Israel Hamas cease-fire truce backed by US, Egypt, Turkey, Qatar

if Hamas terrorists stopped attacking Israel there would be peace.

If Israel stopped defending itself from the terrorist attacks they would be destroyed.

reply to post by hellobruce

Agreed. Israel isn't mobilizing 30,000 anymore. It's 75,000. I think Hamas's existence is going to be numbered in days or weeks. Firing Fajr-5 missiles was a tactical disaster in my estimation and it looks like it's a game changer in Israel's mind. Ooops may not even begin to cover it.

Originally posted by Wrabbit2000
reply to post by hellobruce

 

Agreed. Israel isn't mobilizing 30,000 anymore. It's 75,000. I think Hamas's existence is going to be numbered in days or weeks. Firing Fajr-5 missiles was a tactical disaster in my estimation and it looks like it's a game changer in Israel's mind. Ooops may not even begin to cover it.

you are speaking of tanks, F16 and others from military point you are right but POWER is somewhere else !
FEAR is an enemy of those which know they are not right in this battle !!! Israel's military (the most modern
military) defeated 6 arab militaries decades ago but after so much years it could not defeat Hezbullah or Hammas if Israel was really strong with all it's power then there would be no Gaza or Lebanon in this world !
those that know they are right will withstand even with their bloods even in an unfair besiege !!!
moreover contrary to what Israeli leaders think this world has a Lord ! I hope that Israel leaders stop this carnage unless the result will not be beneficial to it ! I am sure !! you can search such situations in the history of nations !!!

reply to post by maes2


I actually need an answer on this... I see that statement often... "they couldn't defeat hamas" Do you honestly believe that? Do you really think that they were at a strategic loss of action? Do you really think they assessed the conflict and decided they couldn't win against Hamas?

Do you really believe that, or is that illogical, intellectually fraudulent statement really how you feel?

Lets be clear on this. Israel could, without nuclear arms, wipe out all aggressors with very little losses. BUT as you see here on ATS, they are fighting a media and public opinion war.

As a matter of fact, they are showing great restraint after COUNTLESS conflicts with the same outcome...

All of you that constantly bombard these threads with ignorant opinions and rumors, will be interesting to watch the day we see Israel decide to truly fight for survival..... be careful what you say.... Your words will be more than you can stomach.

Let's hope there may be a ceasefire and it holds.

1. Israel has already achieved it main objective - the destruction of the mid range missle capability. They claimed that they have already wiped out 90% of those missles, although unknown quantities, probably huge amounts of short range missles still abound.


2. It's secondary aim of wiping out the political infrastructure, is at best, only a pipe dream. On the very first day, most of the leadership and free lance militant chieftians had already left for Egypt. Those left behind are only brainwashed low ranking suicidal maniacs holding the fort. These are dime a dozen in our world and killing them is only a waste of bullets.

Worse, inorder to target those clowns, it would mean moving in the army, and THAT is something Israel should NOT do. Many innocent lives including israeli soldiers will be wasted, for nothing, as it WILL NOT achieve the secondary objective of targetting the hamas and militant leadership.


3. Support the ceasefire, withdraw all planes and troops to the border, and halt - on the condition that:-

a. Hamas is held responsible for any further missle attacks - long or short range, including from militants. Afterall, Hama is responsible for the whole of Gaze and is its supposed 'elected' authority, although they had long boycotted elections after being elected once years back.


b. Egypt, in good faith, will be responsible to check and ensure no military equipment or parts go through its border into Gaza.


c. The Arab League, equally in good faith, to quietly spread the truth of who were responsible for the escalation in Gaza - Hamas, in order to uphold the TRUTH, as all muslims must.

It may be difficult to do it openly right now, as there is a loud vocal minority that is attempting to seize power using any means, even violence and lies to get what it wants while inflaming the mobs to destablize mandated honest muslim leaders.

This is asked so that those muslim leaders will build up a strong culture for truth, so as to be able to counter future radicalism and lies by Islamists whom intend to misuse religion for their own personal glory.


D. The ceasefire is but a temporary halt. A permanent ceasefire is needed so that NO MORE lives be lost. The Arab League and concerned parties must get Hamas to either give up on violence, merge with Fatah, or in the least, give up on death of jews as a precondition to meet on the negotiation table. There is no sense in the further sacrifice of palestinians.

The stubborn and old may be prepared to die, but the young and able do have a right to live in our shared world.

And to add, may Israel offer medical and food aid to the palestinians in need. While some may reject it out of foolish pride, many more will need it. Charity comes with no strings no attach.

Afterall, the whole campaign had not been against the innocent palestinian People, but only against Hamas, militants and their troops always in civilian clothes, usually claimed as innocent civilians by Hamas supporters. Medicare makes no differences anyway.

The world will greatly supply those needs. We mankind are far more generous than the loud vocal cynical claim otherwise. But Israel is the nearest, and every second counts to save another fellow human, young or old.

Some may scoff at it, but many will appreciate it over time. Truth will always prevail


As for the jews, may the treasury set aside funds to help rebuild those homes torn down, help the widows whom had lost their husbands, work with the media to uplift the lives of those whom had been scarred by the bombings, as well as offer psychological treatment for those whom had suffered, comprehensibly, from those missle attacks for months if not years, to gain normalcy.

All these would have been unnecessary, if only intractable minds had been more empathic to the sufferings they bring to all. The Israeli-Palestine conflict is one of the most saddest moments in human civilisation to all and future peaceful generations, and many today feel the worst living through it.

May the ceasefire succeed and a longer peace finally comes for both sides. New generations had been born. This tragedy must end.....

reply to post by maes2

I honestly hope Hamas is more realistic than your post is being on things. Israel did end the last Lebanon war short and they left in weakness. Thank Prime minister Olmert for that and I recall rumors of actual unrest within the military ranks of the IDF at the time. Personally, I was stunned to see them actually suffer a loss by deliberate choice. That was the first time Israel has ever been "defeated" to my knowledge and it's hard to call it that considering it wasn't any real defeat in terms of men engaged in the real world. It was a defeat of a politician who just didn't have the guts to finish what he started.

Now Netanyahu is a TOTALLY different world of leadership from Olmert. If the terrorists are taking Netanyahu lightly or assuming anything about him is a bluff....I'm really sad to see the outcome those poor judgements may well lead to.

Israel has a World Class military and could (and has) used it to stand against multiple nations at once and won. Their military has only strengthened with time and building of technology and capability. The face a rag tag bunch of terrorists by comparison and only have a challenge here to the extent Israel limits ITSELF in handling the problem.

Gaza is a small place,.Israel could, if it chose, literally CLEAR that land of people and evidence they'd ever been there, do it in a weekend, and without anyone having time or ability to do a damn thing in stopping them. They DO that out of restraint not some fear concept. Israel has a number of weapons they have never actually used. Pray for the innocent people they're never forced into a position to change that.

There will be no peace for Israel. No peace deal will last.

Originally posted by truejew
There will be no peace for Israel. No peace deal will last.

Correct. Ceasefires are just a way fro the militants to re arm. Its been done over 50 times and each time they just get better rockets and start i tall over again. If they break the cease fire this time i would not be surprised to see gaza stop existing afterwards.

reply to post by MobiusShaun

no they can not unless they kill all the people in the Gaza ! because Hammas is elected and it is playing the role of resistance against Israeli's occupation. so there is no a name or group called Hammas there are people against Israeli's occupation for the stupid idea of greater Israel. if you were familiar with history you would confess that many times determination and faith have conquered the evilness of those that are thirsty for power.
this is not the battle of Pan_arabism and Zionism, this is the battle of right and wrong ! you know that most of Arab governments are just some corrupted puppets ! and Israel is a big colonialism machine !!
I have many evidences to prove that where is the ignorance !!!

Right now, at this time, many of the world leaders are trying their best to get a ceasefire, with Egypt playing the unfortunate lead role as mediator in Cairo. Those leaders not present are getting the phone lines hot.

No one, absolutely no one in the world want an escalation including Israel except for the insane Hamas and Iranian supported Jihadhists whom are hell bent on USING the palestinian people as blood sacrifice for their delusions and dreams of granduer, sitting in Egypt while the palestinian people are the ones dying, and foolishly still supporting the ones who had led them to today's circumstances.

However, it seems that some of the arab leaders had knocked some sense into those imbeciles and schizoids. Now they claim to be not agressors and demand Israel stop the bombings.

Israel should consider stepping back a bit and play a longer strategic game. Stop the bombing with just one condition - that the arab leaders tell their people the truth of the Arab-Israel war, that it had ended long ago, and instruct the immans, whom are not elected, to tell the truth as a true muslim should.

Prophet Muhammad had never sentenced anyone to death for telling the truth, but he had most certainly served punishment upon liars - regardless if muslim or non-muslim, as well as those whom were stubborn in misguided or twisted beliefs that sought to harm others.

His life is a mirror of what a true muslim must be, more so the elected or mandated leader, and something that ALL imans must teach, which sadly, perhaps in their ignorances of world history, had chosed to falsify, twist facts, whitewash wrongs to gain followers and support and attempted to govern the nations when they have no mandate to do so. Prophet Muhammad is the last divine messenger. Anyone else who claim so is a liar.

Death to jews mindsets must end. If it was divine will for jews to be dead, prophet Muhammad would have exterminated them long ago. He had all the time to do so, but didn't. Thus, muslims must NEVER, ever challenge divine will or think themselves Allah.

When arab leaders realised their responsibility to tell the truth to their nations, this will in turn lead to the end of the palestinian sufferings and manipulation by others using them for their own personal glories.

When the truth is shared, Hamas and the Iranian Jihadhists, even though they will lie and claim victory despite causing deaths and harm to the palestine people, will be shunned and isolated, with no support from TRUE muslims. It will become an obligation of EVERY true muslim to report their presence to the authority to have them captured and served with justice.

They had defamed and smeared Islam long enough.

The older generations whom had decided to live with the lies are already dead or lost their power. A new generation had grown, and they must be allowed to know Islam as it was intended to be by prophet Muhammad, and not the mis-interpretations by mortals after him, hungry for power, misused religion to ensure their own selfish longevity on the throne such as the Caliphs of past and today's loud vocal minority attempting to seize power and regress Islam.

Only then can new generations of muslims let go of the deceptions from the past, and focus a new destiny based upon the moral and ethical guidelines of the Koran, to share the rest of our world to progress and evolve with common humankind goals.

reply to post by maes2


Is English your primary language? If it is...... pathetic.... If it isn't, you should use that program "Rosetta stone"\

If I was familiar with history? Was that a veiled attempt to either sound intelligent or to make me sound ignorant?

I do know history, and have no clue the specific point in history you are referencing. Would you so kindly point out the conflict you were referring to....

1)Israel exists and is there to stay... 2) Nobody is going to move... Now we have the facts straight.....

So what is your plan? Use the above FACTS to base your opinion...

Can they defend themselves? Should they resort to lesser munitions since the "freedom fighters" dont have the same arms???


People are plain stupid.....

And over 12 rockets were fired into Israel an hour after the ceasefire went into effect. Yet everyone says Israel is the aggressor. 70% of the Israeli people are pissed at Bibi for agreeing to this. I just hope its a trick to wipe out Hamas because they will never stop attacking Israel.

Originally posted by MidnightTide
reply to post by Son of Will

 

Lots of people thought that land was theirs.

edit on 17-11-2012 by MidnightTide because: (no reason given)

Past tense - "thought".

FAR DIFFERENT than present tense "thinks". Palestinians are, RIGHT NOW, occupying Palestine.

The Zionists are trying to remove the occupants, RIGHT NOW, from PALESTINIAN land.

If you don't use proper & exact language to reflect the current state of the region, you're bound to introduce irrational points, like the notion that Israelis are just as entitled to that land as Palestinians are, even though the former have been mostly absent for 2000 years.