State's Secession is a Viral Meme. You can't leave!

Originally posted by jiggerj
reply to post by Druid42

 

Wouldn't such a split weaken the nation (and whatever new nation arises) to the point where we would be ripe for attack from those that hate us?

Yes. Unfortunately, logic doesn't really figure into this equation. It's more about being crybabies that the black guy won again.

Why is it that all of a sudden THIS time the "love it or leave it argument" seems to just take for granted that the land ought to just come right along with them when they leave? I mean...if they got it so bad why don't "they" just go back Europe where they came from?

Then they can REALLY whine about "European-style Socialism", huh?

Or, alternatively, everyone could just grow up and get rid of the alarmist and extremist rhetoric and dogma that put Obama back in the white house for round 2 instead going double-down on the childish antics and immature behavior that put you where you are in the first place.

reply to post by hanyak69


Its amazing that out of the original 13 states that fought to throw off tyranny 10 are now trying to re-establish one.

Originally posted by manykapao
reply to post by ajay59

 

well no one here was alive was then!

that is why we have a plethora of history books, standard edition for schooling, and others by researchers and authors who deemed it fit to write the real accounts of history. The Spanish conquered the American empires of the south and geared our perception of their exploits by forcing the 2 or 3 texts they wrote about it as the only official story. Thankfully there were literate people who wrote and documented the past more honestly and now if you really want to you can read about any subject in its truth, if you look. I happen to LOVE history.

As far as being a debt salve, I am not a willing participant.

Come up with a solution and convince people of it. Hell I am all ears. Telling us to simply split our country apart is not exactly a better situation since no one is mentioning how to ensure the same things don't happen again with smaller mini states.

I mean, what is the plan?

Break up the union, and then what? Is that plan not applicable to the whole union? At what point does your plan call for dissolving what unity we do have?

edit on 12-11-2012 by manykapao because: (no reason given)

It is up to the people to ensure that this stuff does not happen again. However, it will happen again and hopefully future generations can look back and say " OUR FORE FATHERS HAD THE INTESTINAL FORTITUDE TO RESOLVE THIS, SO CAN WE!"
It all starts with a Declaration, then determination, HONOR, and RESOLVE! Do we still have these qualities? I fear the number is far too small!
It has to start somewhere though!

reply to post by hanyak69


I still don't see what is starting.

What is the plan? Break up the union so we can do what exactly? A revolution, ok. Then what. A new constitution?A new set of laws?

Why not draw them up now in peace, and try to enact them through the democratic process?

Would they not work on the whole US for some reason?

How would they work better on a broken former country?

I mean, what do you want to do exactly? you want to reform things no? Then why not focus on the things you want to change, how to do so and see if others can agree on them. Then we can take it from there.

Saying you want us to change, but having no idea in what form is almost worse, since it might lead to pointless war and instability afterwards.

What do you want to change and what is your proposed solution?

reply to post by Druid42


The world needs an example of what true freedom looks like. Being there to lend a helpful peaceful hand if needed. Stop war by not engaging in it. The Irony is that the terrorist are only growing due to America's intrusive acts in their countries.

Originally posted by manykapao
reply to post by hanyak69

 

I still don't see what is starting.

What is the plan? Break up the union so we can do what exactly? A revolution, ok. Then what. A new constitution?A new set of laws?

Why not draw them up now in peace, and try to enact them through the democratic process?

Would they not work on the whole US for some reason?

How would they work better on a broken former country?

I mean, what do you want to do exactly? you want to reform things no? Then why not focus on the things you want to change, how to do so and see if others can agree on them. Then we can take it from there.

Saying you want us to change, but having no idea in what form is almost worse, since it might lead to pointless war and instability afterwards.

What do you want to change and what is your proposed solution?

edit on 12-11-2012 by manykapao because: (no reason given)

A plan? Who needs a plan or a solution when you have overly dramatized, media-induced, incoherent outrage on your side??

reply to post by Druid42


You're right in that these ludicrous petitions are doing nothing (other than dropping one's name in the official "People Who Hate the U.S.A." list) - I'm shocked that these people are foolish enough to think they can legally, peaceably leave the Union, and also shocked that they're foolish enough to want to, considering most of the states where people seem to want to secede are the welfare states, dependent on the federal government keeping them afloat.

That said, maybe it's been posted, I've only read the OP so far in this thread, but that thing about subversives is a 50+ year old law just sitting on the books unenforced, from the McCarthy Era.

Originally posted by dogstar23
reply to post by Druid42

 

You're right in that these ludicrous petitions are doing nothing (other than dropping one's name in the official "People Who Hate the U.S.A." list) - I'm shocked that these people are foolish enough to think they can legally, peaceably leave the Union,

Especially in states where roughly 50 percent of their fellow citizens are actually quite happy with the results of the election.

That's what's so stupid. It's not like there was a big block of states in which 98%+ voted for Romney or something.

People are dumb.

Originally posted by manykapao
reply to post by hanyak69

 

I still don't see what is starting.

What is the plan? Break up the union so we can do what exactly? A revolution, ok. Then what. A new constitution?A new set of laws?

Why not draw them up now in peace, and try to enact them through the democratic process?

Would they not work on the whole US for some reason?

How would they work better on a broken former country?

I mean, what do you want to do exactly? you want to reform things no? Then why not focus on the things you want to change, how to do so and see if others can agree on them. Then we can take it from there.

Saying you want us to change, but having no idea in what form is almost worse, since it might lead to pointless war and instability afterwards.

What do you want to change and what is your proposed solution?

edit on 12-11-2012 by manykapao because: (no reason given)

Don't misunderstand I am not condoning a revolution I am merely stating that succession is legal due to precedence.

Means nothing. It was a bigger outcry when Wallace lost. This is just nitwits being nitwits.

That's OK.

Political persecution is a natural effect of freedom of speech.

I would love to see about 49 million Americans sign these petitions as I did. And I would love to see the Obama administration put 49 million Americans on the no fly list, or scheduled for an IRS audit.

This would be the fastest way to gaurantee he would be gone quickly because the public outcry would be like a tidal wave over him and his corrupt administration.

Just goes to show how uneducated those who support it are

Texas needs 193 more signatures as of 3:20 EST!!!!

reply to post by Druid42


Its been done before. We called it the civil war. Remember ? North V South.

reply to post by Druid42


Federal Emergency Management Agency does not imprison people. They are for the management of municipalities during and after a natural disaster or federal emergency. We have federal prisons you know. That is were the disadents will go. FEMA has enough to deal with on its own.

reply to post by karen61560


If Obama declares martial law, then the DHS takes over, and FEMA is in control of everything. All that it takes is a national emergency.

Of course, that never been done before, but the structure is in place. Search ATS for Executive Orders. It's all set into place.

Let's not give him a reason to do that.

I'm not quoting anyone, because it has been brought up a couple of times at this point, but I think if any State or group of States were to secede, that (or those) State(s) would not have much to fear from foreign nations who 'hate us.' The 'us' that those nations hate is the federal government, not the people of the States. They may not like us a whole lot because of our overly decadent lifestyles, or lack of real education, but I think a lot of the countries that 'hate us' would be thrilled to see infighting in the US. Even if it didn't mean the end of the US government, it would be a step in the right direction, from their point(s) of view.

That having been said, I think it is incredibly courageous of people to be inputting their personal information on a government website, actively announcing their dissent. I'm sure there were plenty of people who thought the signers of the Declaration of Independence were insane for signing their actual names and then sending said declaration to the king himself. We tend to think rather highly of them now though.

Texas has 35,533 signatures
So now it will come to Obama's attention and should go to the people and legislature of that state.
Most of the signers that I saw were from outside the state.

We the People

I really think this would be a better course of action:
Anyone can start a Petition

Originally posted by Druid42
reply to post by karen61560

 

If Obama declares martial law, then the DHS takes over, and FEMA is in control of everything. All that it takes is a national emergency.

Of course, that never been done before, but the structure is in place. Search ATS for Executive Orders. It's all set into place.

Let's not give him a reason to do that.

The way I see it, this would be the quickest route to freedom. If the administration was forced to show all its cards, where would they go from there? Considering the administration has just declared its support for the UN arms ban, sooner is better than later for FEMA to start getting crazy with everyone.

reply to post by prostheticmind

the signers of the Declaration of Independence were insane for signing their actual names

That was way before the Patriot Act, electronic eavesdropping, and the DHS. The people signing their names in this day and age are way beyond that. Either that, or they are just fed up with the system.