My Plea to the Republican Party!

Originally posted by micmerci

Originally posted by HappyBunny

Originally posted by micmerci
reply to post by HappyBunny

 

I am simply setting the record straight on the history of the Republican Party's platform. I have made no reference to my individual stance on ANY issues on ANY of my posts throughout this thread. So, to assume that I am a moral absolutist is baseless and just an attempt to sideline the purpose of my post.

Okay, then--where has the Republican Party's moral absolutism gotten it?

As far as the history of the Republican Party's platform, prior to about 1980 there wasn't much difference between the GOP and the Dems except maybe in foreign policy. Maybe you should look up Rockefeller Republicans and then contrast them with the neocons. And then look at Taft and Hartley. Eisenhower not only didn't repeal the New Deal--he expanded Social Security, for heaven's sakes.

I thought this thread began with a call to Republicans to shift their methodology in order to win approval as well as elections? I called out the OP in stating that simply if a Republican changes his platform for any reason (approval or winning being among the weakest IMO) then he cannot label himself a true Republican. I did not endorse any stance whatsoever, I just pointed out a fact.

Personally, I don't think you are going back far enough- 1980 was just a stones throw away in light of the long history of the Republican party. How about the 1860's? You want social issues? Who was it that championed the end of slavery in this country? Republicans. And who was it that started the KKK? I don't think I need to answer that question.

In the 1860's, the Republicans such as Lincoln were the beginnings of the modern Democrats, so your argument doesn't hold water.

Social issues and biblical values are two different things- although one can be applied to the other. The US was founded on the pillars of Biblical Values and religious freedom- whether people want to suppress that or not. I would like to point out that I said biblical and not Christian- there is a difference.

Religious freedom--and the choice to follow no God at all. The GOP persecutes anyone who doesn't agree with them--thus going against everything people came to this country for.

The founders were not overly religious. Some of them may have believed in a god, but they didn't let that interfere with their politics. They recognized, from the struggles that were going on in Europe, the value of keeping them separate.

I am willing to concede that Republicans need to work on their image in order to win people over and thus win elections but I do not think it wise to change one's stance. I feel the very same way for the Democrats, or Libertarians,etc. All I am saying, as I have been all along, is that if one is going to attach a label to himself then they need to embrace and stand on the policies associated with that label. Anything else IMO is just pandering and cowardice.

Working on their image isn't enough. They have to get rid of the Tea Party, and separate the fiscal conservatives from the social conservatives.

reply to post by sheepslayer247


F&S to sheepslayer247 and his OP! It's not my party but it's excellent advice just the same. It's definitely do or die time for the GOP.

In the 1860's, the Republicans such as Lincoln were the beginnings of the modern Democrats, so your argument doesn't hold water.

reply to post by HappyBunny


That's a pretty broad statement you make there. When you say modern Democrats, do you refer to War Democrats, Peace Democrats, Bourbon Democrats, or the angry Democrats in the Confederate States of America? I was going to point out that you had it backwards since the Democratic party has been around longer than the Republican- but you did say "modern" so I digress.

Could not agree with you more on the whole Tea Party thing. I think they should stand on their own feet and stop trying to associate themselves with the Repubs. By the same token I think the Repubs should be distancing themselves from the Tea Party.

I promised myself that I would stop debating politics after this election was over (actually I gave myself Wednesday for any closing arguments) but I think I can get away with this one under the guise of "history". It has been fun debating but I think we interpret history a bit differently from each other. That's ok because that's one thing IMO that makes America great- diversity.

Originally posted by micmerci

In the 1860's, the Republicans such as Lincoln were the beginnings of the modern Democrats, so your argument doesn't hold water.

reply to post by HappyBunny

 

That's a pretty broad statement you make there. When you say modern Democrats, do you refer to War Democrats, Peace Democrats, Bourbon Democrats, or the angry Democrats in the Confederate States of America? I was going to point out that you had it backwards since the Democratic party has been around longer than the Republican- but you did say "modern" so I digress.

You have no idea what you're talking about, do you?

reply to post by HappyBunny


And with that ignorant statement....the debate ends. Good day.

Originally posted by micmerci
reply to post by HappyBunny

 

And with that ignorant statement....the debate ends. Good day.

Good day to you, too.

Originally posted by micmerci

In the 1860's, the Republicans such as Lincoln were the beginnings of the modern Democrats, so your argument doesn't hold water.

reply to post by HappyBunny

 

That's a pretty broad statement you make there. When you say modern Democrats, do you refer to War Democrats, Peace Democrats, Bourbon Democrats, or the angry Democrats in the Confederate States of America? I was going to point out that you had it backwards since the Democratic party has been around longer than the Republican- but you did say "modern" so I digress.

For what it's worth...electoral map ...Dems and GOP swapped voters post civil rights bill.

Originally posted by Indigo5

For what it's worth...electoral map ...Dems and GOP swapped voters post civil rights bill.

Yep. The Southern Dixiecrats.

reply to post by sheepslayer247


I'm sorry but I believe you missed the real point. The Republican Party is no more. They are not true conservatives. They are spoiled rich fools (talking of the 'elected' Republicans) that have gotten so far from the core foundation of the party that they have morphed into something completely different.

I do agree with all of your points but feel this is the most important. I just fear that it is too late to do anything about it. The same old blood is entrenched in this party and they won't allow anyone in that has true republican ideals. They alienate anyone who has these. They use their money and power.

The same goes for the Democrats yet they have the more likeable front. They support the system that provides for the people instead of the one that allows the people to grow and support the nation as a whole. It's all screwed up.

reply to post by sheepslayer247


I was a Republican...

Until I got a full color multi page brochure on how Clinton was going to let the Gays Marry and adopt and a host of other things the GOP felt was evil and must be stopped and would be if I voted for Bush...

Problem is, I'm Gay.

Bye Bye GOP!

and I never looked back.

reply to post by Helmkat


Unfortunately, there is a lot of fear that is used by all political parties. The gay issue is one that bugs me as well. I don't want people sticking their noses into my business, so I don't stick my nose in theirs.

Why is that so hard for some people to do?

Originally posted by beezzer
reply to post by sheepslayer247

 

Time to start many things.

Re-energize the Tea Party
Introduce Libertarian people into mainstream NOW
Start an anti-Lobby Lobby

I have my work cut out for me.

No...not re-energize...purify
kick the religious kooks and palin pretenders out that took over the party.
Otherwise...yes, introducing the libertarian party is a good thing (find a younger icon though. Ron Paul is crazy grandpa joe to the youth)

Hell, I will help you with the anti-lobby lobby.

Originally posted by HappyBunny

Originally posted by Nite_wing
reply to post by LeatherNLace

 

I suggest "gridlock".
Put a halt to it all.
Let sequestration go through.

And you'll have 2 million people out of work...and I'll be one of them. This is exactly the kind of bull# that's NOT HELPING the country. You'd put 2 million more people into poverty or near-poverty just to prove a point.

Lovely. So much for patriotism and doing what's right for the country as a whole.

Ummm....Good, it's about time you got your paycheck from some other place than.....my pocket. I wish you would all wither and die on the vine. I dont need you, neither does anyone else. everyone of your jobs could be performed by the private sector. Matter of fact, I'll take yours...

YouSir

YouSir

reply to post by YouSir


It's not just your pocket. I also pay into the same system you do and I do not have a problem with many of the services I receive from the government. I have no desire to fire a bunch of people just so the private sector can take it over.

Government may be wasteful, but there is no profit motive.

So I kindly request that you do not speak for all of us, because we may disagree.

reply to post by sheepslayer247


We NEED conservative ideas. As well as liberal ones. We should take the best of both and use them to improve our country. But both sides of the isle need to get their crazies on a leash. The attacks and hostility needs to stop and listening needs to begin. We used to be able to do this in the US quite well and as a result we accomplished great things. THAT is what has been lost in this country. The ability to cooperate and to compromise. The US is in serious trouble. If we don't stop the bickering and the infighting we are going to collapse completely within a few years. Good luck to the country and good luck to us all.

Originally posted by sheepslayer247
I wake up this morn and turn on Fox

Here's your first mistake...

reply to post by openminded2011

A flag to you and a star as well if I figure out how. I fear though that it is to late. There is not enough money left to match what Obama has already promised his people and he knows it. Assaults on white people are on the rise but not greatly covered. Winsconson state fair for instance. Read the threads, listen to all the news stations. I fear the scapegoat has already been determined. When I fought for civil rights I never thought I would see this day and I doubt Dr. King did either. Life is always a surprise. lol

Originally posted by sheepslayer247
reply to post by Helmkat

 

Unfortunately, there is a lot of fear that is used by all political parties. The gay issue is one that bugs me as well. I don't want people sticking their noses into my business, so I don't stick my nose in theirs.

Why is that so hard for some people to do?

Its hard because it is so easy.

There is no fear more easy to stir than that of the "alien other". If you are not like me, then you are against me. Gays must be especially insidious to this mindset since they can be right next to you and you might never realize! They could be your best friend, the kid serving you a burger at the local slider joint or they could even be your President (he could also be Black! or have a foreign sounding name!). So now one half of the American politcal system has become fearmongering hypocrits, so entrenched in and mesmerized by their own message that they actually believe it. Liberals and Conservatives have been locked in strangle hold for a long time and it has been up to the moderates to smooth the wrinkles, sadly the "Moderate Conservative" is a dying breed, sacrificed as witches by their own party.

reply to post by sheepslayer247
Ummm.....good for you, bravo...because those people that you love to support are currently feeling up your grandmother after they've irradiated her.........umm dont you just love the sound of CIA, FBI, TSA, FEMA, TDOHS, fusion center? Dont they kind of roll off the tongue like a good old ball of snot? While you might like to swallow that back down, I prefer to spit it out because it does my body...no good. I'm not into that particular alphabet soup and everyone of them gets their paycheck from MY pocket. If you want to support them, then you can with a cheshire smile pay what they unconstitutionally take from me...as well, I really dont mind if you do.

YouSir

Yes. One cannot fix a problem unless they're willing to admit one exists.

Yesterday I heard Fox discussing the base and the demographics and such, and yet not one person commented on the party's IDEAS. What they stand for. They just refuse to admit that their core ideas need to be altered in order to fit within 21st century America. That will gain votes, not pandering to demographics. It's actually going to require a change toward the middle. You cannot politically survive a national election with any of the far right's ideas.


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