54 year old tells me he won't get Social Security if Romney is Elected.

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posted on Nov, 4 2012 @ 10:34 AM
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Originally posted by The Old American

Originally posted by Destinyone
reply to post by Valhall
 


Even though I've paid into the SS system for my whole life, and am entitled to SS...I really have no faith in it. Yes, I'll be 62 before the year ends, and can claim now, I won't. In the event there is still a SS system in place when I reach 66, I'll file then...maybe.

The reason I started a new business at the age of 60, with me at the helm, is to support myself through and to the end of my life. I don't expect anyone else to support me. I know depending on a broken system, is a crapshoot at best. I had no choice in SS taking money out of my paychecks for most of my life...I've made damn sure, I'm in control of my choices now.

Des



Here's the kicker, Des: you're NOT entitled to it. The SCOTUS ruled in Nestor v. Fleming that SS is only a tax, and that nobody is entitled to anything back from that tax. Just because the benefit is given, doesn't mean you'll automatically get it. This is how it was sold to the American public, but it was big, fat lie. It's only an extra tax to help pay for our interminable wars.

/TOA


That is exactly why SS is now, not factored into *my* retirement plan. I'm not planning on retiring, I'll be working until the day I die. But, I am now in control of the money I make. I am planning my own financial future, without factoring in the hopes that I'll hit some unguaranteed Jackpot when I turn 66. I have no faith is a system that robs Peter to pay Paul...the line of people waiting to pull the handle on the dwindling SS slot machine can't go on forever...there is an end to the line...it's called diminishing returns. I'll not be trapped in that Ouroboros...

Des




posted on Nov, 4 2012 @ 10:38 AM
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Originally posted by Destinyone
I'll not be trapped in that Ouroboros...

Des


Its really too bad, EVERYONE doesn't think this way. I applaud this way of thinking 100%.

You say you have a business?

U2U the info.............




posted on Nov, 4 2012 @ 10:38 AM
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Why Social Security?


For 250 years and more many American families, like the first colonists, measured their security in terms of the things they could make and do for themselves. As the frontier stretched westward, covered wagons carried with them the habits and ideals that had conquered the wilderness at Jamestown and Massachusetts Bay. Now automobiles plunge in days over the trails that a scout on horseback or a wagon could travel only in months, and airplanes cross the continent in a single hop. The ways in which American families live have changed as swiftly as the ways in which they travel.



Old people, like children, have lost much of their economic value to a household. Most American families no longer live in houses where one can build on a room or a wing to shelter aging parents and aunts and uncles and cousins. They no longer have gardens, sewing rooms, and big kitchens where old people can help make the family's living. Old people were not "dependent" upon their relatives when there was need in a household for work they could do. They have become dependent since their room and their board cost money, while they have little to give in return. Now they need money of their own to keep the dignity and independence they had when their share in work was the equivalent in money.




"SECURITY was attained in the earlier days through the interdependence of members of families upon each other and of the families within a small community upon each other. The complexities of great communities and of organized industry make less real these simple means of security. Therefore, we are compelled to employ the active interest of the Nation as a whole through government in order to encourage a greater security for each individual who composes it.... This seeking for a greater measure of welfare and happiness does not indicate a change in values. It is rather a return to values lost in the course of our economic development and expansion." Franklin D. Roosevelt: Message of the President to Congress, June 8, 1934.


Is Social Security an Entitlement Program?

[q]In 1961, I signed into law a series of Social Security Amendments that represented a step towards eliminating many of the hardships of old age, disability, or untimely death of a family’s wage-earner. A I have always believed that the nation’s strength lies in the continued well-being of its people, and changes in our population, working habits, and in our standards of living required further revision of Social Security to maintain that well-being. The 1961 Amendments made Social Security more effective and more beneficial for recipients. JFK [/q]


The federal government now includes Social Security in its debt portfolio, not because the program is insolvent or ever was, and not because the Federal government has to fund it in any sense (Social Security is funded by YOUR investments) but because the Federal government has STOLEN so much money from the fund, then sold special treasury securities on those STOLEN funds to countries like China to finance the massive debt accruing across the board. A Since there is no chance the national debt can ever be repaid, the Fed is now in the position of finagling the discharge of internal debt from the books. Look at it as a form of back door bankruptcy.
edit on 4-11-2012 by newcovenant because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 4 2012 @ 10:39 AM
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Originally posted by badgerprints
Romney's plan allows me to live off of the money that I earned and contributed.
I'd rather live off of what I've earned than something that the government stole from others.



That's awesome, and congratulations on that. How many other people can say the same?

Are you paying taxes though on what you have earned?..

Thus, you are feeding the system even if you have figured a way around it for yourself.



posted on Nov, 4 2012 @ 10:42 AM
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Originally posted by YourWIFI
They are against this LOW-RISK option that will be there for retirees IF IT OPERATED CORRECTLY and not raided. There would be HUGE SURPLUSES if allowed to operate as it SHOULD and not abused.


First it is not an option. Go tell your employer that you wish to opt out the social security plan so he can stop paying the government. Let me know how that goes for you. Second when has any government agency, regardless of some silly political party name, ever "OPERATED CORRECTLY".


So what are the Conservatives for when it comes to our retirees? They are in favor of the HIGH-RISK gambling casino type retirement plans where corrupt greedy scumbags profit on it with NO regulations stopping them from leaving our elders left with NOTHING in the end. Conservatives are all about the unregulated, high-risk gabling casino type society where the corrupt greedy scumbags profit at the expense of the commoner working class and middle class American folks.


You mean I can choose to be part of the government taxing me, returning historically a ridiculously small amount, or I can put my money into a well-thought out private plan where I have control and can see it, making on average 8-10% on that investment through its life-time? Tough choice here but let me ask you this. If Social Security is this beacon of light you are proclaiming it is, then why do people have private retirement accounts?

Post Script:
I would gladly relinquish all my 'entitlements' in Social Security to have the following happen: I stop paying out of every paycheck and my company in turn stops paying twice what I already paid. That frees up capital on both ends and I can decide how to invest for my future. No an incompetent government that likes to play with it for votes and fear.
edit on 4-11-2012 by ownbestenemy because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 4 2012 @ 10:42 AM
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reply to post by MyHappyDogShiner
 


I'm going to follow up on this post with more response. I was not able to start saving into my retirement until I was 36 years old. That's because I was a single parent raising two children, receiving no child support and paying off my student loans. It took until then for me to get to the point I realized...I have to start doing this and I can now take the hit to do it.

So, I only have 12 years of investing in my 401k. Now, at first all I could do was a little percent, then I was able to put more. However, in the past 2 years, due to increasing tax burdens, I have had to keep reducing the percent I can put in my retirement.

But with that all said, the typical social security payment (if you can stay alive and not work yourself to death before you reach retirement age) is around $1200/month. In just 12 years I have 23-1/2 years worth of those payments available to me when I retire via my 401k.

23-1/2 years and I've done that in 12 years.

And you think that giving people the ability to choose to do this wrong?



posted on Nov, 4 2012 @ 10:44 AM
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Originally posted by Destinyone

Originally posted by The Old American

Originally posted by Destinyone
reply to post by Valhall
 


Even though I've paid into the SS system for my whole life, and am entitled to SS...I really have no faith in it. Yes, I'll be 62 before the year ends, and can claim now, I won't. In the event there is still a SS system in place when I reach 66, I'll file then...maybe.

The reason I started a new business at the age of 60, with me at the helm, is to support myself through and to the end of my life. I don't expect anyone else to support me. I know depending on a broken system, is a crapshoot at best. I had no choice in SS taking money out of my paychecks for most of my life...I've made damn sure, I'm in control of my choices now.

Des



Here's the kicker, Des: you're NOT entitled to it. The SCOTUS ruled in Nestor v. Fleming that SS is only a tax, and that nobody is entitled to anything back from that tax. Just because the benefit is given, doesn't mean you'll automatically get it. This is how it was sold to the American public, but it was big, fat lie. It's only an extra tax to help pay for our interminable wars.

/TOA


That is exactly why SS is now, not factored into *my* retirement plan. I'm not planning on retiring, I'll be working until the day I die. But, I am now in control of the money I make. I am planning my own financial future, without factoring in the hopes that I'll hit some unguaranteed Jackpot when I turn 66. I have no faith is a system that robs Peter to pay Paul...the line of people waiting to pull the handle on the dwindling SS slot machine can't go on forever...there is an end to the line...it's called diminishing returns. I'll not be trapped in that Ouroboros...

Des



You think social security is a jackpot? You have got to be kidding me? It is a small guaranteed income for the end of days. There are many other investments you can place your money in but they are NEVER guaranteed as people with all their saving tied up in 401K's found out recently. Many investors lost it all. Social security provides a modicum of exactly that. Security. All your investments might fail and we will end up paying for you in the long run too.



edit on 4-11-2012 by newcovenant because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 4 2012 @ 10:46 AM
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reply to post by newcovenant
 


Stop sweating...you'll never be paying for me...maybe a boatload of other people...but, not me Bubba....

Des



posted on Nov, 4 2012 @ 10:48 AM
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reply to post by ownbestenemy
 


I know many people who placed all their saving in a 401 K and lost their entire investment in 2007. There are no guarantees and who is to say you will not become victim of scammers or unscrupulous companies who are supposed to match your savings but instead raid the account. Hardly ever see white collar criminals go to jail so tell me what do they have to lose by screwing you?



posted on Nov, 4 2012 @ 10:49 AM
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Originally posted by Destinyone
reply to post by newcovenant
 


Stop sweating...you'll never be paying for me...maybe a boatload of other people...but, not me Bubba....

Des


Hindsight is 20/20. Foresight...not so much.



posted on Nov, 4 2012 @ 10:49 AM
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reply to post by newcovenant
 


And so...according to your plan, idiocy warrants a hand-out. Because that's what you're talking about. Idiots who didn't manage their retirement. That's the same as not saving a cent back for your own future.

Ignorance is apparently the "entitlement" factor.
edit on 11-4-2012 by Valhall because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 4 2012 @ 10:49 AM
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Originally posted by newcovenant
All your investments might fail and we will end up paying for you in the long run too.








The government is not responsible for your retirement, well-being, or happiness. This country was founded on three inalienable rights as defined by the Declaration of Independence – “…life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness…” Every individual must hold themselves accountable. They must recognize that the problem with entitlements is that you are not entitled to anything. You must provide for your own well-being, your own retirement, and your own happiness.


Link



posted on Nov, 4 2012 @ 10:50 AM
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Originally posted by newcovenant
reply to post by ownbestenemy
 


I know many people who placed all their saving in a 401 K and lost their entire investment in 2007. There are no guarantees and who is to say you will not become victim of scammers or unscrupulous companies who are supposed to match your savings but instead raid the account. Hardly ever see white collar criminals go to jail so tell me what do they have to lose by screwing you?


So what is your recommendation then? Mattress stuffing?



posted on Nov, 4 2012 @ 10:52 AM
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reply to post by Sissel
 


Apparently his recommendation is that we all pretend to work and they pretend to pay us and we give everything they pretend they gave us back to them so that everyone pretends they have the same amount of everything...until death do us part, and so forth.

I think that's what he's recommending....because it's the most compassionate and humane thing to do, of course.



posted on Nov, 4 2012 @ 10:52 AM
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Instead of speculating and fear mongering why not educate yourself so you can give more honest and truthful answers on this topic? Our social security fund right now is running at a surplus.



You may have heard we can't afford Social Security. But the facts may surprise you. This video from the National Academy of Social Insurance (www.nasi.org) explains the basics about Social Security, its purpose, who pays for it, who gets it, and what it means to seniors, working families, and children now and in the future.





Khan Academy Explanation of Social Security



edit on 4-11-2012 by newcovenant because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 4 2012 @ 10:54 AM
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Originally posted by newcovenant

Originally posted by Destinyone
reply to post by newcovenant
 


Stop sweating...you'll never be paying for me...maybe a boatload of other people...but, not me Bubba....

Des


Hindsight is 20/20. Foresight...not so much.



The more I read your posts in this thread. The more I think you are actually worried the line of people, filling the slot machine, will end before you get to stand in front of the SS slot machine....just sayin'....

Des



posted on Nov, 4 2012 @ 10:55 AM
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reply to post by Destinyone
 


I agree. I think it's personal fear. I'm not scared. Are you?



posted on Nov, 4 2012 @ 10:55 AM
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SS is basically government control and a piggy bank to borrow from. But really the post was as much about how ignorant society has become as it was SS.. To fix this we need education reform at the bare minimum. With the technology we have today we can stop holding brilliant students back just so the slower students can keep up. Agenda based education is rampant in America and has to stop. Voters are being brainwashed by media outlets. Left/Right. They all do it. I do not want government controlled media but there needs to be change somehow.



posted on Nov, 4 2012 @ 10:56 AM
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reply to post by newcovenant
 


Yes there is no guarantee. There is no guarantee in life, no matter how much we want it to be. There is no guarantee that the government decides to just stop paying out Social Security either. As pointed out, it is a tax. You signed no contract with the government when you got your SS card stating you will see a return on your 'investment'.



posted on Nov, 4 2012 @ 10:56 AM
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reply to post by newcovenant
 


Heres the FACTS.


The fund that helps finance benefits for 44 million senior citizens and survivors of deceased workers will be exhausted by 2035, the program’s trustees said in an annual report yesterday. Aid would have to be cut at that point if Congress doesn’t intervene.



Social Security Fund to Run Out in 2035, Trustees Say

Because Government managing "our" money, does such a great Job........................






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