Over 200,000 Votes Not Counted in Florida Alone...

Originally posted by YourWIFI
POST REMOVED BY STAFF

Really? Your habit of capitalizing random words is particularly annoying and does nothing to get your point across. It just makes you seem like that loud guy from the Dilbert comic strip.

If you've never in your life seen such whining and blaming then you must be around 11 or 12 years old. Otherwise you would recall the whining when Bush defeated Gore and recounts were called by Gore.

Bush v. Gore

reply to post by ElectricUniverse


Actually it does not matter because Romney conceded the state to Obama. At that point there was no longer a need to continue the counts to determine who actually won it. Even an outcome giving the state to Romney would not have affected the result of the election.

The end of the counting occurred because of Romney.

As far as the comment about people who voted for Obama getting what they deserve I could not agree more. There are 2 great ironies in life...

Not getting what you want....

And getting exactly what you asked for.

Originally posted by ElectricUniverse
I know the Obamatrons are going to be claiming it was a fair election...

Similar to 2000 when Bush actually did not win the election.

"Welcome to the heist" - Mackelmore

Originally posted by zroth

Originally posted by ElectricUniverse
I know the Obamatrons are going to be claiming it was a fair election...

Similar to 2000 when Bush actually did not win the election.

"Welcome to the heist" - Mackelmore

Actually he did... Please show me where the popular vote is the requirement in the Constitution.. When you dont find it please brush up on the electoral college.

John Quincy Adams - Whig
Rutherford B. Hayes - Republican
Benjamin Harrison - Republican
George W. Bush - Republican


All won the electoral but lost the popular vote.

Do you seriously believe we even have a choice???

Originally posted by hurdygurdy
Do you seriously believe we even have a choice???

Absolutely however if people spent a few minutes understanding our election system and how it was designed you would see the electoral college was put in place by the founders to ensure the ability to change the outcome of the vote if the American people "made a mistake".

Prior to the 20th century the electoral c ollege was free to vote for whomever they wished, regradless of how the state populations voted. Since then many states have laws that require their electoral college voters to vote for the indidividual the majority population voted for.

Since then we have a few states who use a proportional electoral college system, splitting their electoral amounts between the candidates based on the percentage of population they carried in that state.

In essence those states have managed to make a change that is within the framework set forth, but moved the end result to a popular majority.

reply to post by 0zzymand0s

I live in AZ, and I have sent a snail-mail letter, email and left a VM for the AG demanding they properly count all votes.

It's cool that you are energized to insist that all votes will be counted.

Your concern is, however, misplaced. There was NEVER ANY QUESTION that these votes would be counted. None. They have until the 16th to complete the count, and the final results will be certified on December 3.

There are still enough votes outstanding that Obama might win Arizona (or at least there were last time I check). And while is it possible, it is, given the statistics of the polling day results, very unlikely.

On the other hand, there are definitely enough outstanding uncounted votes to change the election night position of two House seats. Sinema looks to be widening her lead, but Barber has, at least for now, overhauled McSally.

Joe still looks wobbly too.

reply to post by Xcathdra

Since then we have a few states who use a proportional electoral college system, splitting their electoral amounts between the candidates based on the percentage of population they carried in that state.

I don't think that is true. Do you have evidence?

The proposal does come up occasionally. Republicans in Ohio raised it just the other day. But I am quite sure that no one has implemented it yet.

reply to post by Xcathdra

Actually it does not matter because Romney conceded the state to Obama. At that point there was no longer a need to continue the counts to determine who actually won it. Even an outcome giving the state to Romney would not have affected the result of the election.

That is completely wrong. 100% wrong. Impossibly wrong.

Concession has nothing to do with the requirement to count all the votes. The election isn't over until ALL the votes are counted and the tally certified. Period.

Many candidates have conceded only to be declared the winner at the completion of the count.

Originally posted by Xcathdra

Originally posted by zroth

Originally posted by ElectricUniverse
I know the Obamatrons are going to be claiming it was a fair election...

Similar to 2000 when Bush actually did not win the election.

"Welcome to the heist" - Mackelmore

Actually he did... Please show me where the popular vote is the requirement in the Constitution.. When you dont find it please brush up on the electoral college.

John Quincy Adams - Whig
Rutherford B. Hayes - Republican
Benjamin Harrison - Republican
George W. Bush - Republican


All won the electoral but lost the popular vote.

edit on 10-11-2012 by Xcathdra because: (no reason given)

Uh, ok.

There are thousands of threads all over this forum and many like it detailing the NASA interns program that flipped voting machines in multiple states.

There are even recent threads from last week talking about the same thing.

But you are right. HIStory shows that Bush won.

Originally posted by rnaa
I don't think that is true. Do you have evidence?

The proposal does come up occasionally. Republicans in Ohio raised it just the other day. But I am quite sure that no one has implemented it yet.

It isn't several, it is actually only two that proportionally split their electoral votes: Nebraska and Maine.

Each of those states though are bound by a pledge or legal requirement. Such requirements are always in favor of party politics though.

Nebraska state law states "Each at-large presidential elector shall cast his or her ballot for the presidential and vice-presidential candidates who received the highest number of votes in the state." and "Each congressional district presidential elector shall cast his or her ballot for the presidential and vice-presidential candidates who received the highest number of votes in his or her congressional district."

The later portion of their state law is what allows a proportional electoral vote to occur and I tend to agree with that approach better than the "at-large" section of the law in which is just a straight popular vote. In this though, congressional districts have a better chance of representation. If the state overall votes for Candidate A but the smaller, less populated districts overwhelming vote for Candidate B, it splits the vote.

Maine's setup is similar but for some reason I am timing-out getting to their website.

Originally posted by Xcathdra
In essence those states have managed to make a change that is within the framework set forth, but moved the end result to a popular majority.

It is a double-edged sword effect. Since voting laws are in large a State issue, it is up to the electorate of the States to keep a check on the consolidation of power within the selection of electors. Many States' laws are tailored to the party system and are very exclusive in the selection.

I have stated before that I believe each State, if their People so desire, should reexamine their requirements and process in how electors are selected to provide the maximum participation under the law.

I am a firm believer in diluted democracy (greatest amounts of democracy at the lowest levels of government) as to be able to affect the most change. Such was the design though and we cannot quite say it has worked well when the public becomes ill-informed or uninterested in politics.

Both teams are corrupt and crooked.

I could not in my right state of mind support any one of those crooks.

Obama should be in jail for breaking federal law by illegal gun running across international borders...not to mention all other crimes committed by his administration that was basically defended by him saying he has executive order power over all.

And Romney should be in Jail for cheating his way to become the GOP nominee; all the while robbing someone else of their right to fair elections.
and a $250 fine for his plastic haircut.


Either way- Im glad that both parties are being thrown to the wolves.

They deserve nothing less. Obama won.....now lets find a way to get him back out. shouldnt be that hard with all the crap his administration pulls. Damn his executive priveledge.

All ballots have been counted in Florida.

President Obama won Florida.

Representative West lost his seat, but he's still fighting to suppress some of those votes.

Repeat for effect: All ballots that were cast have been counted and have affected the final result. President Obama now has more Electoral College votes than he had on election night.

No one can ever know how many votes were not cast due to Florida voter suppression tactics, but however many it was the tactic didn't work.

reply to post by rnaa


My concern is that people focus to much on the presidential in years like this. I want to see all votes counted for precisely the reasons you outlined. While I would get tremendous amusement from watching Arizona turn blue, I have a feeling that I'll get their faster if I hold my own breath until I pass out. It's all the little races that count the most anyway.

That state took four days to count all of its votes. According to this news of so many uncounted votes (assuming it's true), it looks like they just gave up on whatever was taking them so long... and left it vastly unfinished.
What is with Florida, anyway? While I was watching the map progress while the election was being decided, that state was one of the few left unprocessed after everything was over, along with Alaska and Hawaii.

Originally posted by ElectricUniverse
reply to post by shockedonlooker

 

I still have contacts with some friends I have made who are in the military, some of them still serving in Afghanistan, and we get in contact from time to time.

The mayority of them would not have voted for Obama, and I wonder how many votes from our military personnel are missing...

BTW, to the member who asked if Florida has the 90+ votes romney needs... AGAIN, this is happening in SEVERAL states...

According to my girlfriend, who was listening to the news in Spanish, Obama announced that the economy was going for the worse... He comes to say it now, AFTER the election, so Obama's fans would vote for him again thinking he did a miracle with the economy...

If only Obama's fans knew ANYTHING about economics...

edit on 10-11-2012 by ElectricUniverse because: (no reason given)

Pssst. The election is over. It was last week. Time to move on and do something more positive and rewarding with your time. You seem to love politics maybe you can make an impact at the local or state level. Unless you are employed as a political analyst second guessing the election is a waste of time.

reply to post by EllaMarina

According to this news of so many uncounted votes (assuming it's true), it looks like they just gave up on whatever was taking them so long... and left it vastly unfinished.

What state is 'giving up'?

Arizona? They are still counting and will count every single one. They have until 16 November to finish according to Arizona law.

Florida? They have counted every vote and are now finished, except for any recounts that may be required.

I really don't understand what you folks are complaining about. These provisional votes require manual handling to validate and count. This is a slow process. Arizona needs to clean up its act to reduce the number of provisional votes in the future, but that will not stop them from counting every single vote in this election.

No state can just 'give up' counting ballots. It is the most fundamental rule in our democratic system. EVERY vote is counted BECAUSE EVERY vote counts. Any State SOS or County Election board that 'gives up' because its too hard is incompetent and should be thrown out of office for malfeasance. And every one of them knows that.

I have worked in the counting room at elections in Pima County Arizona (a few years ago now). Believe me, every person involved is very serious about getting it right.

The saying about "doing it right is more important than doing it fast" is exactly descriptive of the atmosphere in the counting room. I remember several times stopping the count to wait for a scrutineer from one of the parties or the other to watch while some issue is resolved with a punch card deck (you know, hanging chads and all that? - we knew how to fix those cleanly in Pima County, I don't know what Florida's problem was). The media might complain, but that was their problem not ours.

reply to post by FreebirdGirl

Pssst. The election is over. It was last week.

I appreciate the thrust of your post.

However, to be exact, the election isn't over until all the votes are counted and the results are legally certified.

In Arizona, the counties have until November 16 to finish the count and the certification conference is scheduled to take place on December 3. This is according to Arizona State law. Other states will probably have slightly different deadlines according to their own laws.