US lab validates Padang IS older than the Giza pyramid 14,000 BC

reply to post by SeekerofTruth101


The earliest written history goes back to 900 AD. If you are interested in the pre-history of that region I can suggest

Early cultures of Mainland Southeast Asia, by Charles Higham, ISBN 974 8225 70 4

Originally posted by SLAYER69

Originally posted by Skyfloating
If 20 years ago anyone would have said there is a pyramid-like structure that is some 16 000 years old they would have laughed you off as a kook.

That's exactly the point. Every few years they push back the timeline of early development and in between we keep hearing there was nothing before XYZ. Then they find locations such as this or in turkey......

This is because our tools and abilities to locate and date get better with time.

There is some sort of assumption in the general public that we know everything and there is (apparently) no need for research or new tools, because news about discoveries that change how we think about the world are often greeted with anger, scorn, or scoffing. If our civilization had been born with time traveling remote viewing droids, molecular analyzers that would identify every single atom in every single compound, supercomputers beyond what we'll have in 200 years, and maps of every square inch of the Earth's surface and so forth -- AND we'd had all that since 6,000 BC -- then yes, we should heap scorn on people who couldn't figure out the history of the world with those tools.

But we didn't. We do the best with what we've got. Answers change, and they SHOULD change.

Originally posted by SLAYER69
reply to post by Byrd

 

I see your point and will try to stay objective but I'm leaning more and more towards a newer understanding of this location.


You know me Byrd.

P.S. Good to see ya out and about more often

Remember - always look for First Sources.

I'm not going to be that visible until after May (when I *PRAY* that this degree is finished. I'm in the research and writing the first parts of the dissertation phase now.)

reply to post by Byrd


Best of luck and after you are finished describe to us how in stage three of the invocation rite you get to stomp on an Atlantean vase and say in Latin, 'it doesn't exist'......

Originally posted by thesmokingman
Carbon dating has proven itself to not be a very accurate dating measure.
www.angelfire.com...

edit on 4-11-2012 by thesmokingman because: (no reason given)

Carbon dating is only accurate back a few thousand years.

edit on 4-11-2012 by thesmokingman because: (no reason given)

From your linked site:

What would happen if a dinosaur bone were carbon dated? - At Oak Ridge National Laboratory, Scientists dated dinosaur bones using the Carbon dating method. The age they came back with was only a few thousand years old.

The above indicates that the author of the site has no idea what he's talking about. C14 is no good beyond around 50K to 60K YBP.

Every real scientist knows this.

Harte

Originally posted by Harte

Originally posted by thesmokingman
Carbon dating has proven itself to not be a very accurate dating measure.
www.angelfire.com...

edit on 4-11-2012 by thesmokingman because: (no reason given)

Carbon dating is only accurate back a few thousand years.

edit on 4-11-2012 by thesmokingman because: (no reason given)

From your linked site:

What would happen if a dinosaur bone were carbon dated? - At Oak Ridge National Laboratory, Scientists dated dinosaur bones using the Carbon dating method. The age they came back with was only a few thousand years old.

The above indicates that the author of the site has no idea what he's talking about. C14 is no good beyond around 50K to 60K YBP.

Every real scientist knows this.

Harte

edit on 11/6/2012 by Harte because: (no reason given)

Don't give the creationists any fuel,man.

giza. are people still trying to use that as a placement marker? there are cities under the freakin ocean, including some off the coast right where the giza pyramids are!!! we are obiously way older than 20,30,40,50k we're like hundreds of thousands of years old, if we are correct on ice age times.

i think its great, i hope we find more older than even this,, love ancient society stuff.

Originally posted by ~widowmaker~
giza. are people still trying to use that as a placement marker? there are cities under the freakin ocean, including some off the coast right where the giza pyramids are!!! we are obiously way older than 20,30,40,50k we're like hundreds of thousands of years old, if we are correct on ice age times.

i think its great, i hope we find more older than even this,, love ancient society stuff.

Your first comments are partially correct, there are historically known cities that were flooded but none date back more than a few thousand years. Why do you think it 'obvious' we are much older? What evidence makes you believe that?

Originally posted by TheSparrowSings
reply to post by Hanslune

 

It would also depend on what the material was that they dated.

Carbon-dating test results from the Miami lab show that the structure could date back to 14,000 BC or beyond. The lab used samples of sand, soil and charcoal found at a depth of between three and 12 meters beneath the mountain’s surface.

Key word there was bolded by me. Thoughts?

The article is heavily hedged - the only evidence the structure is man made at all is the carbon dating age and the depth of burial being quiet shallow -

Any natural material buried between three and 12 meters under the surface should have been millions of years in age, Budianto said.

That is a supposition that is pretty easy to question - it is easy to imagine ways "nature" could bury something 3-12 metres in 10,000 years - eg weather, erruption, and of course it is also possible that "nature" got a hand in doing so from humanity ver however long people have been living there.

Originally posted by thesmokingman
Carbon dating has proven itself to not be a very accurate dating measure.
www.angelfire.com...

edit on 4-11-2012 by thesmokingman because: (no reason given)

Carbon dating is only accurate back a few thousand years.

edit on 4-11-2012 by thesmokingman because: (no reason given)

your source is an idiot.
no one uses carbon dating on fossils! please go learn what carbon dating is from someone who knows something about it.
or i could tell you i guess, you can only carbon date things that have carbon in them, no fossil has carbon, it is rock.
lol that site is full of howlers, lol at dating the earth with carbon dating!

creationists are funny.

Originally posted by ~widowmaker~
giza. are people still trying to use that as a placement marker? there are cities under the freakin ocean, including some off the coast right where the giza pyramids are!!! we are obiously way older than 20,30,40,50k we're like hundreds of thousands of years old, if we are correct on ice age times.

homo sapian sapian is somewhere around 250k+ years old. that doesn't mean squat. how old are those cities? i doubt close to the ages you wish they were, most are not that deep.

i think its great, i hope we find more older than even this,, love ancient society stuff.

what do you think this proves? that man can't build things 14k years ago? i can't think of anyone who doubts humanity can build stuff.
this doesn't mean it is proof we were super advanced thousands of years before recorded history, only that we have a structure that might be old.

Originally posted by JohnnyCanuck

Originally posted by summerbreeze.ddp
TPTB want us to believe the evolution lie and believe that our current civilization is the most most advanced that has ever lived.

Fabulous! Show me some proof, and I'll carry that banner with you!

Google: OOPARTS.
Google: smithsonian loses artifacts
Google: Library of Alexander burned
Google: Suppressed History of Planet Earth
Google: Suppressed Archaeology

It may shock and amaze you

reply to post by Hanslune


Did you see the History chanel show Life After People? As much a mess as we have made of the planet, in 10,000 years there will be very little evidence of our having been here.

www.history.com...-force-one

Imagine what it would look like in a million years with out people?

reply to post by Byrd


I guess it breaks down for me two ways.

1.) There are those who feel humans had airplanes, space travel and what not and/or Alien intervention in mans ancient past.

2.) Then there are those like myself who believe mankind has reached varying levels of early civilization/culture before the time frame that is presently accepted. For me it's not hard to conceive that along those now submerged ancient ice age coast lines are remnants of those now forgotten civilizations and cultures.

Side note: The ocean levels may or may not have played a role in their demise. We've seen evidence of Civilizations and cultures all over the world collapsing due to many factors.

The Ocean levels rising may have simply flooded out their remnants...

Originally posted by summerbreeze.ddp
reply to post by Hanslune

 

Did you see the History chanel show Life After People? As much a mess as we have made of the planet, in 10,000 years there will be very little evidence of our having been here.

Speaking as someone who's gone on archaeology digs (and when you talk to Hans, you're talking to someone who's been on a LOT of professional digs), neither Hans nor I were impressed by the show. It had a lot of inaccuracies and misinformation and seemed to be put together by someone whose knowledge of archaeology and techniques is about 80 years out of date.

We find evidences of villages that are 20,000 years old and older. Clovis sites (these are sites in rock shelters (cliff overhangs)) are dated to 10,000 BC and there's even older material out there. These were small villages and camps -- not huge cities.

There'll be mounds of evidence, even a million years from now.

Originally posted by SLAYER69
reply to post by Byrd

 

I guess it breaks down for me two ways.

1.) There are those who feel humans had airplanes, space travel and what not and/or Alien intervention in mans ancient past.

The evidence doesn't support that, as we both agree.

2.) Then there are those like myself who believe mankind has reached varying levels of early civilization/culture before the time frame that is presently accepted. For me it's not hard to conceive that along those now submerged ancient ice age coast lines are remnants of those now forgotten civilizations and cultures.

We can actually agree on this. I can see a small group of villages on an island being wiped out by a volcano. I can see a small group (and here I'd call them a culture, since "civilization" means cities which is a fairly large settlement and has extended resouruce areas) being wiped out by a massive flood or earthquake (enough so that the survivors go to other areas and merge with them.

What I do not see is a civilization of the level of (say) ancient Sumeria being wiped out in one fell swoop unless it lived on a small volcanic island and was buried in a series of lahars.

Originally posted by summerbreeze.ddp
reply to post by Hanslune

 

Did you see the History chanel show Life After People? As much a mess as we have made of the planet, in 10,000 years there will be very little evidence of our having been here.

www.history.com...-force-one

Imagine what it would look like in a million years with out people?

Yes I have, they were talking about what would be seen by a non-expert looking at the surface. Even today you can easily find evidence of ancient civilizations by an expert walking around and looking at the surface and even more beneath.

We are finding stone tools and bones from said people that is older than 1,000,000 years

reply to post by Byrd


Ditto

I suspect we'll find more GT's and Catalhuyucks type cultures in Asia minor and elsewhere perhaps going back as far as 25,000 YBP

When I was travelling around the Middle-East in the mid 80's I saw hundreds of tells that have never be excavated, there are probably around 7-8,000 village sized tells in the middle east (wild estimate) with probably another 25,000+ that are just slight mounds and not even noticable or under existing habitations - lots of stuff to search

Originally posted by summerbreeze.ddp
Google: OOPARTS.
Google: smithsonian loses artifacts
Google: Library of Alexander burned
Google: Suppressed History of Planet Earth
Google: Suppressed Archaeology
It may shock and amaze you

I have certainly googled such things and I was indeed shocked and amazed. Perhaps not for the reasons you might expect. To make it easy on all of us, I'd merely submit that the breathless interpretations you cite are rarely the best...but they do sell books. Dig a little deeper (no pun intended) and better reasoned explanations emerge. In many cases, you need to consider the sources and what their particular agendas might be. And sometimes...folks are just full of crap.

Try this site on for size: Hall of Ma'at. Curiousity and imagination, even alternative visions, fuel research - Mark Lehner is a great example. But, as they say, if you hear hoof beats, think horses, not zebras.

reply to post by Hanslune


Things that lead me to believe this are, 1 the planet is billions of years old. 2 many civs have same artwork /stories/ religions that resemble religions from before there own 3 there are numerous under water locations that have temples / docks/ or whole cities layouts (such as off the coast of Japanese islands or off coast of Cuba I think it is?) 5 vast societies and tribes that have star charts and knowledge of things that are simple impossible even with the best telescopes now. So I think we were super advanced in out great past and a big rock or something messed up our pretty garden and we had to start all over again, maybe numerous times. 6 we find out carbon dating techniques used may have been flawed do to recent fires messing up dating, and have to be redone with radioactive isotopes to get more accurate reading so things could very well be hundreds of thousand of years old but had a fire in the area 5 thousand-20 thousand years ago. 7 we can't really date stone so half the structures we see could very well be millions of years old and new societies just jeep updating them and taking care of them claiming they built them. ^^

I don't know really I just think we have been way more advanced at one point (oop artifacts being found miles into a mountain? ) if we are here other races can be here as well(in the universe) so very well could have been many societies here over billions of years. And I think were are hundreds to millions of years old, not 20-30k , which mind you in the 1920s they were trying to spew that we were just 2-10k years old. And many people from different fields have stated after retirement or near death that they think the work they did was much older but wouldn't go against mainstream teaching for fear of being ridiculed from anthropologists to archaeologists.