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Israel - Palestine Update Thread. No hate. Just updates.

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posted on Nov, 17 2012 @ 11:17 PM
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reply to post by Curio
 

Smog bank brought to you by the IAF. They're hammering whats just over that rise pretty hard.




posted on Nov, 17 2012 @ 11:26 PM
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It was the press tv offices in gaza that got hit. One injured. Bugger.



posted on Nov, 17 2012 @ 11:34 PM
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reply to post by Smurfwicked
 


antiwar.com...
The above shows one clear explosion and explains a little more



posted on Nov, 17 2012 @ 11:51 PM
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reply to post by Zaphod58
 



That is one awesome looking plane. If Israel was deploying these, then that would explain the twin engine noises I am hearing. I keep thinking that what I am hearing are two drones flying in loose formation... but you may be right.

These things have long loiter time, limited by the pilots endurance I guess. What is weird is why they would not tune the pitch of their propellers. Do they do that on purpose, maybe?

I wouldn't be surprised if these planes could defeat search radar from shoulder launched ManPads (Stinger derivative?) There was a video earlier of one being fired (unconfirmed). The rumor of a downed F16 persists.

Come a long way since the days of Vietnam when Broncos marked their targets with smoke rockets.

img.geocaching.com...



posted on Nov, 17 2012 @ 11:54 PM
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Haaretz article


Israel's ambassador to the U.S. Michael Oren deleted a tweet on Saturday which claimed the Israeli government is willing to sit and talk with Hamas if the barrage of rockets from Gaza stops, the website BuzzFeed.com reported.


He supposedly is blaming it on a staffer.

For my own self, I don't think that Israel has any intention of stopping. Aside from finding out that there are rockets in Gaza that can hit Tel Aviv now, the last poll I saw had 91% of Israelis supporting the fighting with 75% supporting a continued campaign.



posted on Nov, 17 2012 @ 11:57 PM
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reply to post by intrptr
 


Untuned props is an old psychwarfare trick from WWII. It drives people nuts when they're trying to sleep, or trying to rest.

It could also be an echo effect making it sound like they're out of synch, but that deep roar is pretty consistent with the King Air, which is the civilian version of the C-12.

There are add ons that can be put on that would be capable of defeating a Stinger, or other MANPADS. They wouldn't be perfect, but they'd work long enough to get them out of the area. They're fast too, so that would help. They could come in low, and fast, and be gone before they could get a shot off. Or they could orbit high enough to have some reaction time to anything fired their way.



posted on Nov, 17 2012 @ 11:57 PM
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Originally posted by AnIntellectualRedneck
Haaretz article


Israel's ambassador to the U.S. Michael Oren deleted a tweet on Saturday which claimed the Israeli government is willing to sit and talk with Hamas if the barrage of rockets from Gaza stops, the website BuzzFeed.com reported.


He supposedly is blaming it on a staffer.

For my own self, I don't think that Israel has any intention of stopping. Aside from finding out that there are rockets in Gaza that can hit Tel Aviv now, the last poll I saw had 91% of Israelis supporting the fighting with 75% supporting a continued campaign.


Agree completely. Once Tel Aviv and Jerusalem were targeted this went into a whole new realm. I'll be very surprised if this fades out into a cease-fire.



posted on Nov, 18 2012 @ 12:00 AM
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Originally posted by AnIntellectualRedneck
Haaretz article


Israel's ambassador to the U.S. Michael Oren deleted a tweet on Saturday which claimed the Israeli government is willing to sit and talk with Hamas if the barrage of rockets from Gaza stops, the website BuzzFeed.com reported.


He supposedly is blaming it on a staffer.

For my own self, I don't think that Israel has any intention of stopping. Aside from finding out that there are rockets in Gaza that can hit Tel Aviv now, the last poll I saw had 91% of Israelis supporting the fighting with 75% supporting a continued campaign.


I have the impression that Israel's focus has shifted. I don't believe they are strictly targeting rocket sites anymore (I've watched enough hours of live feeds to know they are hitting sites that haven't fired rockets) and their focus has shifted to doing as much damage to Hamas in as short a time period as they can with the hopes of limiting Hamas' future.

As long as Hamas lobs the odd rocket over the boarder, Israel will use it as an excuse to attempt to decapitate Hamas completely.

As long as Israel attempts to do so, future Hamas militants will be born and raised. Depressing situation.
edit on 18-11-2012 by DeadSeraph because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 18 2012 @ 12:02 AM
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I found this interesting.

TEL AVIV — When Israel assassinated the top Hamas military commander in Gaza on Wednesday, setting off the current round of fierce fighting, it was aiming not just at a Palestinian leader but at a supply line of rockets from Iran that have for the first time given Hamas the ability to strike as far as Tel Aviv and Jerusalem.

The commander, Ahmed al-Jabari, had shifted Hamas’s low-grade militia into a disciplined force with sophisticated weapons like Fajr-5 rockets, which are named after the Persian word for dawn and have significantly increased the danger to Israel’s major cities. They have a range of about 45 miles and are fired by trained crews from underground launching pads.

Hamas had perhaps 100 of them until the Israeli attacks last week, which appear to have destroyed most of the stockpile. The rockets are assembled locally after being shipped from Iran to Sudan, trucked across the desert through Egypt, broken down into parts and moved through Sinai tunnels into Gaza, according to senior Israeli security officials.

www.nytimes.com...



posted on Nov, 18 2012 @ 12:05 AM
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reply to post by Zaphod58
 


Untuned props is an old psychwarfare trick from WWII. It drives people nuts when they're trying to sleep, or trying to rest.


Ach soooo...

Thanks as usual Zaphod58 for taking the time to enlighten the world around us.



posted on Nov, 18 2012 @ 12:19 AM
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Originally posted by Level
reply to post by intrptr
 

If the drones are low why doesn't hamas attempt to shoot the down?
Don't they have weapons...plan ahead
They dont seem prepared, it is an a-kicking

Sorry for the delay.

You must understand that manning any weapon system outside waiting for a plane to fly by, with all that instant death buzzijng around overhead would immediately bring down at least a Hell Fire missile and probably artillery fire.

Very short life span for any one trying that right now. Hamas doesn't have any anti aircraft batteries to speak of. They are totally vulnerable and at the mercy of the Israelis. Haven't heard any gunfire at all when the drones are overhead. Kind of telling.

The defensive forces of Hamas know that their best and only opportunity to get some reprisal is to wait for the Israeli ground forces to come inside Gaza where they will be more vulnerable.



posted on Nov, 18 2012 @ 12:27 AM
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reply to post by intrptr
 


About the only system that would have a shot (yeah I know, horrible ain't it) at taking down anything, and surviving for any length of time, is the ZSU-23-2/4 (2 barrel/4 barrel) which there is almost no chance of seeing in Hamas hands. It's a potent self propelled gun system, that still puts fear into pilots, especially if they are taken by surprise.



posted on Nov, 18 2012 @ 12:28 AM
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link

This is a good rundown of things, namely how the political alliances in the region have been shifted quite a bit since the Arab Spring. It talks about several different facets of the latest in the long line of skirmishes and how this time is just plain different.


In the old days, the Arab world was divided between allies of the West – Egypt, Jordan, the Gulf states, Saudi Arabia and much of the Maghreb – and those resistant to US interests and influence – Iran, Syria, Iraq and Hezbollah. But the kaleidoscope has been shaken. The loudest voices of support for the Palestinians now come from such US allies as Egypt and Qatar



posted on Nov, 18 2012 @ 12:30 AM
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Sounds like a ton of hardware driving past on the Reuters cam right now - wish they would zoom out so we could see what it is. Sounds like a pretty significant convoy!



posted on Nov, 18 2012 @ 12:33 AM
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Originally posted by Zaphod58
reply to post by intrptr
 


About the only system that would have a shot (yeah I know, horrible ain't it) at taking down anything, and surviving for any length of time, is the ZSU-23-2/4 (2 barrel/4 barrel) which there is almost no chance of seeing in Hamas hands. It's a potent self propelled gun system, that still puts fear into pilots, especially if they are taken by surprise.






posted on Nov, 18 2012 @ 12:34 AM
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reply to post by Curio
 


I think the drones have gone too, well it sounded like it before Harry's feed was cut.

If that is the case, does that mean incoming ground assault or perhaps ceasefire?

ETA: Can still hear some drones, but not as loud as it has been.
edit on 18-11-2012 by auroraaus because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 18 2012 @ 12:35 AM
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I don't know if this has been posted. I'm trying to stay away but I just can't do it. All that runs through my head is how much worse has it gotten? Are they any closer to a cease fire?

Cease fire or ground offensive?


The goal of a ground offensive would not be to topple the Hamas regime, but rather to inflict enormous damage on critical Hamas terrorist infrastructure. A ground offensive carries risks for soldiers, and the IDF is braced for the possibility of casualties. Hamas would find itself on the receiving end of overwhelming force, and might struggle to recover from the confrontation.


That last bit really bugged me. They would rather inflict enormous damage than remove the Threat altogether?

That just really bothered me.



posted on Nov, 18 2012 @ 12:35 AM
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Still going past - sounds like heavy trucks or even tanks to me. Not heard anything like this on the feeds before - something is happening, for sure


EDIT: They usually show stuff on the road of any interest. They must have been told they're not allowed to film troops movements - just the skyline. Heavy vehicles still going past. over 50 now.
edit on 18-11-2012 by Curio because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 18 2012 @ 12:39 AM
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reply to post by Zaphod58
 

Geez, I can Imagine...

en.wikipedia.org...

Quad... 23mm... radar guided... tracked. Gulp.

I'd think its safe to say that they didn't smuggle any of these thru tunnels from Egypt.



posted on Nov, 18 2012 @ 12:41 AM
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Originally posted by Curio
Sounds like a ton of hardware driving past on the Reuters cam right now - wish they would zoom out so we could see what it is. Sounds like a pretty significant convoy!


me too i wish they would swing the camera around to get a perspective of where they are. sometimes it sounds like they are on the side of a freeway.



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