wrote that, when he had been raised, Jesus even proclaimed his victory to the rebellious "spirits" that had been imprisoned since the days of Noah. Given mainstream doctrines on Hell and salvation, that victory would hardly be worth mentioning, unless you were one of the lucky "chosen" few.

That's also the reason for the question I posed earlier in the thread... did Jesus' victory depend solely on his death and resurrection, or did it also depend on him telling people about it? The obvious answer should be, the victory was won as soon as Jesus rose. Anything other than that and the resurrection is made secondary to the word-of-mouth that followed.



posted on Nov, 19 2012 @ 11:26 AM
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reply to post by swan001
 


Right. But see, I disagree with even the basic Christians. Their beliefs dictate that all power comes from without, from an external source, and all true power actually comes from WITHIN. Every single Christian practice is actually a form of witchcraft, pagan worship. They're just ignorant of the fact, and they refuse to believe it because the Bible tells them otherwise.

My spirituality dictates that there is no god. There's a divine principle, a design that has invented itself and continues to reinvent itself in such a way that everything is automated with a perfection that man would be dumbfounded to recognize. It is so subtle that our clumsy methods of scientific study trip over it and fail to recognize the significance. The stigma of religion has created an idealization of it that cloaks the true nature in whimsical fancy. And yet both are right in some ways - they are simply too brash to grasp the bubble without crushing it. The bubble, the design, is perfection incarnate. It is the joy of creation, the thrill of immortality through eternal reimagining and continual experience. Math has shown me this, geometry has shown me this, the dance of music and vibrations and physics and the planets and colors and weather has shown me this. Judging by how easily stuff breaks in the world of today, how easily entropy has its way and breaks civilizations into memories and cities into rubble, people into casualties and philosophies into mere curiosities of mind long dead, it can't be coincidence that everything we in the universe today happened despite the destructive properties of time as we have come to know it. If chaos is truly so random, we should have started from square one a dozen times over by now, and yet we continue to grow in spite of the devastation that we believe created this universe. Math itself the most pure and impartial language we know, tells us that this world, as we see it today, is nothing short of a miracle.

Christians call it by a different name, and regard it differently than I do, and this makes all the difference. I'm not saying my view is superior, by any means...however, it does tend to lend a more realistic understanding of the universe, a more healthy perspective of how our existence relates to the divinity of this plane we have found ourselves in.

All in all, my disappointment stems from the realization that the basic belief system of Christianity prevents us from seizing our full potential and saving this species from the death spiral that could potentially destroy everything we have worked so hard to make for ourselves. Should we master compassion and empathy, we are capable of utilizing the divinity within us to make a future far brighter than has ever been imagined - but at this point in time, we are too afraid for that which is palpable and personal to see anything beyond that which concerns our immediate scope of reality. I hope that makes sense.
edit on 19-11-2012 by AfterInfinity because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 19 2012 @ 01:33 PM
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Originally posted by PuterMan
Being an atheist just how exactly is it that you can accept a free gift by asking an entity that does not exist according to your absence of belief?
By saying, "Hey, just in case you're really out there....."


Originally posted by PuterMan
If you think you can accept this gift from a non-existent entity then you are not an atheist but more like an agnostic. The whole premise of the thread is a nonsense.
If you had read more of the thread, you'd see that I'm an agnostic atheist.

en.wikipedia.org...
edit on 19-11-2012 by Hydroman because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 19 2012 @ 01:35 PM
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Originally posted by swan001

Nice posts, Chris! Someone "accidentally" star-ed you a couple of times... (guilty face)

Hydroman likes attacking christians. I don't blame him, he just needs a bit of education before doing so and targeting the wrong people. Latin Church is all wrong, all right, but he may not know the difference between latin churches and other christians.


Jesus. I can't come here to discuss beliefs without being blamed for attacking people. Let me ask you, how do I discuss these things without being accused of attacking people?





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