To those who said, "are you son of God?" Jesus said, "you say i am."

Originally posted by logical7

Originally posted by LittleByLittle

could you explain what you mean?
God should like you how you are rather than you trying to become better? You say you judge yourself better, so what standard you use?

Higher ideals where all are meant to be treated like an equal and with respect if they follow the golden rule. Service to ALL including yourself. I have a hard time with bullying in any form since I feel it is an ego parasitic behaviour and counter to what should be followed. You should be allowed to be different in any way you like as long as it is in symbiosis with the people and nature who are affected by your behaviour within reason. People should if able think outside the box and with a long time frame.

And I did not say better. I said I judge myself harder. It would probably be good for me to go easier on myself but that is not the ego/mind/spirit that I have at this time in my evolution. I am also tired of the limitations and processing power of the human brain. This biological hardware feels so slow and limiting.

edit on 9-11-2012 by LittleByLittle because: Spellchecking

i agree to most of what you said, but like you mentioned our reasoning is limited, too much. we can never comprehend how far the effects of our action can ripple and spread. so we do need a law. A guide to make it easier. Law is not something to smother and limit only, it lets you free yourself from mundane things so that you go higher. You would agree that constantly watching over yourself would be draining you a lot.

The reason are reasoning is limited is because we are not going to the next step in human evolution and mostly because people are afraid of it and want to stay indoctrinated and small minded.

If you go by the law that ALL IS ONE then you can by reasoning come up with if any action is correct or not. It would probably be better if people was more careful with each other and unsure and acted gently to be sure they are not creating bad karma that will hurt themselves in the end. Do not hurt other people because in hurting other people you are hurting god(in a miniscule way but you are). Loving your brother and sister and pet/animals around you is loving god.

You can be an atheist and be a great lover of god without knowing it .

reply to post by SimonPeter


How could I love life more than Jesus? Jesus was life just as I am life and just as you are life. It's not possible to love something more than itself. You believing that your memories will continue after death will leave you disappointed in the end. No, you won't stay dead forever because as long as there is life, there is you, but to think you will retain all the memories from this life is the death sentence.

I realize that my memories will not always be here, but I also know that life will go on. Since life goes on so will I and everyone else because what are we other than life itself?

reply to post by LittleByLittle


do we evolve? You mean, we can go higher and higher and ultimately reach an awareness that will unite us with God?
Or do you mean that the highest awareness is a destination/place that a person reaches but there is no god?? Just people who have reached before?
I would like to know it simply, a belief should be simple to be strong.

reply to post by logical7


The Old Testament described the sacrifice of Jesus whom was sinless who went to the slaughter as an innocent Lamb for our transgressions in Isaiah 53 . This was written as prophecy to the Crucifixion of Christ Jesus some 712 years before it came true . Jesus dies for our sins . Isaiah 53 verse 9 < And he made his grave with the wicked and with the rich in his death; because he had done noviolence, neither was any deciet in his mouth.>
Islam tries to ignore the fact that Jesus was the Christ promised from the beginning and that he fulfilled every prophecy and pleased God. The biggest thing is that Islam can not admit that Christ died for our sins because there would be no legitimacy for the advent of Islam . If Christ was the Son of God and died for our sins Mohammad is a dud ! What miracles did Mohammad do ? He made many hundreds of people who opposed his revelations DISAPPEAR . Their bones can be found under Mecca .I'm sure he made many women's belly swell . So far it would seem he is good at self serving miracles.
Jesus did many miracles in front of thousands of people who attested to them and their Holy nature . Jesus gave his life very young for us when he could have simply walked away. His coming to this life was expressly a mission of God and not of pleasure . Mohammad's life was not expressly to deliver Gods message . It was a life of pleasure and a long life not given or sacrificed for good but lived to pleasure the flesh .
The Muslims attempt to find validation for Islam in the Bible is in vain . There is none !

reply to post by SimonPeter


History has the tendency to repeat itself, I could prophecy that there will be rain at your house within the next year and I would be right because I know there will be rain at some point. Apply that same logic to these prophecies in the OT, they knew at some point in the future someone would come along and tell the truth of things and would be killed because of it, it had happened before and they knew it would happen again.

These aren't prophecies, more like predictions. If they had given a name then maybe I'd think differently.

I think my prophecy of rain is a little better than theirs though because I gave you a timeline, they didn't.

reply to post by 3NL1GHT3N3D1


Your generality in your post tells me volumes about you actual knowledge of those prophesies and you beliefs or lack thereof. I am not impressed .

reply to post by logical7


Jesus said that John the Baptist was the final prophet, and you think that muhammed was the final prophet. The rest of the prophets are called christians. I belieave God is one too, but God is one and Trine, and in the Trinity is All.

I also believe that there was a plan long in effect for our solar system and universe, and that Christ, the Son, the Intercessor and Immanuel was symbolized by the very architecture in the skies above, and that through Him all things were made. That there is a perfect plan, after all it seems quite obvious there is a real push for us to not believe this, and the real message of Love is always being overshadowed by Greed, and Selfishness. And that Christ, Goodness is coming.

reply to post by SimonPeter

The Old Testament described the sacrifice of Jesus whom was sinless who went to the slaughter as an innocent Lamb for our transgressions in Isaiah 53 .

That theology rests on the belief that a brutal Roman execution was a sin "sacrifice".



As for Isaiah 53, if it indeed pointed to Jesus' execution, then the Pharisees who were well versed in scripture, would have realized that that Jesus was matching everything written in Isaiah 53. Somebody would have said "hey, Jesus is matching everything written about the messiah".
Instead they had him killed as punishment for some perceived sins and to prove that he was not the messiah...and NOT because they wanted to fulfill some prophecy.

They bragged about how they killed Jesus. But Islam reveals the truth 600 years later that the Jews failed to kill him.

The biggest thing is that Islam can not admit that Christ died for our sins because there would be no legitimacy for the advent of Islam .

No, its because Islam believes God protected Jesus in his time of trouble, as taught in the Psalms.

If Christ was the Son of God and died for our sins Mohammad is a dud !

By the same logic, there was also no need for Paul... who was never appointed by Jesus.
Paul says Jesus spoke to him, but you can only take his word for it.

The Muslims attempt to find validation for Islam in the Bible is in vain . There is none !

Its interesting how Muslims can comfortably use the Bible itself to point out flaws in Christian theology and reinforce Islam.

reply to post by SimonPeter

Jesus died on the cross for forgiveness of sin . Mohammad likely died in some compromising position .

You believe Jesus died on the cross in his underwear... after being beaten black and blue... cut up and bleeding... with an "insulting" crown of thorns.... next to 2 thieves. And you think Mohammad likely died in a "compromising" position?

Please think twice before you make such ridiculous statements.

Originally posted by backcase
reply to post by logical7

 

Jesus said that John the Baptist was the final prophet, and you think that muhammed was the final prophet. The rest of the prophets are called christians. I belieave God is one too, but God is one and Trine, and in the Trinity is All.

where did Jesus pbuh tell that? I'l like to know.
God can be one or three. Not one and three. i have heard many explanations about that. Cant get how God, an angel and a man form trinity. If God created angels and Jesus pbuh. Dont they become creations of The Creator? and not equal to God.

Originally posted by SimonPeter
reply to post by logical7

 

The Old Testament described the sacrifice of Jesus whom was sinless who went to the slaughter as an innocent Lamb for our transgressions in Isaiah 53 . This was written as prophecy to the Crucifixion of Christ Jesus some 712 years before it came true . Jesus dies for our sins . Isaiah 53 verse 9 < And he made his grave with the wicked and with the rich in his death; because he had done noviolence, neither was any deciet in his mouth.>
Islam tries to ignore the fact that Jesus was the Christ promised from the beginning and that he fulfilled every prophecy and pleased God. The biggest thing is that Islam can not admit that Christ died for our sins because there would be no legitimacy for the advent of Islam . If Christ was the Son of God and died for our sins Mohammad is a dud ! What miracles did Mohammad do ? He made many hundreds of people who opposed his revelations DISAPPEAR . Their bones can be found under Mecca .I'm sure he made many women's belly swell . So far it would seem he is good at self serving miracles.
Jesus did many miracles in front of thousands of people who attested to them and their Holy nature . Jesus gave his life very young for us when he could have simply walked away. His coming to this life was expressly a mission of God and not of pleasure . Mohammad's life was not expressly to deliver Gods message . It was a life of pleasure and a long life not given or sacrificed for good but lived to pleasure the flesh .
The Muslims attempt to find validation for Islam in the Bible is in vain . There is none !

prophecies can be twisted to fit a desired event. The one which you claim fits to Jesus pbuh, doesnt it fit to John the baptist?
And about miracles. God gave prophets miracles to make it easy for people to believe the prophet. Moses, Jesus pbuh showed miracles. But they were for the eyes. And after few generations they would be seen as stories even myth. Thats cause the prophets were for a time and the miracles served the purpose for that limited time. But for the last prophet, the miracle also should last. So the miracle of Muhammad was not for eyes, but is for the ears and mind. The Quran. it is such a literary miracle that even the worst enemies of prophet gathered at night hiding to just hear it. It has scientific facts for scientific people to know and get their personal miracle.
It is a mathematical miracle. I'l just share this one here. God says the similitude of Jesus pbuh is like Adam pbuh. Its backed by Quran mathametical by having their names 25 times each. And Quran was revealed piece by piece in 23 years, commenting on situations that were occuring. Who could know it(future) all and who could keep track of each word said. Ah ya only God. And interestingly this mathametical miracle wasnt discovered till recently.
Some more
Man 24 Woman 24 And amazingly enough have a look
how many times the following
words appear:-
Month 12
Day 365
sea 32 Land 13
Sea + land = 32 + 13 = 45
% sea = 32/45 * 100 % =
71.11111111
% land= 13 / 45 * 100 % =
28.88888889 = 100.00 Modern Science has only recently
proven that the water covers
71.111 % of the earth, while the
land covers 28.889 %.

reply to post by logical7


All the OT prophets prophecied until John the Baptist, it takes a prophet to confirm a prophet. Prophets who self anoint are false prophets. Jesus did prophecy himself but he is more than a prophet, he's the Melchizidek, the Prophet-Priest-King who unlike us, came from heaven. Christ's Apostles also prophecied through the Holy Spirit, and even John the Evangelist (the beloved apostle/disciple) who wrote Revelation prophecied which is where the book of Revelation came from.

The fellow in this video gives some good info on it.

reply to post by lonewolf19792000


ya, what you say about a prophet informing about next prophet is very true.
John the baptist identified Jesus pbuh and even baptised him to keep and fulfil the tradition. Jesus pbuh also acknowledged him as prophet.
But doesnt Jesus pbuh also prophecise about the comforter, who would teach them about all things, who wouldnt speak of his own but what he hears shall he speak, (sounds like a new revealation)
and dint Jesus pbuh had to go so as to send him? And the popular concept that its about Holy spirit doesnt fit as the spirit was already with Jesus.
Jesus pbuh said, "he shall speak of me" guess what, Muhammad pbuh spoke of him and also prophecised his second coming, thus closing yet fulfilling the tradition of each prophet telling about next, as Muhammad pbuh is last.

Originally posted by logical7
reply to post by LittleByLittle

 

do we evolve? You mean, we can go higher and higher and ultimately reach an awareness that will unite us with God?
Or do you mean that the highest awareness is a destination/place that a person reaches but there is no god?? Just people who have reached before?
I would like to know it simply, a belief should be simple to be strong.

From my point of view. God and the people who have reached higher level is the same thing. everything is conciousness. There is a reason from my point of view that they wrote in "our image" in the bible. They at least got that right in that book. I know it is hard to belive you are part of something beyond yourself like a aware cell in the body of something larger.

The spirit evolves or wakes up at least and changes the ego and the body (in some ways). I do not think that it is hard to at least start connecting by playing around with chakras and meditation. At least you can experiance what a body really feels like when it is truely alive. I have no clue how things I cannot perceive look like. But I can feel them when they make themselves known.

reply to post by LittleByLittle


my view is that people who have reached that awareness have found the connection to that highest awareness(God) but are never equal to Him. And there is a God because if not then who guided the 1st human to find that connection and reach that highest level. So God contacts humans by appointing a human among them and these people are the prophets. So its not just the humans who are seeking to go higher but the Creator is guiding us up and making it easier to make us realise that we are one, to abolish that feeling of separateness from each other which is the root of all voilence. That separateness is born at birth and that illusion strengthens the longer we live especially the more sensation seeking we get until one starts seeking the reality(by meditation by blinding all senses) and breaks that illusion. All this is intelligently arranged, so there is a Creator.

Well I can see there is no reason to carry on this conversation because there is no reasoning with you . I have laid out that Mohammad was not an example of a prophet of God but as an Antichrist .The Islamic religion is that of Antichrist because it denies that Christ died for our sins and says he was not the Son of God .
You tried to validate Islam through the bible and can not do it . You lack the ability to logically discuss scripture .
You twist everything to try to prove a point .

reply to post by logical7

But doesnt Jesus pbuh also prophecise about the comforter, who would teach them about all things, who wouldnt speak of his own but what he hears shall he speak, (sounds like a new revealation)
and dint Jesus pbuh had to go so as to send him? And the popular concept that its about Holy spirit doesnt fit as the spirit was already with Jesus.
Jesus pbuh said, "he shall speak of me" guess what, Muhammad pbuh spoke of him and also prophecised his second coming, thus closing yet fulfilling the tradition of each prophet telling about next, as Muhammad pbuh is last.

You're not going to want to hear this but he was not talking about Muhammad. Pentecost happened about 50 days after that. The "comforter" Jesus was talking about was not Muhammad, it's the Holy Spirit, this same Holy Spirit that was seen alighting on Jesus at his baptism was sent to the Apostles in the Upper Room and then those new believers who came after recieved Him. Muhammad was not a prophet and he certainly was not the Holy Spirit (Ruach ha'Kodesh).

John 14:15-17

15 “If you love Me, keep My commandments. 16 And I will pray the Father, and He will give you another Helper, that He may abide with you forever— 17 the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it neither sees Him nor knows Him; but you know Him, for He dwells with you and will be in you. 18 I will not leave you orphans; I will come to you.

This Spirit of truth Jesus is talking about is his own Holy Spirit he sends back after he ascended the Mercy Seat, which is why he said "i will not leave you orphans i will come to you".

reply to post by logical7


I would be happy to explain the Trinity to you. Wisdom exists in the understanding of It. The Trinity is the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit. First of all to see it in the right light I must tell you that the Son is the Word of God, God's promise and Jesus' divinity. Secondly the Holy Spirit is not the Archangel Gabriel but the Spirit in all creation. The Father is the Creator, the Son is the Creation, and the Spirit is the reciprocal Love of the other Two for each other. That is the simple thought of it I will give you because there are many more, as all of creation mirrors the Trinity. U2U me if you would like to know more.

I do not remember where the thought I put in my other message was said, but I remember reading it, and all that i read is the new testament.

Peace to you

reply to post by sk0rpi0n


Jesus died for our sins , There has never been any contradiction to that account before . There is no verbiage in the Bible or in any other history that refutes that crucifixion . Islam needs to have a mandate to exist and you are trying to find it . There is only one Muslim tribe that has tried to put forth that lie and the other Islamic tribes have refuted his claim .That's old news where the one Imam tried to claim that Jesus didn't die and married Mary Magdalene and lived to be 54 years old .He was made out to be a liar by Muslim Imams . . The religion of a Fornicator and Murderer who lived his whole life 62 years serving his own desires is a FRAUD . That's exactly what you are saying about Christianity when you insist Jesus did not die .
You are calling God incompetent when you say Jesus did not fulfill his will as he was sent to do . When you say a Murderer and Fornicator and Pedophile was sent to do the will of God you sound silly .