It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.
Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.
Thank you.
Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.
Originally posted by arpgme
reply to post by ImaFungi
Originally posted by ImaFungi
the punishment is not being his friend,.,.,., not coming over to his house,.,.,. if you can exist without his love and ideals,.,., then go for it,,,, is what he is saying,,,, if you would like to be thankful for what he has created including your existence,, then you will have no problem acknowledging his goodness,,
you are perceiving his disowning of you as a punishment,,, but if you do not want him to own you,, then it is what you asked for
But that "not being his friend" comes with the consequence of SUFFERING in hell, right? Why does the suffering have to be included if it isn't a punishment but just a choose? Why can't you choose hell without suffering? No free will. Just redefining terms to make the god sound "Loving".
Originally posted by r2d246
reply to post by arpgme
You pose the title like that. And I've heard that a gazillion times. Or the other way of saying it is you choose hell because you choose not to have your sins removed which you need to have in order to enter heaven.
Here's on analogy. There's fine resturant you've been invited too. The invite says you have to come wearing formal clothing to enter. If you don't then you won't be allowed in. But maybe were you're from it's more relaxed rules so you think you'll chance it. Then at the door you're not allowed in. Who's fault is it? Yours obviously. You knew full well in advanced they required formal attire to get in, but you choose to ignore it.
Originally posted by r2d246
reply to post by arpgme
Or maybe one more.... A ship your on is sinking and you're in shark infested waters. You've been told that the captain has personally saved a seat in the lifeboat for you...
Originally posted by ImaFungi
Originally posted by arpgme
reply to post by ImaFungi
Originally posted by ImaFungi
the punishment is not being his friend,.,.,., not coming over to his house,.,.,. if you can exist without his love and ideals,.,., then go for it,,,, is what he is saying,,,, if you would like to be thankful for what he has created including your existence,, then you will have no problem acknowledging his goodness,,
you are perceiving his disowning of you as a punishment,,, but if you do not want him to own you,, then it is what you asked for
But that "not being his friend" comes with the consequence of SUFFERING in hell, right? Why does the suffering have to be included if it isn't a punishment but just a choose? Why can't you choose hell without suffering? No free will. Just redefining terms to make the god sound "Loving".
because god created the universe and in turn you,.,..,,.
without god,,, you are nothing,,, only chaos exists without god,,, the lack of the order god created exists without god,,, where will you go without god or reside?
you want him to build a palace for you to dwell in enternity? or you want him to give every entity their own universe with the ability to create whatever they want?
that could potentially turn into "hell"...
Those of us that accept his control will go on to everlasting life.
Originally posted by subjectzero
reply to post by ImaFungi
The Church is sitting on original manuscripts. It needs to release these to a group of select scholars for proper translation and publication.
Originally posted by mc4denmark
Originally posted by adjensen
God doesn't throw you anywhere.
Hell was created for the demons, and is the only place in the non-material world where God is not present.
So, after a lifetime of not needing God, not loving God, not wanting to be in God's presence, you are granted exactly what you've insisted upon -- existence without God.
Where's the injustice in that?edit on 8-11-2012 by adjensen because: (no reason given)
Well that depends, if god created that realm with pain and suffering then its not quite fair, or the other hand, if god have no place in that realm people probably live in harmony with each other, since no one is arguing how others should live there life, in that case, beam me down scotty
Originally posted by Foxy1
Originally posted by mc4denmark
Originally posted by adjensen
God doesn't throw you anywhere.
Hell was created for the demons, and is the only place in the non-material world where God is not present.
So, after a lifetime of not needing God, not loving God, not wanting to be in God's presence, you are granted exactly what you've insisted upon -- existence without God.
Where's the injustice in that?edit on 8-11-2012 by adjensen because: (no reason given)
Well that depends, if god created that realm with pain and suffering then its not quite fair, or the other hand, if god have no place in that realm people probably live in harmony with each other, since no one is arguing how others should live there life, in that case, beam me down scotty
Do you think people in heaven are arguing how to live their lives amongst one another?
once you die you are apart of infinite wisdom and all knowing.
Matthew 18:18
"I tell you the truth, whatever you bind on earth will be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth will be loosed in heaven."