Obama and Romney are essentially good men

When you have half of the people demonize Obama and another half demonize Romney and the rest demonize both Presidents, I guess seeing both as essentially good is the real minority-viewpoint. Contemporary popular culture likes to rake up dirt on either candidate and those who like to appear unpartial will rake up dirt on both, but I have my doubts about these two guys being truly bad at heart. I wonder how long we have been at a point to speak of our Presidents and Candidates the way hostile enemies might view them...as thoroughly evil and unworthy.

I think that in their own way they would like to do a good job and do what they think is best for the country. I think the public is overestimating their abilities and powers to create change. I think that being President or Candidate is hard work. They are doing what they think is right given while there is a constant onslaught of calls for attention, attempted bribery and criticism in their direction.

Yes, they do need to be criticized now and then but I think that the culture of demonizing them day in, day out, is not good for the country, not supportive of our overall values and goals as a nation. And I realize 99% will angrily disagree. But at least I said it.

I agree with you. I'd like for people to evaluate the policies available to them through the candidates, and vote on which they think best. These men are just men, and they have families.

show me proof their even humans!
or their family members are!


clones and lizzards!

I dont agree with the OP , i think Romney is a pathetic little worm for using the "hurricane" as an excuse to gain brownie points , and i think Obama is the scum of the earth for his actions since he took office.

I also think anyone who does not VOTE RON PAUL is ignorant. If you want America to be what it is supposed to be , then why turn your back on the constitution ? it makes no sense .

I feel like i woke up in the big empty and i`m surrounded by lobotomites. (Fallout )
...
EDIT : tinhattribunal

Hitler, Mao, and Stalin probably thought what they were doing was best for their people too.

Now, I'm not trying to compare Obama and Romney to those guys. That would be very excessive, I'm just pointing out that people that commit "evil" acts, generally do not think what they are doing is bad. They might mean well, but they start making compromises, a little here a little there. To get done their "good" plans. But after some time they can begin to justify any atrocity. All the while believing they are still good men.

Thanks for that! I could not agree more.

It is quite sad to see all the slamming of the candidates here on ATS and other places. I actually feel that both these guys are legitimate heroes of America, and both are worthy of presiding as the executive officer and figurehead of the USA.

I think that every single person here -- if they could spend just one short evening with the candidate they detest the most -- would walk away from that encounter amazed and ashamed for all their poisonous thoughts.

Take a look at the topics on page one here. Are you kidding me? Is that who we really are?

Maybe distrust and hatred are just a deep part of human nature -- I don't want to judge my fellow ATSers to harshly. Obviously, that would be hypocritical of me.

Originally posted by Axial Leader
Thanks for that! I could not agree more.

It is quite sad to see all the slamming of the candidates here on ATS and other places. I actually feel that both these guys are legitimate heroes of America, and both are worthy of presiding as the executive officer and figurehead of the USA.

I think that every single person here -- if they could spend just one short evening with the candidate they detest the most -- would walk away from that encounter amazed and ashamed for all their poisonous thoughts.

Take a look at the topics on page one here. Are you kidding me? Is that who we really are?

Maybe distrust and hatred are just a deep part of human nature -- I don't want to judge my fellow ATSers to harshly. Obviously, that would be hypocritical of me.

Sorry but , Obama got a nobel peace prize for nothing , then bombed libya back to the stone age ...... Romney is a money sucking leech who wants nothing but more money ..... how can you say the word hero when speaking about these men ?

I can honestly tell you that Obama , your president , is Osama Bin Laden .... and i will stand by that until i am six feet under . That is not hatred , that my friend , is common sense and a keene eye , something the system rapes out of everyone before they can think for themselves. I`d like to say that i`m not "attacking" you for that post , i am simply voicing my opinion as i think it would have been over looked by many people if i did not pull you up on it.

Please could you tell me what makes Obama a hero ?
Please could you tell me what makes Romney a hero ?

Originally posted by watchitburn
Hitler, Mao, and Stalin probably thought what they were doing was best for their people too. But after some time they can begin to justify any atrocity. All the while believing they are still good men.

Your point is well made. But I would say that there is a big difference between the leaders you cite above, and what we have right now: Hitler, Mao and Stalin were autocrats who seized absolute power, mainly by exploiting and leveraging human hatred.

What we currently have is more moderate. Although, unchecked hatred (such as we see glimpses of right now) could absolutely lead to a harsh autocratic ruler like the ones you list.

They both have their agendas. I'm not sure whether I should fault them for not understanding how evil their agendas are, as they have both undergone a lifetime of brainwashing.

I think Obama would make a decent nextdoor neighbor. I think Romney would park his big-a$$ Lincoln Navigator in my spot....

Good observation Sky.

I agree with you for the most part, however the way I interpret presidency is much different than most. I don't view them as being powerful at all, in fact I see them at the bottom of government power. This makes them irrelevant in my eyes, when they allegedly have less secret clearance than some government officials.

I just don't buy into the idea that they are pulling the strings. Rather I think they are more or less Hate Sponges. Someone has to be accountable, someone has to be to blame. Well what a great idea, instead of blaming departments - branches, and government organizations --- we just put all our anger towards one man: The President.

In his oval room, in his rockin' chair
He's the president, but I don't care
He's a business man, he got business ties
He got dollar signs in both his eyes
Got a big airplane, take him everywhere
Got his limousine, when he get there
Everywhere he goes, make the people mad
Makes the poor man beg, and the rich man glad

HERASY!!! There can be only One!!! If everybody thought like that Fox, MSNBC, Limbough, Beck and countless others would be unemployed!! Are you trying to destroy the economy?! Sure, have it your way, outsource our news, created out of thin air, outsource all news to the BBC and RT. Any destroy the thousands of jobs created by hate and punditry. Your going to outsource jobs like Romeny and have them on Obamas welfare roles.

Originally posted by JeZeus
Please could you tell me what makes Obama a hero ? Please could you tell me what makes Romney a hero ?

Good question! Let me see if I can explain my perspective:

Think about the damage that one average guy, unrestrained, can do to the world with nothing but a credit card, and the will to unleash hatred and destroy. What kind of damage can you do to the world, if you have nothing but anger and desire to hurt someone?

Clearly, these guys (with near unlimited funds and power) could do a lot of damage -- the temptation must exist for them.

But they reject it. They are actually dedicating their lives, their reputations, their personal security -- all of that -- for what they think is just, fair and for the betterment of human kind.

This is dark: but how would you feel right now if the candidate you hate the most suddenly met with an assassin's bullet?

Would you acknowledge then (at least) that candidate -- who you still might disagree with -- was a hero?

Yeah -- I don't agree with these guys on most points. But I fully agree with both of them on some points. And I respect what they are going through, their desires to help this country, and I am not cynical enough to think that their only goal is to immortalize themselves. (Not these two guys anyway.) There exists something more in their characters than simple selfish self-aggrandizement.

I think they are mainly motivated by patriotism. Really. I don't see how it could be otherwise.

Well, OP, you said what you had to say. Fair enough.

However, I cannot agree with you. These are politicians we're talking about here. What politician can go as high as Obama and Romney without being two-faced, saying what people want to hear but not really planning to do anything they promise? Do you honestly think those two don't know which side their bread is buttered?

Who do you think they are beholden to? The poor little serfs at the ballot box, or the mega-corporations and obscenely rich political donors who allow them to run the massive campaigns that the more honest, less well-funded politicans have no hope of being able to compete in?

I make the distinction between whether these are "nice guys", and what they do for a living, which is to lie to the American people, appease their corporate and foreign masters, and sign off on what they are told to.

The worst thing we as a nation can do is confuse the two, but that's exactly what we do, because we're sucked into the cult of personality. Just as people assume that a favorite actor is a nice guy and a moral person, because they like the movies the actor is in, we also tend to assume that these politicians are great guys based on their behavior on the campaign trail.

All public servants need to be held accountable for their actions while on the public payroll. I don't give a hoot-n-holler how nice they are to their families, or how nice they appear while campaigning. ACCOUNTABILITY is what the American people need to demand, and stop worshipping a face because they seem like a nice guy on TV.

They are both soulless


I think the presidents of the US should be forced to give up all possessions and money for 4 years before being eligible for office

They should try living on the working classes wages before that

and middle class before that

then they should each be forced to wander the desert for 1 month with no food just water

Then they will be fit to try their hand at being president

reply to post by Axial Leader


Yes, I addressed that comparing the current candidates to those dictators was excessive.

But as was already stated, they are in fact politicians. The only reason people get into politics is because it is profitable. If they could not gain wealth and power from being a politician, they would be doing something else.

Put all elected officials on minimum wage and see how many stick around. All the rats would jump ship. I would bet that less than 10% would stay. Those would be the ones that actually cared and wanted to fix things.

You know what they say about kids and honesty?

I think this kid has it right

Good question! Let me see if I can explain my perspective:

Think about the damage that one average guy, unrestrained, can do to the world with nothing but a credit card, and the will to unleash hatred and destroy. What kind of damage can you do to the world, if you have nothing but anger and desire to hurt someone?

Clearly, these guys (with near unlimited funds and power) could do a lot of damage -- the temptation must exist for them.

But they reject it. They are actually dedicating their lives, their reputations, their personal security -- all of that -- for what they think is just, fair and for the betterment of human kind.

Please explain how either of these pathetic rats have done anything to better man-kind . If i buy a gun tommorrow - kill 4 people and decide not to kill another 4 am i doing something good ?

This is dark: but how would you feel right now if the candidate you hate the most suddenly met with an assassin's bullet?

Would you acknowledge then (at least) that candidate -- who you still might disagree with -- was a hero?

No , i would see him as a dead man who thought he could buy his way into power , to be brutally honest.

Yeah -- I don't agree with these guys on most points. But I fully agree with both of them on some points. And I respect what they are going through, their desires to help this country, and I am not cynical enough to think that their only goal is to immortalize themselves. (Not these two guys anyway.) There exists something more in their characters than simple selfish self-aggrandizement.

I think they are mainly motivated by patriotism. Really. I don't see how it could be otherwise.

Well , i do not agree with either of them on anything , they both KNOW what the agenda is and no matter who wins the election they will continue to cripple the economies of the world and force the weak dollar upon everyone else.

What exists in their characters which is more than "simple self-aggrandizement" ? ... because i fail to see it with my eye , which is rather sharp if i may say so myself.

Patriotism is terrorism these days , the people who defend their own land with their own blood are classed as insurgents and terrorists , when infact , the military that is INVADING are the insurgents.

We saw this in Iraq , Afghan , Libya and currently Syria.

Originally posted by MrWendal
You know what they about kids and honesty?

I think this kid has it right

Hahaha that saying is a terrible lie

kids are the most selfish, cruel, liars on the planet

Its a developmental thing though they cant help it

reply to post by Axial Leader


I don't think that is a valid argument.

If a President ever tried going full bore evil dictator one of 4 things would happen.

1. The House and Senate would have them impeached and arrested.

2. The military would remove him.

3. The people would revolt violently.

4. He would be assassinated.

The way the system is set up now, everyone gets poorer and less free, and It's because that is what the people are choosing.

It's brilliant really.

reply to post by watchitburn


Exactly.

Who runs around saying, "Ooooh, I wonder what EVIL thing I can do next! Hahaha!"

I agree that people that do evil things have a warped mental view of the world. They themselves don't feel that what they are doing is "evil" at all.

And, who wants to be evil anyway. Everybody knows good always wins!