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Wealthy Are Dumping Assets Fast Before Year's End... Including Their Business Or Maybe Your Job

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posted on Nov, 13 2012 @ 08:53 PM
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reply to post by Tardacus
 


Why give government more money when they have proven time and again that they have no idea how to spend responsibly?




posted on Nov, 13 2012 @ 09:02 PM
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Here is a good write up about the Fiscal Cliff from an economist. In my personal opinion, it is a great thing if we hurry up and drop off of it. For poor people like me, it just evens the playing field.
The poor can't get any poorer, the rich have everything to lose.



posted on Nov, 13 2012 @ 09:09 PM
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The following is my opinion as a member participating in this discussion.


Originally posted by sligtlyskeptical
Sorry, but this is just BS. If you pay these employees regularly the IRS will be up your bum in no time.

They are not usually organized enough to detect it automatically. What will most likely happen though is that the employees that were terminated will tell the unemployment office why they lost their jobs. The state unemployment office will then turn that over for investigation. The company that pulled it on me, tried doing it from day one, so no one would have ever noticed it if someone (cannot imagine who that was
) hadn't threatened to turn them in.

When I got there, the understanding was that I was to be a full time employee, but they were not yet set up to pay out taxes and such. This went on for months, until my boss showed up with a letter stating that I understood that I was hired as a contractor, which was complete BS. He was blaming the investor for changing the “policy”, and stated that it was out of his control. I simply asked him who wanted to go to jail, him or the investor, and that situation ended pretty quickly.

The reason why companies get away with this sort of nonsense is simply that most employees are in fear of losing the jobs, and have no idea what the actual laws are. In that job, I was there because they asked me to come work for them, and I left another job to do it. Besides this, I had spent years as an AFLCIO union shop steward, and understood what the law was. Because most employees don't think about the fact that an employer has to pay workman's comp insurance, it never dawns on them that this is actually workman's comp fraud.


Originally posted by sligtlyskeptical
I would bet one of them will cause you significant legal problems.

If I was one of his employees, and he could not prove that when I left the job that it met the IRS criteria for being a “contractor”, I'd sue the pants off the company and the owners, then I'd turn them in to both the IRS and Division of Worker's Compensation.

As an ATS Staff Member, I will not moderate in threads such as this where I have participated as a member.



posted on Nov, 13 2012 @ 09:15 PM
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Originally posted by TheAngryFarm
reply to post by Ghost375
 


Actually its the fault of the government. With idiots like Barney Frank wanting lending requirements eased, so that every ghetto family with 10 kids and a net income of $8 a month can have a $300,000 house of their own.

Reckless governmental spending will be why this country collapses.

What are you talking about? It's the banks themselves that were doing the risky lending. Even if the law says they can lend to a certain person, doesn't mean they have to lend to that person. As much as I hate politicians, they aren't to blame for the economic crash of 2008. Should there have been more regulations? That's not really the issue though. It was the people in the private sector who did the acts that caused the collapse.

Now politicians are to blame for the US deficit. But the fact is the deficit doesn't actually have a direct correlation to the economy itself. The governmental debt and the economy are two different things.



posted on Nov, 13 2012 @ 09:21 PM
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reply to post by SeekerofTruth101
 


Exactly. GTFO.

The raw materials are still here. The engineering know how is still here. The skilled labor is still here. The tradespeople are still here. The warehouse space is still here. The track and the stock is still here. The trucks are still here. The factories are still here. The supply chain is still here. The storefronts are still here. Everyone who benefits from actual work being done, from doctors to dentists, restaurants and hardware stores -- all still here.

The only thing we risk losing are investment bankers and accounting irregularities, and I will never cry for either of those. Maybe now we can organize our selves into free-market companies, owned by their own employees (stakeholders) and not by investors (shareholders).

Sounds like a rough transition towards a win for everyone that matters.



posted on Nov, 13 2012 @ 09:24 PM
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Originally posted by darkhorserider
Here is a good write up about the Fiscal Cliff from an economist. In my personal opinion, it is a great thing if we hurry up and drop off of it. For poor people like me, it just evens the playing field.
The poor can't get any poorer, the rich have everything to lose.

The thing is "The Fiscal Cliff" isn't even the problem with our economy. It is a problem, and it may cause a downturn in the economy. But it will only effect preexisting problems with the economy. The problem with our economy is it's fake. we have a fiat money system. And it's this that will cause the collapse in the long run. You won't find anyone admitting this in the mainstream, or anywhere close to mainstream. It's starting to catch up to us. our economy should've collapsed back in 2008. But it's been artificially propped up since then.

You can't blame the government for the fake economy....the Federal Reserve isn't controlled by the US government, remember?

If the media is talking about a problem with the economy, you can bet your ass the real problem lies somewhere else....



posted on Nov, 13 2012 @ 09:42 PM
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Originally posted by davcwebb
Wealthy Are Dumping Assets Fast Before Year's End... Including Their Business Or Maybe Your Job


They're greedy, it's no surprise that they are shuffling and hiding their assets.

The Bush tax cuts have been in effect since he left office.
How has the economy benefited in the mean time?

Is there any evidence that such tax cuts for the super wealthy would even do this?

What say you Conservative economist Ben Stein?



Ah no wonder the tax cuts for the super rich haven't changed a thing.
There has never been any evidence showing that it would.

Doing the opposite however is another story...

- Lee



posted on Nov, 13 2012 @ 09:56 PM
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reply to post by davcwebb
 





tax cuts expire and spending cuts are set to go into effect


boo hoo..

a bunch of business owners have to pay the tax rate on the books finally..

now they dont want to play any more?

and a bunch of leech contractors wont get fat government checks for nothing?

oh you guys are breaking my heart..not.





posted on Nov, 13 2012 @ 10:11 PM
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Originally posted by Ghost375

Originally posted by TheAngryFarm
reply to post by Ghost375
 


Actually its the fault of the government. With idiots like Barney Frank wanting lending requirements eased, so that every ghetto family with 10 kids and a net income of $8 a month can have a $300,000 house of their own.

Reckless governmental spending will be why this country collapses.

What are you talking about? It's the banks themselves that were doing the risky lending. Even if the law says they can lend to a certain person, doesn't mean they have to lend to that person. As much as I hate politicians, they aren't to blame for the economic crash of 2008. Should there have been more regulations? That's not really the issue though. It was the people in the private sector who did the acts that caused the collapse.

Now politicians are to blame for the US deficit. But the fact is the deficit doesn't actually have a direct correlation to the economy itself. The governmental debt and the economy are two different things.



The problem was that the banks didn't hold the loans. If they did they never would have made them in the first place. They knew they would fail. If a fixed doubles in price in 3 years you can be pretty sure it will go the other way sooner than later. The government should have only backed loans the banks were willing to keep themselves. All the congress is responsible for what happened but they were too busy feeding off the trough to do anything about it. Both sides of the aisle.



posted on Nov, 13 2012 @ 11:31 PM
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reply to post by davcwebb
 


Yeah, everyone who actually works for a living or owns a business knows what keeping Obama in there means.
Too bad a big percentage of this country votes with their hearts hoping for miracles, instead of their heads using facts and history to learn by......



posted on Nov, 13 2012 @ 11:56 PM
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Why are you all bitching about the wealthy?
I do not agree they should have to pay more because they got more, that's redicilous
Taxes should be evenly paid across the board, everyone should pay a set percentage, say 10% of their income or whatever percentage, it should be fair and even

Ps before you ask, I am FAR from wealthy, I survive on my veterans pension



posted on Nov, 14 2012 @ 12:15 AM
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reply to post by defcon5
 


I worked for a company like that. It seems more common in the south where the mentality is that everything is at will/hire and fire. The wages are already lower in the south and people end up being trapped in places like this.

The company I worked for had several scams going and it was quite nauseating. I cant say who I worked for but we have multi-million dollar repair contracts and the entire operation is a sham. The people we were contracted to thought we did all the repairs in house but lo and behold everything is sent to china and repaired for next to nothing while allowing the customers proprietary software and peoples private information to fall into Chinese hands. The "warehouse" I was programming was nothing more than a point between taking in the product and shipping/receiving from China.

It was quite funny when the tsunami hit Japan to watch my bosses dancing around trying to explain why we were weeks behind since all of the merchandise which was supposed to be state side was stuck at an airport in Japan.

Even though I cant say who It was I worked for just know they are BIG and handle very sensitive information on millions of Americans.
edit on 14-11-2012 by NihilistSanta because: correction



posted on Nov, 14 2012 @ 03:00 AM
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I have noticed that time and time again, a lot of people tend to argue that we are in this mess because of capitalism and that it's evil, and so on and so forth. Let there be no mistake though, I'm not here to praise capitalism as if it is the most superior of all systems, but I'm neither against it. But there is a reason for this.

Just skip to about 37:25 in the video below and watch for a bit. He pretty much explains it in a way that makes the most sense, to me at least. You may not agree and that's fine. But I felt the need to throw that out there to those that want to blame the mess we're in on something that isn't even there and hasn't been in a long time.




“I hope that we shall crush in its birth the aristocracy of our monied corporations, which dare already to challenge our government to a trial of strength, and bid defiance to the laws of our country.” - Thomas Jefferson

^Which is unfortunate because now instead of us controlling the corporations, they now control us.

"Banks have done more injury to the religion, morality, tranquility, prosperity, and even wealth of the nation than they can have done or ever will do good.” - John Adams

^And we know who dominates our economy today. Yeah, the big banks.

“If the American people ever allow private banks to control the issue of their money, first by inflation and then by deflation, the banks and corporations that will grow up around them (around the banks), will deprive the people of their property until their children will wake up homeless on the continent their fathers conquered.” - Thomas Jefferson

^Which is interesting because it is those big banks that kick thousands, or probably much more, people out of their homes each year.


So, to sum it all up, I believe we're living in a corporatist system (which is considered a "collectivist" economic system) in which wealth and power are even more highly concentrated than they are under socialism or communism, and the truth is that none of them are "egalitarian" economic systems. Under all collectivist systems, a small elite almost always enjoys most of the benefits while most of the rest of the population suffers. Does that sound familiar?

e·gal·i·tar·i·an - Asserting, resulting from, or characterized by belief in the equality of all people, especially in political, economic, or social life.


P.S. I had intended to keep the post short but there's so much to talk about!



posted on Nov, 14 2012 @ 07:13 AM
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I'm pretty sure these businesses have to be sold to someone first.

They aren't just going to disappear


And this happens every recession.

Here's the cycle so it doesn't cause panic to you next time.

1. Bankers Decide to Loan

2. Boom Created from step 1

3. Innovators Borrow

4. Money Made

5. Bankers Stop Loaning and demand money back

6. Crash Created from step 5

7. Business can't afford to repay and sells more shares at reduced rate to the same people that own the banks.

8. Government forced into INFLATION!! (Thanks to privately ran 'state' banks ponzi scheme) the money you just lent is now worth 10% of the gold (*or real value) of the shares you just.

9. People who own banks gain control of everything again.

10. Go to step 1

edit on 14-11-2012 by Beavers because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 14 2012 @ 09:09 AM
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reply to post by DOLCOTT
 


I agree with you, but....


Robin Hood is a fairy tale

Mr Hood, was taking the poor peoples money back from the people who stole it. It would be the same as a person taking back all my tax money and giving it to me. (one can dream)




Why would I as a person who worked untold hours and risked my personal wealth and that of my families livelihood not want to protect what I had built
OMG you're evil for not giving that wealth to inner-city gangs!!!!!

Again I'm with you, if you work hard for your money, it's your money. (then again if you win lotto, it's still your money)



posted on Nov, 14 2012 @ 09:33 AM
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Originally posted by LiveEquation
reply to post by davcwebb
 


It only shows how greedy the wealthy are, all they care about is their wealth. Their employees are just a means to that wealth


This is the problem. A lack of understanding of other people's perspectives is what is getting us into this mess.
edit on 14-11-2012 by darkbake because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 14 2012 @ 09:35 AM
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reply to post by davcwebb
 


Where are they dumping them?

Another country?

Maybe they should just follow their money and get the hell out.

America doesn't need more takers who refuse to support the country they made their wealth in.



posted on Nov, 14 2012 @ 09:37 AM
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reply to post by davcwebb
 


Omg let's shovel them tons of money, no strings attached just like the bank bailouts!

Disgusting. As usual, when time for the good of the country comes around, they engage in economic blackmail.

There should be regulations against this.


Btw, as a small business owner, Im not selling any assets, keeping my staff well paid and not cutting their hours. Sadly, two did ask me if things were going to change for the worse. I hope my reassurance calmed them down a bit.

My employees are the business' biggest asset. I have been in their shoes when everything started and still work with them shoulder to shoulder to lead by example. Without them, though, my business would never have grown to what it is today. I couldnt possibly manage the amount of work and divide myself to fill all roles nowadays.

A happy, well-paid, healthy worker is a PRODUCTIVE worker. Greedy, inhuman scumbags forget this.
edit on 14-11-2012 by Snoopy1978 because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 14 2012 @ 09:50 AM
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Originally posted by DOLCOTT
reply to post by LiveEquation
 


Are you mentally defective? Why would I as a person who worked untold hours and risked my personal wealth and that of my families livelihood not want to protect what I had built, yes all entrpenuers and wealthy with the exception of the trust fund babies understand that without the help which was PAID for, a company could not be successful. What is wrong with being wealthy, once you become wealthy you learn how to maintain and protect your wealth. Employer/Employee relationships are just that a relationship, it isn't slavery. You have the choice if your employer is unfair to quit, find a new job or possibly sue, it is a choice. Every succesful business has to weigh the costs and contributions of it's employee's vs the economic climate and conditions. Unfortunately this POTUS will cost american jobs, it is sad but true.

Robin Hood is a fairy tale, Obama's 2nd term a nightmare. Start your own business, take some risk, become wealthy and then let some knucklehead tell you that you should be giving it away, or taxed unfairly, let them take your families inheritance away to give to those who expect to be taken care of. It's all BS


Dolcott... You CANNOT fix stupid! Stop trying!

This president, and his minions of mouth-breathing dolts, cannot grasp the very basic fundamentals of how an economy functions. They erroneously believe that "Wealthy" people just woke up one day with a ton of cash that was unfairly bequeathed to them. Their childish emotional response is to scream "Unfair!" and look for ways to take that wealth away from them. Just look at Odumbass himself when he told people, "You didn't build that!" He admitted fully, in the public eye, that they believe that people building a model for success is taboo.

This "Uniter", as he once referred to himself, has done nothing for this country except to increase the divisiveness by waging on-going class warfare against the REAL employers in this country. Furthermore, to support the ILLUSION that he is achieving equality by spreading wealth (I call it vote buying), he has leveraged the entire future of this country by saddling it with unprecedented debt - most of which will be carried on the backs of the working class. Sadly, the mouth-breathing dolts cheer it!

I too own and operate my own business. I was hopeful to hire 3 to 5 new employees immediately after the first of the year in order to grow my business. I can assure you that won't happen - not in this negative business climate - not with this anti-business president at the helm. Nope. I'm hedging my bets. I'm taking almost all of the liquidity out of my business and passing it through as a profit share prior to the end of the year to avoid the punitive taxes. Want to know why? BECAUSE I DID BUILD THIS MYSELF and I am entitled to the fruits of MY labor!!!



posted on Nov, 14 2012 @ 10:26 AM
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reply to post by kozmo
 


I have to agree with the above. When are people going to realise that lower taxes for everyone is what grows an economy, not just taking from the 'rich' to give to the poor. Robin Hood may or may not have existed. The movie with a certain Russel Crow in it believes they found someone who it could have been and suprise suprise, not quite the rob the rich give to the poor good guy. He robbed the rich alright, to look after himself.

Captialism is by far the better ism of them all. Anyone who thinks differently just needs to read Animal Farm. All animals are equal, except some are more equal than others.

Look at all the failed communist/socialist governments of the last 100 years, the elite (read bankers, chairman etc) of thses states did very well, everyone else... you dont need me to point it out.

Look at China, communism is for everyone except the top echelons they swan around in luxury, that most of their 'subjects' couldn't even imagine.





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