Abortion - Free Will and Responsibility of Women, NOT Mankind

Originally posted by windword
reply to post by GideonFaith

 

But this information isn't correct. DNA isn't a person. Every living thing has it's own DNA. DNA is merely a set of instructions, not the thing itself.

Additionally, twinning can occur from one egg. The whole process of twinning invalidates the whole personage theory, as both twins same the same DNA.

edit on 28-11-2012 by windword because: (no reason given)

You need to slow down Windword, your words are getting all messed up. I'm not sure what post you are referring to about DNA.

Originally posted by SplitInfinity
reply to post by GideonFaith

 

The idea that Sentience exists at the point of conception is beyond stupid.

The video was a Hard Watch as it is Pro-Life Propaganda that is way over the top. I find it just as stupid.

Split Infinity

Since we are being cordial and polite to each other. I think the whole when does sentience start, end or exist is just beyond stupid!

Pro-Choice is just another selfish act. No matter how you spin it.

reply to post by GideonFaith


Yes, I can see that you, and the people who's arguments you support, don't need to get tied up with fact checkers, or college text books from universities like Yale and their scholarly professors, to go ahead and spout off erroneous facts as if it's unequivocal truth.

By the way, this isn't a private or a closed discussion. Anyone can reply, correct, challenge or agree with anyone, here on ATS.

reply to post by GideonFaith

Why do you think it is stupid?
Split Infinity

Originally posted by SplitInfinity
reply to post by Quadrivium

 

I have repeated this several times and I feel we are just going around in a circle.

A Fertilized Egg is a form of Human Life so is a Sperm or Egg or Skin Cells or Blood Cells...etc...

What it is not is a HUMAN BEING. It is not even a Potential Human Being until it is implanted into the uterine wall. So it cannot be assigned as a Human Being until late in the Pregnancy when it achieves Sentience.

Split Infinity

These are just YOUR BELIEFS.
They are not fact.
They prove nothing.

Originally posted by windword
reply to post by GideonFaith

 

These opinions are completely rooted in emotional blackmail. They're filled with lies and misrepresented science.

Champions for a fetus's right to life often claim that the brain of a
human fetus begins to show electrical activity at a remarkably early age.
A key moment in the history of the abortion debate is the production and
release of "The Silent Scream," an influential abortion film that
graphically depicts the fetal response to its termination. The video
accompanies the abortion of a 12-week-old fetus with the words "Now this
little person at twelve weeks is a fully formed absolutely identifiable
human being. He has had brain waves for at least six weeks..." (Morowitz
and Trefil 1992).

Although such arguments appeal to both the emotion by
depicting an infant, though still developing, in a moment of pain and
crisis and the intellect by presenting a scientific line of reasoning, the
position presented by the film conflicts widely accepted developmental
theory. For instance, the film contends that a fetus has brain waves after
12 weeks and suggest, even in the title "The Silent Scream," that it
reacts to its termination with fear and pain. These contentions contradict
scientific evidence that indicates neural connections in the cerebral
cortex have yet to develop in a 12-week-old fetus. Lacking these basic
neural networks, the developing fetus is incapable of feeling the emotions
recognized as fear or pain (Morowitz and Trefil 1992).

The film's position is further contrasted by evidence that suggests a 12-week-old fetus is not
yet capable to take direct actions in response to a thought. The
developing fetus is therefore incapable of recognizing potential danger
and unable to either be fearful of it or actively evade it through
movement or any other willful activity (Morowitz and Trefil 1992).
(For information concerning how photographs of the embryo are often
misrepresented on anti-abortion literature and websites, see Images of
Embryos Used by Anti-Abortion Activists.)
biology.franklincollege.edu...

Are you ok? I didn't post anything like this. Since you left no link, I have no idea where you got this from. Seriously, are you ok???

reply to post by GideonFaith

Pro-Choice is just another selfish act. No matter how you spin it.

Pro-choice is not an act. It's a political position.

reply to post by Quadrivium

They are not just my beliefs.

They are also the beliefs of the Supreme Court as well as the beliefs of the Majority of Americans.

This information has been stated as FACT by most Scientists and Doctors. Those apposed to this FACT are in the Minority. Split Infinity

Originally posted by windword
reply to post by GideonFaith


You said it below, anyone can post!! I didn't need to fact check whether they were right wing, left wing, religious, atheist, GOP, etc. If they are supporting what I believe, then yes, I will post it. No where does it state on ATS that I can't post that from an external site. Like I said before if you believe everything in textbooks or every so called professor, then you have a long way to go still. If I can remember right, Yale is left wing? Yeah, they are! Whoa! Does that mean they lean more toward the liberals??

Yes, I can see that you, and the people who's arguments you support, don't need to get tied up with fact checkers, or college text books from universities like Yale and their scholarly professors, to go ahead and spout off erroneous facts as if it's unequivocal truth.

I think I know that! I was being a smart a$$!! That wasn't very religious of me! That may break your image of me!!

By the way, this isn't a private or a closed discussion. Anyone can reply, correct, challenge or agree with anyone, here on ATS.

This whole post we are doing is so off topic!

reply to post by GideonFaith


Yes you did. You posted quotes from people who are claiming that there is sentience from conception. You posted a pro-life video of twins supposedly interacting and laughing to prove your point.

The article posted in response was already posted in this thread was C&P. The source is pasted at the bottom of the quote. Ooops, you actually have to manually C&P it into an address bar in search window!

If you want to follow what posts are being answered and followed up, just click on the bold "Reply To" to see.

Originally posted by SplitInfinity
reply to post by GideonFaith

 

Why do you think it is stupid?
Split Infinity

You thought my belief was stupid, right? Yeah, you did. I will quote it if you need me too. I believe your belief is stupid. Really simple. You can read above the you tube video again for my opinions on what your belief is for sentience. You can watch the video again too to get what I believe your definition of sentient means.

reply to post by GideonFaith

I will ask again. Why do you think it is stupid?

Split Infinity

I believe that abortion is a woman's choice i as a man do not have the right to tell a woman what she can and can not do with her body that would not be right on my part! We should really not encourage it but we shouldnt throw a fit because a rape victim wants to get rid of there child that's there choice just chimming in i mean no dissrespect

Originally posted by windword
reply to post by GideonFaith

 

Pro-Choice is just another selfish act. No matter how you spin it.

Pro-choice is not an act. It's a political position.

I don't see political in these definitions. I do see an organization or pressure group supporting the right of a woman to have an abortion. I see Pro-Choice and abortion as being a selfish action.

pro-choice (pr-chois) adj. Favoring or supporting the legal right of women and girls to choose whether or not to continue a pregnancy to term. pro-choicer n.

The American Heritage® Dictionary of the English Language, Fourth Edition copyright ©2000 by Houghton Mifflin Company. Updated in 2009. Published by Houghton Mifflin Company. All rights reserved.

pro-choice
adj
(Sociology) (of an organization, pressure group, etc.) supporting the right of a woman to have an abortion

Collins English Dictionary – Complete and Unabridged © HarperCollins Publishers 1991, 1994, 1998, 2000, 2003

www.thefreedictionary.com...

Originally posted by windword
reply to post by GideonFaith

 

Yes you did. You posted quotes from people who are claiming that there is sentience from conception. You posted a pro-life video of twins supposedly interacting and laughing to prove your point.

The article posted in response was already posted in this thread was C&P. The source is pasted at the bottom of the quote. Ooops, you actually have to manually C&P it into an address bar in search window!

If you want to follow what posts are being answered and followed up, just click on the bold "Reply To" to see.

You can spin it anyway you want. I did not post that, you did. I posted quotes from people, not what you posted. You definitely did not watch the video because you have no clue what it is all about.

OOOPPSS!! You are actually suppose to put a link that you can directly take you to your external content.

You are so cordial and polite, thank you for your NOT needed instructions.

Originally posted by SplitInfinity
reply to post by GideonFaith

 

I will ask again. Why do you think it is stupid?

Split Infinity

Answered already, NEXT!

Originally posted by SplitInfinity
reply to post by Quadrivium

 

They are not just my beliefs.

They are also the beliefs of the Supreme Court as well as the beliefs of the Majority of Americans.

This information has been stated as FACT by most Scientists and Doctors. Those apposed to this FACT are in the Minority. Split Infinity

The majority of people on ATS ride purple ponies to work.
We can say anything.
Where is your proof to back up your claims?

The Supreme Court? How many scientist sit on the Supreme Court? How many medical doctors?
My point is this.
Yes sperm is life, from the father.
Yes the egg is life, from the mother.
When they meet, A new life is formed. It is no longer the life of the mother or father. It is a separate unique life.
Do you disagree?

Everyone that you have ever met, spoken to or just looked at have at least one thing in common.
Each and everyone started out as a fertilized egg. It is the first step in a humans development.
Do you disagree?

Originally posted by kover27
I believe that abortion is a woman's choice i as a man do not have the right to tell a woman what she can and can not do with her body that would not be right on my part! We should really not encourage it but we shouldnt throw a fit because a rape victim wants to get rid of there child that's there choice just chimming in i mean no dissrespect

By all means, join the party.

reply to post by Skyfloating

Abortions have been around forever. But at different points of time in history it has received attention for differing reasons,some in support of it, but often against it.Abortion is primarily a health concern of women but it is increasingly being governed by patriarchal interests which more often than not curb the freedom of women to seek abortion as a right.In present times with the entire focus of women’s health being on her reproduction, in fact preventing or terminating it, abortion practice becomes a critical issue. Given the official perspective of understanding abortion within the context of contraception, it is important to review abortion and abortion practice in detail.. Here is the link to my research article where you can find the detailed analysis, surveys and results of my research on Abortion practice in India.
uk.docsity.com...

reply to post by naachiz


Hi!

First of all, Welcome to ATS. You're quite brave making your first steps into the ATS community in an abortion forum. They can be quite contentious and combative.

I would love to read your paper, but it seems to be a "members only" access. I think it's the same problem these scientists, who were trying to share their knowledge, ran up against, and complained about in this post:

Originally posted by Bedlam

Originally posted by Phagette

You know what really bums me out? Having access to all kinds of very good scientific literature (on all kinds of subjects) but it is all copyrighted. I can download the pdfs because I am affiliated with a university that has that various subscriptions, but I can't just link to the articles because they are for-pay for everyone else (frowny emoticon here that I will someday learn how to embed). Someday I'll write a thread on the topic because it really bothers me, but for now I'll cheat a little:

Hear! Hear!

We've got subscriptions to the bigger archives at work, but most ATSers can only read abstracts, because who in their right minds are going to pay $35 for the article?

I vote that ATS subscribe to maybe JSTOR and Science Direct (could probably think of others but those two have a lot of stuff) as an "online university" and add us all on as users. Well, not me, but you know, the normal guys here. www.abovetopsecret.com...

Perhaps, you could "cheat a little" and cut and paste some of the main talking points that you would like to introduce to the discussion.

Contraception is an important part of the abortion discussion, as many fertilized eggs are prevented from embedding in the process of many varieties of birth control and cause abortion.

It continues to be a frustrating topic to enter, in these debates, as the focus seems to be on arguing for or against the premise that a fertilized egg is a person.

Looking forward to your continued input in this thread and other forums on the ATS boards!

Warm welcome.