Originally posted by Freeborn
reply to post by detachedindividual
Which was kind of my point about unsubstantiated claims being made against innocent people tarnishing people's reputations etc - innocent until
The author seems to rely on rumour and innuendo and makes some massive assumptions based on them.
But, and it's a massive but, one suspect's there is more than just an element of truth contained in the article - some of the rumours have been
around for quite some time and have never been completely disproven.
And do we the public have a right to know when serious questions are being asked about our elected officials, their aides and advisors and other's in
senior positions of authority etc?
And be honest, do you trust the police and / or the judiciary to investigate these allegations and to report openly and honestly bearing in mind
persistent rumours of their active involvement in both the practices and the cover-up and the history of deflection tactics, misleading and
suppressing information, corruption etc?
I certainly don't trust these people to do their jobs. Too many instances of police corruption, government cover up and collusion tell me not to
trust them at all. But that's why I hope that some journalists, and some moral MP's like Tom Watson will not let it go and will continue to push for
That's why I think investigative journalism should be playing a large role in this case. They don't need to be naming names, or using the lists that
are out there, they just need to be effective at pushing the cause and keep hammering away at any instances they find of potential corruption or
avoidance of investigation.
As for your mention of one of those on the list never being disproved, it is the process of justice that guilt be proven, not that innocence be
proven. You cannot go on the basis that accusation is correct, and then demand that someone prove that the allegation is false. Innocent until proven
guilty is the key here.
Anyone can make any claim about any other person, but there needs to be some form of evidence of the crime, and an investigation. The accused then has
to counter those accusations and evidence in their defence. It seems to me that many on the list have simply been accused. I have not seen any of the
lists actually detailing witnesses or victims, there are no statements by victims, there are seemingly few mentions of when or where these crimes were
supposed to have taken place...
People cannot expect those listed to have an adequate defence when only the accusations are published.
And, as I have mentioned in another thread, I think I have changed my opinion on what Cameron said after clicking a link and reading through a page of
The list I read through also details men engaged in sexual acts with other consenting men, not kids. Yet the author of that list seems to equate
boyfriends getting it on as evidence of the abuse of children. If Cameron has read that list then I can fully understand why he felt the need to make
the statement that he made.
This is what I fear, there are a lot of complete retards in the UK who will read that list and believe every word of it. They won't read it and think
"hang on, they're both consenting adults", they'll just copy that list off and suddenly all of those on it are again accused.
This is a mess, and I hope that those making unfounded accusations are treated harshly.
There needs to be a full investigation, and it needs to be credible. I would invite law students (they have something to prove and are less likely to
be biased and concerned about their position) to be witnesses to the investigatory process. They would help to ensure that those investigating these
allegations are not being controlled or limited, or simply ignoring avenues of investigation to protect others.
I would also hope that the press will keep on at this, with the help of MP's like Tom Watson. That can all be done without naming names and
suggesting that people should prove their innocence.
Ultimately, these men are innocent until proven guilty, and this trial by uninformed public opinion is not helping matters at all.