Woman dies after abortion request 'refused' at Galway hospital (Ireland)

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posted on Nov, 15 2012 @ 01:44 AM
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This is just an excerpt from the source, please read the link given if you wish to join the discussion.


Savita Halappanavar's family said she asked several times for her pregnancy to be terminated because she had severe back pain and was miscarrying. Her husband told the BBC that it was refused because there was a foetal heartbeat.


BBC Link


This is an example of a woman who has been denied medical treatment to save her own life because the baby she was willingly carrying to term had a heartbeat. For those of you that dont know, abortion is illegal in Ireland because of catholic churches political influence. What makes this case even more interesting is that Savita Halappanavar - A dentist, was a Hindu. Despite the fact that the doctors knew she was miscarrying they refused to induce her (And save her life in the process) all because of the law which is heavily influenced by the church.


Im sure many people will agree that the actions this particular hospital took were negligent - the point of a hospital is to save lives & treat illness. But i find it shocking that someone would put their religious beliefs before a patients life and even after that patient requested to be induced.


She died of septicaemia and E Coli. She died after three and a half days of excruciating pain. She died after repeatedly begging for an end to the pregnancy that was poisoning her. Her death would have been avoided if she had been given an abortion when she asked for it – when it was clear she was miscarrying, and that non-intervention would put her at risk. But the foetus, which had no chance of survival, still had a heartbeat. Its right to life quite literally trumped hers.

Guardian report


This woman lost her "right to life" when she got pregnant. She lost her right to make decisions about her own body. Had she already been a mother, her children would have grown up motherless. Her husband must be devastated as well as her family and friends. She had someone else's religious views forced upon her without any consideration to her own.

This is why church and state should remain separate. Professionalism requires you to leave your Political, Spiritual and Personal beliefs at home.

A woman's right to her own body should not be an issue in the 21st century. Clearly, abortion needs to be legalized in Ireland. If you dont believe in abortion then dont have one - but don't force other people to conform to your beliefs. Two lives were lost, many more traumatized. Its a real shame because im sure dentist's are in short supply in Ireland as they are in the UK.

Big round of applause for catholic bigots please.
/End sarcasm.


Your thoughts ATS? Should she have been allowed an abortion because it was her life risk? Or because she was a Hindu and therefore did not follow or believe in the catholic doctrines?
edit on 15-11-2012 by SearchLightsInc because: (no reason given)
edit on 15-11-2012 by SearchLightsInc because: (no reason given)




posted on Nov, 15 2012 @ 02:04 AM
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A tragic story. people need to learn.



posted on Nov, 15 2012 @ 02:05 AM
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In my opinion she should have been allowed an abortion because it is her body and, I believe, her choice. (the fact that she was Hindu and that she really needed the abortion to live are both secondary for me, although also valid arguments)

I don't "like" abortions but just because I don't like something or because it goes against some people's beliefs doesn't mean it should apply to anyone but the person(s) opposed.

The fact that she was clearly in danger (and did die) is sickening to me.

A very sad situation.



posted on Nov, 15 2012 @ 02:20 AM
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Karma is a b****...sounds mean but it's true.

2nd.


+5 more 
posted on Nov, 15 2012 @ 02:22 AM
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Originally posted by DeadSnow
Karma is a b****...sounds mean but it's true.

2nd.



I dont understand? Karma implies that somehow she deserved to die?



posted on Nov, 15 2012 @ 02:24 AM
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This tragic event has somewhat been overtaken and diverted into a pro/anti abortion discussion which I believe is distracting from what really went on here.

In ireland you can have an abortion if your life is in danger, although the law is a little grey in this area. This type of medical intervention to save the mother happens on a regular basis.

What appears to have happened in this case, is that the medical team screwed up big time. Either they made bad medical descisions, or were not sure of their legal rights. either way they screwed up.

Women dying due to pregnancy related issues is extremely rare in Ireland.

I don't have strong opinons on the abortion topic, although I do lean toward people should be able to make thier own descision when it comes to such things.


All that said, Its a terrible thing to happen to this poor woman and her family, and I feel its a case of serious human error



posted on Nov, 15 2012 @ 02:30 AM
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Ill say it again.

Don't worry.

The state knows exactly what is right for you and your family.



posted on Nov, 15 2012 @ 02:36 AM
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Originally posted by Coppertone
This tragic event has somewhat been overtaken and diverted into a pro/anti abortion discussion which I believe is distracting from what really went on here.

In ireland you can have an abortion if your life is in danger, although the law is a little grey in this area. This type of medical intervention to save the mother happens on a regular basis.

What appears to have happened in this case, is that the medical team screwed up big time. Either they made bad medical descisions, or were not sure of their legal rights. either way they screwed up.

Women dying due to pregnancy related issues is extremely rare in Ireland.

I don't have strong opinons on the abortion topic, although I do lean toward people should be able to make thier own descision when it comes to such things.


All that said, Its a terrible thing to happen to this poor woman and her family, and I feel its a case of serious human error



But if abortion had been legal in the first place it would have been a non issue. The pregnancy would have been terminated, her life saved and she would be free to try again at a later date in time to have a child. Also im making a point of highlighting that immigration into Ireland means that the catholic church is not the only religious voice in that country. I truly believe that abortion should be legalized and that women have a choice over their own bodies. This is a terrible loss of life without due cause.


+9 more 
posted on Nov, 15 2012 @ 02:46 AM
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Mis-information or what!

I live in Ireland, so lets clear the facts up.

Abortion isnt illegal in Ireland as such, Medical staff in hospitals can carry out abortions providing the mothers life is in danger.

In Ireland abortion rights have nothing to do with the church, we have held 2 referendums where the public decided to vote against abortion. No doubt we will have a third referendum soon. It is the democratic will of the people of Ireland that has so far decided against abortions for anything other than I mentioned above.

The Lady in question went to Galway University Hospital complaining about back problems, she was 17 weeks into her pregnancy. THe hospital admited her to a ward and it was explained to her that she had a good chance that her body wasnt going to carry the pregnancy full term.

On hearing this news the lady requested an abortion, It was explained to her that in Ireland it was illegal to carry out an abortion unless her life was in danger.

The lady requested again several times.

The hospital did a scan on the baby and it was found that the baby had a heart beat and because at this stage her life was in no danger the reuest for an abortion was refused.

A few days later the lady was taken ill and admitted to ICU, at this stage her body was miscarrying the child.

The woman died in ICU from Septicemia.

It was only when she was admitted to ICU that her life was in danger, at this stage she was loosing the child anyhow so an abortion would have been no good.

This is nothing more than a tragic incident that many people in Ireland are now using for their own gain to force through abortion rights that would be similar to the UK or US where people can simply walk of the street and get abortions.

For the record I do think abortion laws in Ireland need changing for certain reasons such as medical conditions and rape but I would be against a UK and US style of abortions for any reason. But I think its very disgusting that people in Ireland are using this poor ladies tragic loss for their own gain.
edit on 15-11-2012 by bluloa because: (no reason given)
edit on 15-11-2012 by bluloa because: extra
edit on 15-11-2012 by bluloa because: corrections.



posted on Nov, 15 2012 @ 02:56 AM
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bluloa - I live in ireland also, seems you have to most up-to-date info on the case. and I pretty much agree with your assesment.

lots of people are using this tradegy to trumpet thier own agenda's. Even given your updated account of things. I still have a feeling a mistake was made on the medical side, not that I have any proof, but only becuase deaths like this are so rare in Ireland. Then again, bad stuff happens even with all the best care in the world.

It'll all come out in the investigation either way.



posted on Nov, 15 2012 @ 02:57 AM
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Originally posted by bluloa


It was only when she was admitted to ICU that her life was in danger, at this stage she was loosing the child anyhow so an abortion would have been no good.


you want to explain this one to me?
the point was that she was going to lose the child regardless but had she gotten the abortion her life would have been saved making this whole thing a complete waste of life all due to religious influence in politics
edit on 15-11-2012 by sirhumperdink because: (no reason given)


+2 more 
posted on Nov, 15 2012 @ 03:03 AM
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Originally posted by bluloa
Mis-information or what!

I live in Ireland, so lets clear the facts up.

Abortion isnt illegal in Ireland as such, Medical staff in hospitals can carry out abortions providing the mothers life is in danger.


Can you freely seek an abortion in any case? No? Then its illegal.


In Ireland abortion rights have nothing to do with the church, we have held 2 referendums where the public decided to vote against abortion. No doubt we will have a third referendum soon. It is the democratic will of the people of Ireland that has so far decided against abortions for anything other than I mentioned above.


Ireland's roman cathoc population (as of 2004) is said to be around 88.4%, so ofcourse people are going to be against something such as abortion.Source


The Lady in question went to Galway University Hospital complaining about back problems, she was 17 weeks into her pregnancy. THe hospital admited here where it was explained to her that she had a good chance that her body wasnt going to carry the pregnancy full term.


And at that point she should have been given a choice to either abort or continue at her own risk.


On hearing this news the lady requested an abortion, It was explained to her that in Ireland it was illegal to carry out an abortion unless her life was in danger.


And her life was in danger, they knew that but failed to act accordingly?


The lady requested again several times.

The hospital did a scan on the baby and it was found that the baby had a hart beat.


Despite the baby having a heartbeat, her body was miscarrying - there was no way the baby was going to survive but they still refused to abort.


A few days later the lady was taken ill and admitted to ICU, at this stage her body was miscarrying the child.


She was ill when she got to the hospital, she was miscarrying her baby from the very start.


The woman died in ICU from septicimia.


Caused by???????? The foetus maybe??


It was only when she was admitted to ICU that her life was in danger, at this stage she was loosing the child anyhow so an abortion would have been no good.


Did you really just say that? Had they acted earlier her life would have been saved, instead they selfishly decided to keep her alive for 3 days just because the baby (that had no chance of living) had a heartbeat. She wouldnt have ended up in ICU had people been doing their jobs - Saving lives.


This is nothing more than a tragic incident that many people in Ireland are now using for their own gain to force through abortion rights that would be similar to the UK or US where people can simply walk of the street and get abortions.



Why shouldnt women be allowed to seek abortions? Dont try and downplay the fact that this woman has been denied rights to her own body, to her own survival and even had her own religious views cast aside. She would have lived had such a stupid law not been in effect.


For the record I do think abortion laws in Ireland need changing for certain reasons such as medical conditions and rape but I would be against a UK and US style of abortions for any reason.


That's your view and i respect that, but no one would be forcing you to get an abortion if they became legal.


But I think its very disgusting that people in Ireland are using this poor ladies tragic loss for their own gain


They are using a prime example of how the law makes victims of people, there's nothing disgusting about that.



posted on Nov, 15 2012 @ 03:25 AM
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Originally posted by sirhumperdink

Originally posted by bluloa


It was only when she was admitted to ICU that her life was in danger, at this stage she was loosing the child anyhow so an abortion would have been no good.


you want to explain this one to me?
the point was that she was going to lose the child regardless but had she gotten the abortion her life would have been saved making this whole thing a complete waste of life all due to religious influence in politics
edit on 15-11-2012 by sirhumperdink because: (no reason given)


At the time she was admitted into hospital her life was in no danger.

The hospital obvoiusly no matter how unlikely the outcome would be wanted to do their best for the unborn child and give it a fighting chance to survive.

Once the mothers life was in danger the woman would have been given an abortion however because she was going to miscarry this wasnt needed.

Im sorry you dont like the democratic laws of Ireland but thats how it is. We have chosen by majority to put the rights of unborn children paramount unless the mothers life is in danger. We certainly dont need abortion supermarkets like they have in the UK where teenage girls can behave anyway they want and the abortion clinic will sort out their little problems.



posted on Nov, 15 2012 @ 03:30 AM
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Originally posted by bluloa
We certainly dont need abortion supermarkets like they have in the UK where teenage girls can behave anyway they want and the abortion clinic will sort out their little problems.



And still, there is a great emphasis on controlling a women's sexuality when we talk about abortion.

What makes me really mad is that women have to travel from Ireland to the UK in order to attain an abortion, things could be a lot simpler for everyone if we used our brains.



posted on Nov, 15 2012 @ 03:37 AM
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Originally posted by SearchLightsInc

Originally posted by bluloa
Mis-information or what!

I live in Ireland, so lets clear the facts up.

Abortion isnt illegal in Ireland as such, Medical staff in hospitals can carry out abortions providing the mothers life is in danger.


Can you freely seek an abortion in any case? No? Then its illegal.

Correct, is that a bad thing?


In Ireland abortion rights have nothing to do with the church, we have held 2 referendums where the public decided to vote against abortion. No doubt we will have a third referendum soon. It is the democratic will of the people of Ireland that has so far decided against abortions for anything other than I mentioned above.


Ireland's roman cathoc population (as of 2004) is said to be around 88.4%, so ofcourse people are going to be against something such as abortion.Source

A huge majority of people in Ireland have turned away from the church after the abuse cases, even the Taoiseach (Primeminister) attacked the church in our parliment. (Dail).

Religion has nothing to do with this, its a simple case of protecting unborm children, however I do think the law should be amended for rape and certain medical conditions.



The Lady in question went to Galway University Hospital complaining about back problems, she was 17 weeks into her pregnancy. THe hospital admited here where it was explained to her that she had a good chance that her body wasnt going to carry the pregnancy full term.


And at that point she should have been given a choice to either abort or continue at her own risk.

At that point there was no risk to her, why shouldnt the child be given a right to survive?


On hearing this news the lady requested an abortion, It was explained to her that in Ireland it was illegal to carry out an abortion unless her life was in danger.


And her life was in danger, they knew that but failed to act accordingly?

Her life was only in danger when she was admitted to ICU.


The lady requested again several times.

The hospital did a scan on the baby and it was found that the baby had a hart beat.


Despite the baby having a heartbeat, her body was miscarrying - there was no way the baby was going to survive but they still refused to abort.


A few days later the lady was taken ill and admitted to ICU, at this stage her body was miscarrying the child.


She was ill when she got to the hospital, she was miscarrying her baby from the very start.

You dont know that and her life was most certainly not in any danger. If it was she could have had the abortion.


The woman died in ICU from septicimia.


Caused by???????? The foetus maybe??

We dont know, it could have been caused by any number of factors, Do you think she got E-Coli from the foetus?


It was only when she was admitted to ICU that her life was in danger, at this stage she was loosing the child anyhow so an abortion would have been no good.


Did you really just say that? Had they acted earlier her life would have been saved, instead they selfishly decided to keep her alive for 3 days just because the baby (that had no chance of living) had a heartbeat. She wouldnt have ended up in ICU had people been doing their jobs - Saving lives.

They gave the child a chance, he life was in no danger at the start, because of a series of tragic events her body eventually gave up. We dont know if she caught anything from the hospital such as E-Coli, your simply jumping the gun and trying to join up the dots for your own agenda. Let the hospital report from medical proffesionals come out and we will see what really happened.


This is nothing more than a tragic incident that many people in Ireland are now using for their own gain to force through abortion rights that would be similar to the UK or US where people can simply walk of the street and get abortions.



Why shouldnt women be allowed to seek abortions? Dont try and downplay the fact that this woman has been denied rights to her own body, to her own survival and even had her own religious views cast aside. She would have lived had such a stupid law not been in effect.







edit on 15-11-2012 by bluloa because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 15 2012 @ 03:40 AM
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Originally posted by SearchLightsInc

Originally posted by bluloa
We certainly dont need abortion supermarkets like they have in the UK where teenage girls can behave anyway they want and the abortion clinic will sort out their little problems.



And still, there is a great emphasis on controlling a women's sexuality when we talk about abortion.

What makes me really mad is that women have to travel from Ireland to the UK in order to attain an abortion, things could be a lot simpler for everyone if we used our brains.


Actually you can travel to Northern Ireland now as an abortion clinic recently opened up there.

But in reply to your post, Why should women be allowed to kill unborn children, Is it the fault of the child that it was created by the recklessness of the mother?



posted on Nov, 15 2012 @ 03:47 AM
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Originally posted by bluloa

Originally posted by SearchLightsInc

Originally posted by bluloa
We certainly dont need abortion supermarkets like they have in the UK where teenage girls can behave anyway they want and the abortion clinic will sort out their little problems.



And still, there is a great emphasis on controlling a women's sexuality when we talk about abortion.

What makes me really mad is that women have to travel from Ireland to the UK in order to attain an abortion, things could be a lot simpler for everyone if we used our brains.


Actually you can travel to Northern Ireland now as an abortion clinic recently opened up there.

But in reply to your post, Why should women be allowed to kill unborn children, Is it the fault of the child that it was created by the recklessness of the mother?




Because some of us do not believe an unborn child has any rights, who are you to dictate differently? And not all unwanted children come about because of the mothers "recklessness" - married women, women in long term relationships seeks abortions, that's just how it is. Why should THEY be denied? Should they simply just stop having a sex life because they don't want to risk pregnancy?



posted on Nov, 15 2012 @ 03:49 AM
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Abortion should be allowed when required to save the mother, and I am sure this is already the case in Ireland. So this is not a fault of bad laws, but more like medical malpractice.

At 17 weeks, she would have been refused an abortion in plenty of countries including my own, this is not necessarily specific to Ireland.



posted on Nov, 15 2012 @ 03:54 AM
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reply to post by SearchLightsInc
 


They could use protection to ensure that they don't get pregnant, you have to be careful when you sleep with a partner and not have abortion as a get out of jail free card....



posted on Nov, 15 2012 @ 04:00 AM
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Originally posted by bluloa


Can you freely seek an abortion in any case? No? Then its illegal.

Correct, is that a bad thing?



Yes it is. And stating that abortion is legal when you cannot freely have one makes it illegal, for the record.


Ireland's roman cathoc population (as of 2004) is said to be around 88.4%, so ofcourse people are going to be against something such as abortion.Source

A huge majority of people in Ireland have turned away from the church after the abuse cases, even the Taoiseach (Primeminister) attacked the church in our parliment. (Dail).
Religion has nothing to do with this, its a simple case of protecting unborm children, however I do think the law should be amended for rape and certain medical conditions.


I'll take your word for it.


And at that point she should have been given a choice to either abort or continue at her own risk.

At that point there was no risk to her, why shouldnt the child be given a right to survive?


They knew the risk but because the child had a heartbeat they refused to abort when they should have. Their ignorance cost her HER life, the child did not have a chance but she did. She wanted the child but it wasnt to be on this occasion, now she's dead. 2 birds, one stone - You cant justify it.



And her life was in danger, they knew that but failed to act accordingly?

Her life was only in danger when she was admitted to ICU.



Her life was in danger before that point, her miscarrying was what caused her to be put in ICU, had the baby been aborted before then she would have survived and never would have become sick enough to be placed in ICU.



Despite the baby having a heartbeat, her body was miscarrying - there was no way the baby was going to survive but they still refused to abort.

A few days later the lady was taken ill and admitted to ICU, at this stage her body was miscarrying the child.


She was ill when she got to the hospital, she was miscarrying her baby from the very start.


You dont know that and her life was most certainly not in any danger. If it was she could have had the abortion.


It became clear when she arrived at the hospital she was miscarrying. Simple really.


The woman died in ICU from septicimia.

Caused by???????? The foetus maybe??

We dont know, it could have been caused by any number of factors, Do you think she got E-Coli from the foetus?


Her death, whatever the actual medical reason was directly caused by the fact that she was miscarrying a baby and no one did anything to induce her.


It was only when she was admitted to ICU that her life was in danger, at this stage she was loosing the child anyhow so an abortion would have been no good.

Did you really just say that? Had they acted earlier her life would have been saved, instead they selfishly decided to keep her alive for 3 days just because the baby (that had no chance of living) had a heartbeat. She wouldnt have ended up in ICU had people been doing their jobs - Saving lives.

They gave the child a chance, he life was in no danger at the start, because of a series of tragic events her body eventually gave up. We dont know if she caught anything from the hospital such as E-Coli, your simply jumping the gun and trying to join up the dots for your own agenda. Let the hospital report from medical proffesionals come out and we will see what really happened.



In giving that child a chance they killed her in the process, how is that logical? That's murder. She originally goes to hospital for back pains but you're claiming she died from E-Coli she picked up from the hospital? Come on, seriously??





 
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