Have Atheists Given Up Here?

Originally posted by Prezbo369
Religion and belief had a big part in ww2

No, it didn't. It had a tangental role, but the predominant factor was the economic condition of Germany post-hyper inflation. The Jews were just a rallying scapegoat.

Let's also not forget the tens of millions killed by the Soviet, Chinese and Cambodian governments in the 20th Century -- secular institutions that were bereft of an "invisible sky father" but still managed to outdo anything that the religious fanatics have managed to muster.

It was only a matter of time before you rolled that old chestnut out eh?

Old chestnut? Mustaches?

How dare you trivialize the deaths of millions of human beings? Do you think that religion played any role in the deaths of the millions in the Soviet Union, Communist China or Pol Pot Cambodia?

Well, actually they were -- universities arose out of the Catholic religious schools, and science and medicine out of them.

Those institutions would've been eventually developed elsewhere, the specific belief in a sky daddy had no direct part in their development.

Oh yeah? Prove it.

That's what your god of science tells you, right? Hard facts are required to make your point. You're welcome to make that point with your hard facts.

Originally posted by darkhorserider
reply to post by liejunkie01

 

What are you talking about? They try to hang out the atheist, but look at who is really being hung out? I don't understand that phrase.

All of the atheists I have ever debated on ATS turned out to not be atheists at all. I haven't encountered anyone that doesn't believe in some spiritual aspect in man and nature. They often despise religion (as do I), and they are often undecided, and they are often certain that no personified magical deity resides on a cloud and orchestrates every aspect of our life, I agree with all of that 100%. That belief does not make them an atheist.

The debates then usually turn to gnostic v. agnostic, and other technical terminology, but let's get to the heart of the matter. The common vernacular of a atheist is someone who does not believe in God. Any god. Most interpret that to mean they have a purely evolutionary, accidental life outlook. No creator, no part of our being pre-existed, and no part of our being will exist after our death. That is what the layman thinks of an atheist. I have never met an atheist that believes that way, so in laymen's terms, they are not atheists at all. Most think there is some spiritual connection, or some purpose to our existence, or some type of creation before the evolution, etc., etc. Buddhists are not atheists. Wiccans are not Atheists. Luciferians and Satanists are not atheists. People that describe themselves as "spiritual but not religious" are not atheist.

Are there any people on ATS that believe wholeheartedly that they are merely an accident of favorable conditions
and biology, with evolution being solely responsible for their complicated system of cell organization into the many organ systems that comprise their body, and that when they die, and the flesh rots, there is absolutely nothing that persists to reform or rejoin the rest of creation? That is an atheist.

Hello,

My name is liejunkie01 and I absolutely do not believe in a higher power.

I believe man made God.

Have a nice day.

reply to post by liejunkie01

Hello,

My name is liejunkie01 and I absolutely do not believe in a higher power.

I believe man made God.

Have a nice day.

Nice to meet ya!

When you say you do not believe in a higher power, and that man made god, does that mean you don't believe any part of you existed in any form before birth, and no part of you (other than a memory or a headstone of course), but no part of you will persevere after your death? You won't rejoin any kind of centralized spirit or unit, you won't be recast into 1000 butterflyes, or a new human, and you won't evolve to some other form of consciousness? Just plain dead. Forever.

I'm perfectly fine with that belief, I just want to make sure that is indeed your belief. If so, then you are what most of us laymen consider to be an atheist.

Also, if that is your belief, do you waste any moments of your life listening to mundane lectures, sitting in traffic jams, or vegging in front of the TV? Because if I had that belief, any wasted second of my time would be excruciating, and I would tear through life like the Tasmanian Devil!

70 or so years is gone in an instant, in fact, over half of mine have already passed. If I believed there was no point to it, no lesson, no spiritual evolution, I would NOT be typing on this computer at this second, I would be eating, screwing, partying, hoarding, consuming life in every manner like there was no tomorrow. Because, well, there isn't one!

Originally posted by darkhorserider
reply to post by liejunkie01

 

Hello,

My name is liejunkie01 and I absolutely do not believe in a higher power.

I believe man made God.

Have a nice day.

Nice to meet ya!

When you say you do not believe in a higher power, and that man made god, does that mean you don't believe any part of you existed in any form before birth, and no part of you (other than a memory or a headstone of course), but no part of you will persevere after your death? You won't rejoin any kind of centralized spirit or unit, you won't be recast into 1000 butterflyes, or a new human, and you won't evolve to some other form of consciousness? Just plain dead. Forever.

I'm perfectly fine with that belief, I just want to make sure that is indeed your belief. If so, then you are what most of us laymen consider to be an atheist.

Also, if that is your belief, do you waste any moments of your life listening to mundane lectures, sitting in traffic jams, or vegging in front of the TV? Because if I had that belief, any wasted second of my time would be excruciating, and I would tear through life like the Tasmanian Devil!

70 or so years is gone in an instant, in fact, over half of mine have already passed. If I believed there was no point to it, no lesson, no spiritual evolution, I would NOT be typing on this computer at this second, I would be eating
, screwing, partying, hoarding, consuming life in every manner like there was no tomorrow. Because, well, there isn't one!

With all due respect,


I think that consciencenesss is perceived by the brain. With no brain function there is no conscienceness....when the brain is dead, your conscience is no more. Your energy is recycled back into the cosmos

You do not transform into energy. Remember energy is neither created or destroyed. I am talking g atomic energy in atoms, proton, neutrons and such. Not conscience.

I can tell you that I went to church every Sunday until I was 13.

Then this thing called "logic" took over me instead of a belief system. Since hen I have not looked back and I do not regret it.

I have done the girls, partying, booze, and drugs friend. I can tell you this.

No one can tell you the meaning of life. You have to find your own meaning of your life. One has to expand ones mnd to really grasp what this pertains. Being led to believe something by someone else's belief system is not finding your reasons as to why you are here and what your purpose is.

Did you find your purpose?

Or did someone tell you your purpose?

reply to post by liejunkie01

Did you find your purpose?

Or did someone tell you your purpose?

My purpose is to experience life to the fullest, and in the process of that experience evolve my soul to learn to accept failures and tragedies and enjoy the minute details of every joy. There is no real purpose to life other than to evolve. There is no rhyme or reason to the things that happen throughout life, they are just part of the grand experience. There is really no such thing as joy or pain here.

In fact, everything except this very minute moment is imaginary. Everything in the past only exists in our memories and story books, and everything in the future is only imaginary until it actually happens. There are a bunch of people right now planning for what they will do later tonight, or first thing tomorrow, and many of them won't ever make it. They'll die, or things will change in the meantime. The future is imaginary, the past is imaginary, and the purpose of life is to learn to accept that only this fleeting moment is real.

And "NO," nobody told me that. People have told me lots and lots of things, and some of it was useful and some of it was junk, and I learned to find my own way.

Originally posted by rival

Merriam Webster
Definition of ATHEISM
a : a disbelief in the existence of deity
b : the doctrine that there is no deity

We're mincing words with these definitions, and I guess people fall into all kinds of categories,
but atheist means atheist. What you describe above is an "anti-theist." As I stated before, atheists
don't solely stand in opposition to theists--they actively believe there is no God.

The definition taken from [url=[/url] page, is partly incorrect (as can be seen in the comments on that page). There is no doctrine, no codification of beliefs or a body of teachings or instructions, taught principles or positions, there's simply the rejection of the specific claim made by theists.

It's not saying 'yes' when asked if you believe in god(s), nothing else.

And you're right, Atheist means Atheist:

A- without, theism- belief in god(s).

Whereas anti-theist:

Anti- against, theism- belief in god(s)

I would be lying to myself to say that I "believe" either way. And there are three viable answers to the
God question; I believe, I don't believe, and I choose not to believe either way

You either believe a claim, or you don't....

I cede that point. Though it is true that in everyday language even top astrophysicists have
stated that the universe was created at the moment of the Big Bang.

But I thought the whole creator theme was the reason why you were so hesitant to have a position on this?

Originally posted by adjensen

No, it didn't. It had a tangental role, but the predominant factor was the economic condition of Germany post-hyper inflation. The Jews were just a rallying scapegoat.

You asked what part religeon had in WW2, and I gave you a list.....

And how dare you trivialize the deaths of millions of human beings!

just a rallying scapegoat indeed

For shame!

Let's also not forget the tens of millions killed by the Soviet, Chinese and Cambodian governments in the 20th Century -- secular institutions that were bereft of an "invisible sky father" but still managed to outdo anything that the religious fanatics have managed to muster.

And next you attempt to use the deaths of millions more in a completely fallacious and dishonest way in an attempt to make a point on an internet forum??

The vile and disgusting excuses for human beings that committed such atrocities did so for a plethora of reasons, none of which was a rejection of the claims made by folk such as yourself.

Such a claim is now almost a cliché, hence the old chestnut....

Oh yeah? Prove it.

That's what your god of science tells you, right? Hard facts are required to make your point. You're welcome to make that point with your hard facts.

Yurp that's what my god of science says, because you simply can't function without a god/imaginary friend constantly watching you, reading your thoughts, caring about who you have sex with...........right?....

And you claim to be a scientist.........lol