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Obama wants a $1.6 Trillion tax increase -- Here comes the Gordian Knots !

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posted on Nov, 13 2012 @ 11:41 PM
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According to a Wall Street Journal story, Obama is insisting on a $1.6 Trillion tax increase over 10 years.

This "announcement" contradicts Obama's own "deal talking" last year when the $800 billion figure was in play.

House Speaker Boehner is now on the spot, as Obama and Democrats will play hard ball and stall any agreements and then WHAMM...

The current tax rates expire and Democrats get everything they want including a perfect "blame game".

The unrealistic proposals are already starting and legislation hasn't even been officially proposed yet !!

That's the game plan IMO. democrat strategy is to create as many Gordian Knots as possible.

The Democrats are "quietly" wishing for all the tax cuts to expire. Deep down, they want everybody to pay.

Just think -- they can really spend like crazy and even increase the national debt at the same time !!

The "blame game" will be accelerated and used to get a House majority and gain Senate seats in 2014.


President Barack Obama will begin budget negotiations with congressional leaders Friday by calling for $1.6 trillion in additional tax revenue over the next decade, far more than Republicans are likely to accept and double the $800 billion discussed in talks with GOP leaders during the summer of 2011.

Mr. Obama, in a meeting Tuesday with union leaders and other liberal activists, also pledged to hang tough in seeking tax increases on wealthy Americans. In one sign of conciliation, he made no specific commitment to leave unscathed domestic programs such as Medicare, leaving the door open to spending cuts many fellow ...

Obama Sets Steep Tax Target
President to Seek $1.6 Trillion More in Revenue, Double Level From 2011 Talks

 


2nd opinion:

President Barack Obama has responded to House Speaker John Boehner's gesture last week towards reaching a deal to avoid the Jan. 1 "fiscal cliff" of tax hikes and spending cuts, putting a specific demand on the table: $1.6 trillion in new tax revenues, reached by raising tax rates on the wealthy in addition to other "tax revenues." The offer is twice as high as a deal Obama scuttled last year, suggesting he may be prepared to let talks fail again.

Last week, Boehner proposed raising "revenues," but not "rates"--the same position he took during negotiations on raising the debt ceiling in the summer of 2011. Then, Boehner had agreed on raising revenues by $800 billion--all without raising tax rates. The White House had been prepared to agree on the deal, until President Obama decided to demand an additional $400 billion from increased tax rates, destroying the "grand bargain."..........

1.6 Trillion? Obama Doesn't Want a Deal
 



Liberals will step up the efforts to craft legislation and proposals to make any "nay" votes easier to have the "look and feel" of shame and against the common good. They will do everything possible to eliminate the checks & balances system.

Raving jealousy will reign supreme.

Democrat Strategy =
 


And it seems Obama has lowered that magical $250,000 income to $200,000.......

This is something new. During the campaign, President Obama promised that he would not increase taxes for those making beneath $250,000 per year. He reiterated that promise last week. But the top 2% of income earners include individuals earning more than $200,000. Obama’s bar is getting lower and lower. Those earning $200,000 are hardly millionaires. That’s a low-level lawyer at a major law firm. Or an average orthodontist.

But President Obama kept the MoveOn.org crowd happy. He’s not a uniter. He’s a divider. And his class warfare keeps getting more and more divisive, no matter how many songs he gets Bono to warble for him.

Obama Promises MoveOn.org: We'll Raise Taxes


Get Ready for 9% unemployment ....

and wilder binge spending !!





posted on Nov, 13 2012 @ 11:45 PM
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1.6 trillion over a decade is meaningless 100+billion a year that neither keeps up with the cost of programs we already have or take in to account the increased costs of the care act as well as the population increases,age progression making the cost of socialized healthcare programs such as medicare,and medicaid more expensive.

They do not have a damn clue and then we have those people covered under the care act that make up to 100k a year.



posted on Nov, 13 2012 @ 11:46 PM
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Ben Stein said it best: Cut spending, raise taxes.




posted on Nov, 13 2012 @ 11:48 PM
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reply to post by Hawking
 


If you cut spending there is no reason to raise taxes

For crying out loud.



posted on Nov, 14 2012 @ 12:09 AM
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Obama is already starting a "pre-blame" game....


“Right now, if Congress fails to come to an agreement on an overall deficit reduction package by the end of the year, everybody’s taxes will automatically go up on January 1st – everybody’s – including the 98 percent of Americans who make less than $250,000 a year.”


Ahh YES.

Obama Draws Line in the Sand Over Higher Taxes

He is a master of Gordian Knotism




House Republicans have made it clear they are open to increasing government revenues as part of a compromise. Speaker John Boehner (R-Ohio) said in a speech last week that he would support tax reform or other ideas that draw in more federal revenue in exchange for up-front cuts to federal spending.

The president, however, made clear in his statement Friday that he would only accept a deal that raises taxes on a narrow group of people making more than $250,000 per year, a long-held Obama demand.



posted on Nov, 14 2012 @ 12:28 AM
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Tighten your belts folks. I don't see an agreement being made. The super wealthy have infiltrated congress by means of lobbyists. There is no way they are going to agree to pay more taxes. You don't get rich by wasting money.

Not talking about trust fund kids, most rich people I know, are the cheapest people you will ever meet. To the extent they will pay 90 cents to save a dollar.

The middle class and small business is about to be crushed.



posted on Nov, 14 2012 @ 08:19 AM
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reply to post by xuenchen
 


It's all fluff. 1.6T over 10 years is pointless when you have 1.1T yearly deficits.



posted on Nov, 14 2012 @ 08:21 AM
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reply to post by xuenchen
 


Hmmm, what a lie. "If congress fails to come to an agreement". THEY ALREADY DID, he rejected it.



posted on Nov, 14 2012 @ 08:30 AM
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Originally posted by neo96
reply to post by Hawking
 


If you cut spending there is no reason to raise taxes

For crying out loud.


Wrong.

Do you think the 16 trillion dollar national debt is just going to pay itself down? It has to be a blend of spending cuts and revenue increases...that is if we are actually serious about not passing this abomination onto our children and grandchildren.

Do not be deceived. The economy will eventually heal itself regardless which party of the false two party system is in the Whitehouse. When that happens, the interest rates will begin to climb. When THAT happens, the lion's share of incoming revenue is going to be used up to service the interest alone on that monstrosity. The only way to reduce that pain is to try and pay down the principle as much as possible before the interest rates begin to climb...and they WILL climb...just a matter of time.

What we really need is a balanced budget to begin with, then additional incoming revenue can be applied to the debt...but you have to get the budget first...and that is apparently a joke nowadays.
edit on 11/14/2012 by Jeremiah65 because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 14 2012 @ 11:25 AM
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reply to post by xuenchen
 




I think you are confusing the words

INCREASE



and

EXPIRATION.



They are not the same.

Want Obama wants is an expiration of tax relief given in good times to people who didn't really need it but they were all good friends of the President in office so they got it anyway.

THE PEOPLE want that back. It isn't really Obama. He is just tryig to do what his base and the people that got him elected have asked him to.



posted on Nov, 14 2012 @ 11:27 AM
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Originally posted by litterbaux
Tighten your belts folks. I don't see an agreement being made. The super wealthy have infiltrated congress by means of lobbyists. There is no way they are going to agree to pay more taxes. You don't get rich by wasting money.

Not talking about trust fund kids, most rich people I know, are the cheapest people you will ever meet. To the extent they will pay 90 cents to save a dollar.

The middle class and small business is about to be crushed.



This is true. They will not be happy to see their tax breaks and loopholes removed but we all have to do what we have to to cut back. The rest of us are eating less. The wealthy are going to make it through "the very bad day."



posted on Nov, 14 2012 @ 11:43 AM
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reply to post by xuenchen
 


And that probably won't be enough. Realistically, it's going to take a marginal tax rate of about 40% for incomes between $250,000 & 1 million and somewhere around 50% on incomes over 1 million in order to pay down our deficit and meet the needs of this nation.

Just remember, when Reagan was in office, the top marginal rate was 50%. So what are you people crying about!
edit on 14-11-2012 by Flatfish because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 14 2012 @ 11:47 AM
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Originally posted by Jeremiah65
What we really need is a balanced budget to begin with, then additional incoming revenue can be applied to the debt...but you have to get the budget first...and that is apparently a joke nowadays



absolutely right. otherwise, we're feeding a growing debt and we'll get nowhere. Think of it like this:

you owe $20,000 on a credit card and your making minimum payments on it while still using it. The debt grows and you wind up servicing the interest on the debt, never making a dent in the actual debt.


Another, possibly bigger issue that will crush a large percentage of taxpayers but will, actually, be far more productive than a tax increase, is the lack of adjustment to the AMT.

If the gov't doesn't act quickly to adjust the threshold on AMT. If they don't adjust the numbers, about 60 million filers will be stuck with it. Decreased refunds or taxes due, retroactive to January 1, creating a huge amount of money flowing back to the IRS. While this is going to hurt like hell, it will actually be a big windfall, far better than raising the top 2%'s bracket. The downside, for the government, is that, by not acting, they will screw up the IRS's systems, resulting in delays in processing of those returns. Basically, they won't be ready to accept returns filed with AMT until some time in March. This means they can't get their grubby mitts on the money they normall get in January, February and March, potentially creating an even bigger need for funds on the short term.



posted on Nov, 14 2012 @ 12:05 PM
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When there are millions of Americans taking out more than they are paying in compound that with that infamous half of the country 47% who have zero income tax liability there is no way in hell a balanced budget will ever be had.

Making a minority pay for that majority is only going to raise around 60 billion there is a video floating around where the Potus said himself raising the taxes on the so called evil rich won't fix anything.



posted on Nov, 14 2012 @ 12:06 PM
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In no time in the history of humanity has a government, ANY GOVERNMENT, taken money and made itself smaller.

We need austerity measures now.

There.

I said it.

It needed to be said.



posted on Nov, 14 2012 @ 12:29 PM
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Right now its not even really about the deficit. They just need to get balanced and above board before thinking of paying it down. I think I read they overspent 160 billion last month alone.

160 billion a year is nothing. And no matter what he says about less then 250k not getting taxed, we will in other means. Fewer hours at work, higher cost at the store, etc etc. They will find a way to keep their profits high.



posted on Nov, 14 2012 @ 12:46 PM
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Originally posted by neo96
reply to post by Hawking
 


If you cut spending there is no reason to raise taxes

For crying out loud.


Economics not one of your strong suits huh? Cutting spending alone will not do it other revenue needs to be brought in. A flat tax should be implemented that has everyone paying the sane rate.



posted on Nov, 14 2012 @ 12:50 PM
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Originally posted by buster2010

Originally posted by neo96
reply to post by Hawking
 


If you cut spending there is no reason to raise taxes

For crying out loud.


Economics not one of your strong suits huh? Cutting spending alone will not do it other revenue needs to be brought in. A flat tax should be implemented that has everyone paying the sane rate.


Getting rather tired of the condescension on this site math is not the majorities strong suit at the moment

16 trillion dollars.
50 million on SS
50 million on medicare
50 million on medicaid
47 on welfare

2.5 trillion current federal spending borrow over 1 trillion from foreign countries.

More people are taking out of a system that paying in to it the system can not function which is the reason the clueless say tax the rich.

Cutting spending and raising taxes does nothing but keep continued stupidity in place.
edit on 14-11-2012 by neo96 because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 14 2012 @ 12:51 PM
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reply to post by buster2010
 


If they decided that rate is 47 percent, the person making $8.00 an hour, will be out on the street with a flat tax.



posted on Nov, 14 2012 @ 01:01 PM
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Remember when republicans caused the credit rating to drop in the US? Remember that? Because they wanted to make their Koch overlords richer and look like they stuck it to the dems, whilst making Obama look bad.

edit on 14-11-2012 by Trustfund because: (no reason given)






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