Republicans Lied to by 'Conservative Entertainment Complex'

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posted on Nov, 12 2012 @ 10:52 AM
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David Frum, Newsweek columnist, former George W. Bush speech writer (he came up with "the axis of evil" line), and conservative pundit, said on the Morning Joe Show that Republican leaders cowards and that the right-wing base was lied to by the "Conservative entertainment Complex" (CEI) (read FOX news, Rush Limbaugh, Glen Beck and the usual suspects), adding that the GOP has been taken over by fear-mongers.


The problem with Republican leaders is that they're cowards," Frum said, adding that the party's base of donors "went apocalyptic" in the last four years.

"Republicans have been fleeced and exploited and lied to by a conservative entertainment complex," he said.

"Morning Joe" host Joe Scarborough pressed him to "name names," which Frum skirted around, but he said there were "too many."

Frum said he interviewed protesters at Tea Party rallies and found that a majority was convinced that taxes increased and that the federal government spent more than $1 trillion on welfare each year. Both claims are false.

"The followers, the donors and the activists are so mistaken about the nature of the problems the country faces," Frum said.


article on David Frum interview

Listening to the video in the above link, Frum also says that the problem with the Republican Party is its "followership": "the locus of the problem is the Republican activist base and the Republican donor base. They went apocalyptic over the past four years."

Couldn't agree more, Mr. Frum, and the base is continuing to do so, to wit: there are now three top ATS threads about the supposed secession movement going on in states all of a sudden, post election.

I would add that people have made money off this -- I'm talking about both this CEI and the political hacks such as Karl Rove, who get a percentage of whatever people put into their PACs. I would further imagine that the people running these PACs likely had sweet, backdoor deals with the advertising agencies making these adds and the networks running them.

Conservatives, here is a conservative telling you your political leaders are cowards and that the pundits and "news" sources you follow lied to you about not only the course of the election campaign, but over fundamental issues such as whether your taxes had gone up or down over the past four years. So I am curious: How does that make you feel, and will you change your "news" media viewing habits, i.e. look at a few other sources that you have hitherto considered to have a liberal bias?

I placed this thread here under 2012 elections because this is the analysis of the Republican party and the 2012 campaign by a prominent Republican. This is about what happened in this campaign, and how a segment of the electorate has been lied to by its own leaders and political pundits -- according to a Republican. This isn't some liberal Democrat saying this; rather it is a Republican calling out his own party's actions.




posted on Nov, 12 2012 @ 10:56 AM
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Im a conservative libertarian, go ahead and flame me, and the republican party went off the deep end this last week. They threw out all there "values" and are now pandering. Makes me sick. These bumbs need to be kicked out.

I also listen to Hannity on the radio sometimes and I heard he now said he’s ok with amnesty after the elections. If this is true I’m done with his show. You need to stand up to your values not pander and cater.

One guy I don’t hear much about in the media is Mark Lavin. I love that guy. He’s a true Conservative / libertarian and he has been going off on the republican party this last week. He is on the verge of leaving them. He was saying from the start that Romney is not the guy to beat Obama but if he wins the nomination for the republican party he would back him for the sake of voting the lesser of two evils.
edit on 12-11-2012 by camaro68ss because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 12 2012 @ 11:07 AM
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reply to post by camaro68ss
 


I hadn't caught that about amnesty. Well... That kills Hannity's show for me as well when I can confirm he said it. Bill 'O has always played the middle but Sean held to principle. Right or Wrong...they fact he ditches it overnight means it never was for him and that's enough for me to write him off. Sad thing..... I guess principle is old fashioned and silly to some folks?

Get the stuffy old party bosses out of the GOP...or take it from them..and there might be a decent party with the regular people who form the vast majority of it. I don't know any republicans who actually wanted Mittens. He was the only choice since the primary and caucuses were set up from the word go.


....and wow..that does say so much for how bad it's gotten.



posted on Nov, 12 2012 @ 11:12 AM
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Does this mean the left wing, Democrat entertainment complex lied to all it's followers when Bush won election in 2004?



posted on Nov, 12 2012 @ 11:14 AM
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reply to post by Wrabbit2000
 


I dont know if its true, its what i read so im going to have to look into it too.


+1 more 
posted on Nov, 12 2012 @ 11:52 AM
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Originally posted by PvtHudson
Does this mean the left wing, Democrat entertainment complex lied to all it's followers when Bush won election in 2004?


No, not in any way. No one was saying Kerry was going to win by a landslide or that the battery of opinion polls were wrong. Nor were there any rabid, deluded Democrats making their own "unskewed polls" and claiming they better reflected public opinion. Nor were Democrats lying about whether taxes went up or down under Bush. This last item David Frum spoke to specifically in regards to how Republicans have claimed that taxes have risen under Obama, when in fact they haven't.

Last time I heard, there was a meme in the news media at the time that Kerry was improving in the polls in the last week or two, but that it evidently wasn't quite enough to win. You do realize that the 2004 election came down to the state of Ohio, and there were documents cases of hinkyness in that election, and that the state head of the GOP was an executive or even president of Diebold, the voting machine company, and that he had promised in a speech to deliver Ohio to George W. Bush.

So good try with the prevarication and false equivalences, but thanks for playing anyway.

And like I tried to make very clear in the OP, THIS IS A REPUBLICAN SAYING THESE THINGS ABOUT THE REPUBLICAN PARTY. You seem to have no comment, but to make the false suggestion that the same thing happened in the 2004 election. If that did indeed happen, please point me to the litany of news stories and commentaries on it. I know of none. But for this election such stories and editorials are legion.



posted on Nov, 12 2012 @ 11:55 AM
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Originally posted by camaro68ss
Im a conservative libertarian, go ahead and flame me, and the republican party went off the deep end this last week. They threw out all there "values" and are now pandering. Makes me sick. These bumbs need to be kicked out.

I also listen to Hannity on the radio sometimes and I heard he now said he’s ok with amnesty after the elections. If this is true I’m done with his show. You need to stand up to your values not pander and cater.

One guy I don’t hear much about in the media is Mark Lavin. I love that guy. He’s a true Conservative / libertarian and he has been going off on the republican party this last week. He is on the verge of leaving them. He was saying from the start that Romney is not the guy to beat Obama but if he wins the nomination for the republican party he would back him for the sake of voting the lesser of two evils.
edit on 12-11-2012 by camaro68ss because: (no reason given)


Glad to hear from you. You're one of the people I wanted to hear/read a honest comment from, and you provided one. That's interesting what you say about Hannity. I hadn't heard that. Never heard of Mark Lavin either; I'll check him out to see what he is about.



posted on Nov, 12 2012 @ 12:04 PM
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Originally posted by Wrabbit2000
reply to post by camaro68ss
 


I hadn't caught that about amnesty. Well... That kills Hannity's show for me as well when I can confirm he said it. Bill 'O has always played the middle but Sean held to principle. Right or Wrong...they fact he ditches it overnight means it never was for him and that's enough for me to write him off. Sad thing..... I guess principle is old fashioned and silly to some folks?

Get the stuffy old party bosses out of the GOP...or take it from them..and there might be a decent party with the regular people who form the vast majority of it. I don't know any republicans who actually wanted Mittens. He was the only choice since the primary and caucuses were set up from the word go.


....and wow..that does say so much for how bad it's gotten.


Glad to see a Republican finally admit that he and no Republicans he knows actually wanted Romney as the presidential candidate.

Don't know if you were a Ron Paul fan or not, but from what I heard he was robbed by the party establishment in any number of primaries and caucuses. It would be nice if Republicans discussed this issue more, since you seem to be for getting rid of the old party bosses of the GOP, and I imagine many of your fellow Republicans feel the same way. And I'll tell you: given Ron Paul's stands on some very important issues, I would have seriously considered voting for him over Obama -- something I couldn't say for any of the other GOP primary "contenders".



posted on Nov, 12 2012 @ 04:45 PM
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Originally posted by MrInquisitive




"Republicans have been fleeced and exploited and lied to by a conservative entertainment complex," he said.



OK..Yes. But is the Conservative Media just giving it's viewers what they want? Or are they part of a larger effort of propaganda at the behest of conservative power brokers? Or a little of both? "Echo Chamber"

Also..lets not forget that there is in fact a left wing fringe, complet with far left wing media...but to claim a false equivelance would be dishonest. The left's fringe is it's fringe...while the right wings fringe is it's new base (center)...thus casting the relative mainstream (middle) media as far left...and moderate left politicians as outright comminists.

So there is a profit motive by the media. A fanatic base...a divided electorate equals distinct demographics that can be advertised to.

And thier is a feedback loop...the more the right wing media riles up the far right...the more conservative power brokers give them pats on the back...inside stories, exclusive interviews etc.

Not sure who deserves blame for the reality disconnect, but I would say as a "people" and consumers of our media it is the "people's" responsibility to call BS...Fox wouldn't lie if it didn't bring in viewers and resultant advertiser cash.



posted on Nov, 12 2012 @ 04:47 PM
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Originally posted by Wrabbit2000
reply to post by camaro68ss
 


I hadn't caught that about amnesty. Well... That kills Hannity's show for me as well when I can confirm he said it. Bill 'O has always played the middle but Sean held to principle. Right or Wrong...they fact he ditches it overnight means it never was for him and that's enough for me to write him off. Sad thing..... I guess principle is old fashioned and silly to some folks?




“It’s simple to me to fix it,” Hannity said. “I think you control the border first. You create a pathway for those people that are here — you don’t say you’ve got to go home. And that is a position that I’ve evolved on.

“Because, you know what, it’s got to be resolved. The majority of people here, if some people have criminal records you can send them home; but if people are here, law-abiding, participating for years, their kids are born here, you know, first secure the border, pathway to citizenship, done.”

articles.latimes.com...

By simple fix he was referring to why he thought the GOP lost...the Latino vote.



posted on Nov, 12 2012 @ 05:17 PM
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Originally posted by Wrabbit2000
I guess principle is old fashioned and silly to some folks?


"Principles only mean something when you stick to them when its inconvenient. "


Originally posted by Wrabbit2000
Get the stuffy old party bosses out of the GOP...or take it from them..and there might be a decent party with the regular people who form the vast majority of it. I don't know any republicans who actually wanted Mittens. He was the only choice since the primary and caucuses were set up from the word go.


Those stuffy old party bosses are the men who know what it is to govern. They did not rise to power by inciting intolerance, by deriding minorities, by championing gridlock....and they have been hunted, most successfully, ar RINOs for the past 5 years.

In nearly every seat where GOP moderates were ousted in the nomination for TP candidates...the TP lost.

Scott Brown, Akin, Murdock, Allen West, Joe Walsh..of the 16 TPers that were running this time only 4 survived.

The TP capitalized on an economy in crisis and the aftermath of the Bush years...that time has passed.

The GOPs problem is NOT that they are not enough "Tea Party"...thier problem is the precise opposite.



posted on Nov, 12 2012 @ 05:31 PM
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reply to post by MrInquisitive
 


I am not mistaken as to why I am against Obama. Him being from the Chicago machine was all I needed to know four years ago. Since then the actions of his administration from allowing his followers to break the law, to his administration itself breaking the law, the out in the open bribing of Senators and Congressmen, have cemented why I am still against him.

However your OP brings up something of more importance. Why would the Republican media lie to it's base? You suggested for money. That answer is not good enough for they would have to know that if they lied before the election it would show up after and cost them money in the future. So why lie?

Perhaps the answer is in the Democratic supporters. Normally the Conservative base are not violent. It takes a lot to really make a conservative get violent. They would prefer to leave then fight if that is possible. I can not say the same for the Liberal base. Prior to the vote I saw more hatred, and I do not use that word loosely, and threats then I had ever seen before. Since the vote, even on here, the threats have become more open. They show on ALL the news channels. OLD WHITE MEN. They are the reason for ALL of this nations problems or so the propaganda goes. I am happy to see that after I pointed this out in the multiple threads going on about this it has basically stopped on here. Yet it still goes on on the news channels.

Perhaps the reason for states wanting to leave is their citizens do not wish to participate in what appears to be stirring up in this country. They wish to leave what they see occurring before being caught up in it. With the hatred being expressed by the so called minorities against old white men maybe they wish to leave BEFORE the real violence begins. It has already been going on by so called flash mobs. lol.

My suggestion is that both bases are being conned in an attempt to actually have occur what has been predicted on this site many times in the past. A RACE war. I myself am attempting to get into a position to live in an RV so I can move from whatever area I am in should it start there. If these states DO manage to leave it is quite possible I may move there. Not because I do not love this country but because I am an old white man who is tired of those who have accomplished nothing blaming me for their lack of accomplishment. I fought for equal rights for all, not equal rights for all except me.



posted on Nov, 12 2012 @ 07:18 PM
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reply to post by MrInquisitive
 

With your reply I have hope for us all. I mean that, although perhaps not with your reply taken alone, but it does give hope for finding common ground.

As a matter of fact, I was a die hard Ron Paul supporter right to the time he became mathematically impossible. By then, Romney was the man TPTB obviously had chosen as "their boy" and so...two choices to make. (sigh). I wasn't about to say any of this while I was reluctantly supporting the guy (or remind anyone..as it were) but I'd posted quite heavily AGAINST Romney both here and elsewhere during the early primary season. The only soft spot I did have for the man, prior to him becoming only 1 of two viable choices left, was his being Mormon. I have a couple in the family and so, look upon that a bit different than others. Funny thing was.... The directory of material I still have for anti-Romney material was weighted very heavy toward how left he actually was to get the leadership of one of the bluest states in America and do so while in the good graces and all but outright carrying the endorsement of Ted Kennedy.
Amazing how things turn eh?

I got a look at the party bosses for the GOP and I saw all I needed to know I don't like a bit of it. These are the guys who have "earned" their right to rule the roost and call the candidates like their own rigged horse race. I'm absolutely with anyone looking to make a Sea Change in the GOP. They buried Paul and they didn't even HAVE to. The man wasn't going to win because his supporters were too apathetic to show up at Caucus and vote where it mattered. That didn't bother the GOP bosses though. Hell no.... They weren't going to let him get even ONE COUNTY if they could help it. Anything to bury him totally. I'll never EVER forgive them for it either.

They couldn't even let the man speak in Tampa. That was as cold as it gets. At least Paul was classy enough to play that off like they played it to the public and not make a fight of it. That's why I love Paul so much. He's been consistent his whole career....He DOES have honor and one of the only that did, IMO. For that? They destroyed him.



posted on Nov, 12 2012 @ 08:13 PM
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meh....all media is full of crap. Every single thing is spun to generate a per-determined emotional reaction in the viewers. It's all propaganda...regardless which "wing" is supposedly spewing it.

Be sure of this. All media is owned by something like 5 mega corporations. They push some crap down the Liberal pipe and other crap down the conservative pipe...but it's all crap. All of it is propaganda to get you to either spend you money like an idiot on junk you do not need or cower in your house in fear of mean, brown people.

My choices in the election had nothing to do with media coverage and opinion/editorials and much more to do with what I personally think is required to get back on the path of growth and prosperity...and that is personal freedom and liberty...period. I can promise you that Rachel Maddow and Sean Hannity had absolutely nothing to do with my decisions.



posted on Nov, 12 2012 @ 10:58 PM
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reply to post by MrInquisitive
 


It's actually Mark Levin and he's way too conservative for you but I'd love to hear your response. I also happen to like him and love his aggressive non-backing down and calling things as he sees it.

www.marklevinshow.com...

11/12 archived show rope.zmle.fimc.net... omedia%2Ecom%2F800185%2Fpodfuse%2Dorigin%2Eandomedia%2Ecom%2Fcitadel%5Forigin%2Fpods%2Fmarklevin%2FLevin11122012%2Emp3


Give it a go. Maybe he will convert you to reality
edit on 12-11-2012 by ThirdEyeofHorus because: (no reason given)
edit on 12-11-2012 by ThirdEyeofHorus because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 12 2012 @ 11:07 PM
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reply to post by Wrabbit2000
 


Romney wasn't "their boy" apparently or he would have won. He may have been the moderate backup though.



posted on Nov, 12 2012 @ 11:30 PM
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reply to post by Jerk_Idiot
 


I have to say, I've observed that immediately since BO won the reelection, suddenly half the Fox News people changed their little tune and suddenly Republicans have to change, make concessions, figure out how to be more like the Democrats. Boehner, Bill Krystol (a real neo-con)...oh and Levin had words for him in tonight's show. He's ripping repubs to shreds.



posted on Nov, 12 2012 @ 11:37 PM
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Sean Hannity just posted on his Fox show that the Obama admin in just the past 90 days has posted 900 new govt regulationswhich will affect every aspect of our lives.

Big Govt.

Hope all you Obama supporters love your captivity.
edit on 12-11-2012 by ThirdEyeofHorus because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 13 2012 @ 01:20 AM
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reply to post by Jerk_Idiot
 


You state that normally the conservative base is not violent. I don't know about this given Republican and Tea Party rhetoric about 2nd-amendment remedies to the government, not to mention the record numbers of threats against the President's life, as well as the attack against congresswoman Giffords and others in Arizona. To claim that the Democrats/liberals are the violent ones would seem to be exactly the opposite of what is the case. If we were talking about the late 60's and early 70's, I would acknowledge that that left had turned more violent, with demonstrations, riots and later some militant/quasi-terrorist groups; that is not the case these days. In the early 60's it was certainly a case of violence on the right, with the killing of many civil rights leaders as well as president Kennedy and his brother Bobby.

I don't by your hypothesis that the right wanted to avoid violence by telling their people that the Republicans were doing well in the election campaign, or lying about facts, such as that taxes have gone up under Obama. How does lying about Obama's record, making him appear worse than he is, help to calm the conservative base? Right-wing pundits have used very extreme and hateful rhetoric regarding the Democrats and its supporter. How does that clam down conservatives and keep them from getting violent?

Now we have all these deluded conservatives signing secession petitions, because they want to break away from the US. Not that I believe these secession attempts will go anywhere, but what did secession bring last time around? The Civil War. Talk about violence. And yes, it was the secessionists who fired the first shots of the war -- at Fort Sumter.

It seems like your theory is entirely premised on the idea of blaming the political left for somehow forcing the political right to lie and/or ignore reality. This is just more typical blame the other side for your own actions rhetoric.



posted on Nov, 13 2012 @ 01:29 AM
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Originally posted by ThirdEyeofHorus
reply to post by Jerk_Idiot
 


I have to say, I've observed that immediately since BO won the reelection, suddenly half the Fox News people changed their little tune and suddenly Republicans have to change, make concessions, figure out how to be more like the Democrats. Boehner, Bill Krystol (a real neo-con)...oh and Levin had words for him in tonight's show. He's ripping repubs to shreds.


Yes, it is amazing how so many Fox and other pundits have changed their tunes all of a sudden. I guess a new memo has been sent around. Which just shows you how controlled all these media puppets are -- and I don't mean just on the right; the same thing is the case of MSNBC and Salon (online magazine with some of the same DNC tools as MSNBC).

I didn't figure I'd necessarily dig what Mark Levin has to say, but I do want to hear what he is about and how his views differ from the conservative/GOP establishment.

Just want to also say that I am enjoying the dialogue we are having on this topic, and that most of us here are "keeping it real." I hope more folks look at it, and get in on the discussion.
edit on 13-11-2012 by MrInquisitive because: (no reason given)





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