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Why do you think that the origin of UFOs is Extra-terrestrial?

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posted on Nov, 1 2012 @ 04:05 PM
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Originally posted by AQuestion
reply to post by The Shrike
 


Dear The Shrike,

I will play.

1. Do you think UFOs are crafts?
They may or not be, they are physical manifestations of a consciousness at work in the universe.
2. If you do, why are there such a variety of shapes?
Each may manifest themselves as they will and in fact many observations of UFOs show them changing their physical characteristics.
3. Do you think that if UFOs are craft, do they contain beings which would pilot the alleged craft?
Again, physical manifestations of sentience.
4. Would you consider UFOs as remotely operated vehicles and if you do, where would their
controlers be located?
No, I consider them as being directly operated and part of the sentience that is manifesting them.
5. Why do you think UFOs are extra-terrestrial and what do you base it on?
This gets tricky. I don't see them as from being from other planets or natural beings that came to being from other planets; but, they may have visited them. It is a big playground out there and worthy of observation.
6. Can you provide any evidence for your opinions?
Yes, but nobody has anything definitive.
7. If you do not have any evidence, then you must be employing a belief system so what led you to
your beliefs?

I cannot say I am employing one believe system. I believe in science and I believe in God and I believe that my observation of my experience is the only thing that I can know for sure.


Interesting thinking but I see a dichotomy, without meaning to insult, in your sentence: "I believe in science and I believe in God..." I say a dichotomy because science cannot prove the reality of god so you are at odds with reality. Science achieves results. God is a human construction and history proves it so.

If you've been fortunate to have had a non-questionable UFO sighting then your experience gives you the edge of not having to depend on beliefs as you have transcended them. Experience is always the best teacher. But while some have replied that they have seen UFOs vanish which I question because a UFO can move faster than we can perceive so it's super acceleration can appear to be a vanishing act. But for a UFO to vanish means that it has to leave our physical dimension and "reappear" in another dimension, a topic best left for a separate thread. I don't accept reports of humans interacting with alleged UFO occupants because we don't know if UFOs have beings inside them.

Regarding UFOs all we have is that they are real but that's all we know, presently.




posted on Nov, 1 2012 @ 04:12 PM
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Originally posted by ladyteeny
seeing as how i'm actually awake at this ridiculous time of the morning i'll answer those!

1. yes i believe some of them are crafts.
2. variety of shapes because, like our modes of transport over the years, they evolve or get upgraded.
3. i think some are piloted craft and some aren't. like our planes, and our mars rovers.
4. some yes, they're either programmed internally, or controlled from afar... if from afar then either their home world, or another craft somewhere, i've seen them go from solid visible to invisible so i don't think its out of the question to suppose that some could be invisible.
5. i think some are extra terrestrial and i base it on my own communications with them once.
6. nope, can anybody?
7. yes. aviation background, eyes that have seen manoeuvres that aren't possible with our current understanding of physics, and communication.

as an add on, i believe there are multiple races of ET, i thought that before the internet existed and before ufos were as widely reported as they are now.

obviously discounting the earth-made craft, whether they're from inner earth, the moon, mars, jupiter, or some far away distant place we haven't yet discovered, i believe most of them are from somewhere else. i can't rule out the inner earth theory for some of them, and i can't rule out the theory of underwater bases for some of them.. but i don't believe that is for all of them.

in short, i've seen loads and loads of ufos, i don't believe that our current civilisation is anything to do with them due to the nature of their movements and abilities.

wonder how many people are going to call us nutjobs now!


I am a student of the mind and I am constantly surprised as to the extent of how people come to their conclusions but neverthless I love surprises.


Your answer to 5 is intriguing. (5. i think some are extra terrestrial and i base it on my own communications with them once.) Myself and am sure other members would like to read about your experience if you'll grace us with it.



posted on Nov, 1 2012 @ 04:18 PM
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Originally posted by The Shrike
Let me qualify myself first: I do not believe UFOs are real, I know UFOs are real from first-hand experience after having 5 or 6 solid sightings and I do not think that they are extra-terrestrial..

Where are UFOs from? I have no idea. But since no evidence has been produced I cannot support such an opinion. And if I don't have evidence I don't make nor support claims, regardless.

Now, let me ask you simple questions:
1. Do you think UFOs are crafts?
2. If you do, why are there such a variety of shapes?
3. Do you think that if UFOs are craft, do they contain beings which would pilot the alleged craft?
4. Would you consider UFOs as remotely operated vehicles and if you do, where would their
controlers be located?
5. Why do you think UFOs are extra-terrestrial and what do you base it on?
6. Can you provide any evidence for your opinions?
7. If you do not have any evidence, then you must be employing a belief system so what led you to
your beliefs?




1. Yes, I believe they very well could be crafts, since many eyewitnesses describe them as such.
2. It's not unusual to me that they would have a variety of shapes, since there are a variety of shapes to known crafts already.
3. Yes, I believe it was a good idea to look at UFOs like crafts piloted by beings. Seems logical to deduce.
4. Yes, I believe that some sightings claim there were very small crafts coming out of larger crafts.
5. It seems most likely they are extra-terrestrial since no base, or home has been found on earth.
6. I believe the eye-witness reports are very strong evidence, and some sightings have radar corroboration, as well. But the strength of multiple witnesses, and individual witnesses has always made the subject of UFOs to be more of a reality than a myth, to me.
7. It's the same belief system I have for believing whether or not some historical person, or event occurred in the past. There is enough evidence for me to believe Julius Caesar existed, even though I don't have his bones in front of me, never knew him, and can never know for sure. I believe there is enough evidence already to believe that sightings/encounters with alien crafts have happened.



posted on Nov, 1 2012 @ 04:19 PM
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Originally posted by liejunkie01
Until I have absolute proof,

I believe that they are some black project aircraft.

Countries of the world spend a lot of money on r and d. I think that they have a little bit more than radio controlled drones in the hanger.

It sounds more logical than a being from another planet visiting us. I think that the governments want us to believe it is alien.

Just my opinion.


How can you believe that we are so advanced technologically that we are responsible for even one of the aerial wonders that are called UFOs? How can you believe that there are such real black projects. On what do you opinion? It isn't just simple r and d, there has to be a source. All human aerial craft are limited by the laws of aerodynamics and I've never seen nor heard of the laws being overcome. I do not share your opinion that governments wants us to think anything other than that they care for their citizens which is as big a myth as you can imagine.



posted on Nov, 1 2012 @ 04:23 PM
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Originally posted by Night Star
snip
That's what I was going to say pretty much. There have been reports of UFO's long before the first airoplane was even built. Someone must be piloting those things.


Yours is a simple assumption. You know what's in the latest news, that drones are the order of the day. Anyone not familiar with how drones operate may also assume that there's someone inside them unless they see a drone on the ground and see its real small size not allowing for a "normal" human, although animals and small people have been employed as passengers.

The only way for centainty is to have a "THE DAY THE EARTH STOOD STILL" moment similar to when Michael Rennie stepped out of the craft. But if the craft is a ROV, no one is going to step out.

edit on 1-11-2012 by The Shrike because: Comment addition.



posted on Nov, 1 2012 @ 04:38 PM
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Originally posted by Zarniwoop
1. Do you think UFOs are crafts?
- Yes

2. If you do, why are there such a variety of shapes?
- Design diversity amongst manufacturers. And... most pics are fakes anyway.

3. Do you think that if UFOs are craft, do they contain beings which would pilot the alleged craft?
- Some yes. Some no. Depends upon whether they are in test or production.

4. Would you consider UFOs as remotely operated vehicles and if you do, where would their
controlers be located?
- Sure... the ones being tested...Controllers are probably located at military facilities.

5. Why do you think UFOs are extra-terrestrial and what do you base it on?
- I don't think they are ET for the most part. I suppose there is a possibility of some ET tech used, whether that was reverse-engineered from a crash, or passed to humans via some other method.

6. Can you provide any evidence for your opinions?
- The one and only one I ever saw back in 1973 was in the vicinity of Vandenberg AFB.


2. What manufacturers? While an unknown percentage of UFO images are fakes, I accept that a large percentage are not. Eventually, with all of those cellphone apps continuing to increase in numbers, that large percentage will become less and less.

3. & 4. Do your answers mean that you consider all UFOs to be human constructed? Military projects only? If yes, where did this miraculous technology come from? Are all UFO sightings of test craft? Is it possible for anyone connected with these projects able to maintain 100% silence?

5. If the test craft may have been reverse-engineered or the technology gotten from an "alien" source, how do you tell the difference from "our" and "their" craft?

6. You had a UFO sighting, was it detailed enough to be able to tell the difference between "ours" and "theirs"?



posted on Nov, 1 2012 @ 04:41 PM
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Although there are many thoroughly investigated UFO incidents, one incident I hold as the smoking gun to the existence of extraterrestrials and their vehicles is the Travis Walton case. Five witnesses who have all passed polygraph tests who have never wavered from their stories til this day, is proof to me that UFO's are extraterrestrial. Their personal testimonies even today, still evokes emotional responses from them.

Other multiple witness cases such as the Allagash incident, The Rendlesham Forest UFO Landings, The Stanford, Kentucky Abductions. These multiple witness & abduction accounts are validation that not all UFO's can be easily explained as being man made.



posted on Nov, 1 2012 @ 04:44 PM
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1. Yes, they are crafts as we understand. Others such as orbs, are like drones.
2.Different origin.
3.Some are like drones as we know today. So much more advanced.
4.At origin,or bases set up from moon, mars, even deep sea earth. I have lately began to feel some use a dimension shift..
5. Our known current technology can not match observed movement, speed, even to simply vanish as we know.
6. No
7.Yes, I feel a belief in intelligent life form outside earth. If so, this could be so ancient,so advanced beyond our current technology and understanding. I do not feel we will be around long enough to develop time travel. Its not "us" we see.



posted on Nov, 1 2012 @ 05:18 PM
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Originally posted by chadderson

1. I define a UFO as a many would, an unidentified flying object. The majority of reports indicate a metallic structure, so based on a 'hard outer case' design i presume they would be crafts.

2. Obviously because there are many ways to fly, just as there are to move across land or water.

3. Crafts that are piloted are just as plausible as remotely operated crafts, or even AI crafts.

4. If they were remotely operated perhaps they come from inside of our earth rather than outer space.

5. Now that i think about it, the only reason i associated UFO's with 'outer space ET's' is because of cultural programming. I suppose one could be equally creative in envisioning an inner earth entity. Current theories about an inner earth form of life are just as plausible as any outer space life forms.

6. Life exists on all levels, all planes, all dimensions, or whatever label one would like to use.... there is nothing in creation, nothing that we can witness as human beings, that is not living. Death is often misinterpreted as the end, when it is merely a transition to more life. The body that holds our electric essence is one plane/dimension/level that we experience. I believe there is life out there because we already know it exists on a level we can see with our own eyes all the way down to so small microscopes must be used, all the way down to the building blocks of our reality. There is a universal pattern and it goes downwards in perspective just as it does upwards. The levels of consciousness and life in the cosmos is tough to interpret because it outlives us as human beings, which limits our perspective and scope of understanding; whereas on the microscopic level we can watch thousands of lifespans of a cell unfold in a matter of human minutes. There is life out there, but when we are conditioned to look for a specific thing to label 'ET / UFO / Life form' we automatically limit what we are able to see. I believe there is a higher power. I think labels confuse people, because i have often told people that i believe in "god" but i dont really know what to call it to be honest. I do know it exists, and i have experienced enough of it that i can wholeheartedly have faith in it.

7. My old beliefs of UFO's and "green aliens" were certainly from cultural conditioning. My current beliefs are based almost entirely on the feelings, emotions, daydreams, and thoughts that I encountered when I experimented with a...and without infringing upon ATS terms and conditions i will only use a vague and harmless label to identify.... naturally growing from mother earth hallucinogenic substance. I had so many things happen all at once, and the sheer gravity of how the events impacted my heart and soul, that i determined there was no such thing as a 'coincidence'. The higher power revealed itself to me.

Thank you for reading, I hope you found my thoughts entertaining!
edit on 1-11-2012 by chadderson because: (no reason given)


I found your thoughts entertaining and educational which helped me think differently and that's always a plus.

1. A metallic-skin is an assumption as there have been many reports of plasma, etc., although metallic resonates with us due to the majority of our aircraft but fiberglass also is used as well as other exotic materials.

2. Interesting comparison.

3. But they are still a mystery and not all UFOs may use the same propulsive power. Our helicopters can hover but they can't accelerate as fast as some UFOs have been reported to do. My "stars" sighting was one of these.

4. Which of course means someone, somewhere controlling them and where on earth could they "hang out"? Least of all is, of course, their purpose in the first place. You know the mystery is not just the "nuts and bolts" but who or what is behind them. I'd hate to die and not know the possible answer.

5. You supplied the answer to the thread's question! It's cultural programming! This is also the main answer to the Roswell incident. Both sources have to be considered but only as discussion 'cause no one knows yet if they are from "in here" or "out there".

6. Without insulting your intelligence your belief in god is the result of cutltural programming or, better put, mental conditioning. History supports that all gods are human creations from the Egyptians to the Aztec, and before and after.

7. Coincidences are a part of life since nothing is preordained. My intake also helped me to understand how the mind works but the internal world is definitely separate from physical reality. UFOs are part of that physical reality and my dream UFOs behave totally different and creating emotions I didn't get when I had my physical sightings.



posted on Nov, 1 2012 @ 05:25 PM
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reply to post by The Shrike
 


I am a christian lady and I know that UFO's are real.
UFO's are inter-dimensional,not extra-terrestrial.



posted on Nov, 1 2012 @ 05:32 PM
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Originally posted by sir_slide
reply to post by The Shrike
 


UFO's are unidentified things in the sky. Let's work from this point of view. Obviously there is technology being used (as far as our current paradigm dictates). I don't personally believe that our militaries have the kind of technology that the things appearing in our skies have, SO a decent percentage of them must come from ELSEWHERE, as far as the process of elimination goes.

They are obviously here, as you are aware, but why? Well that is explained in many places, but that may not satisfy your need for 'evidence'.

Looking at right brain issues with a left brain perspective doesnt help i have found, you need to think outside of our current paradigm, push the limits of understanding.

But more to the point, if they're not made on earth, which i certainly dont believe they are, then they MUST be ET. What other conclusion can one come to? Also this is looking at it from a very limited perspective, as personally I believe they are from other DIMENSIONS. The shapes of the craft may just be different designs from different planets, who knows, although what I personally know and understand is that MANY different races and people are visiting our planet and checking on us, this could explain the different shapes.

You need to look outside of what you think you know, its far more interesting than any of us can even begin to comprehend.

Peace Shrike


Good thinking but we all do have our differences which led me to start this thread. I agree with your process of elimination. But I do not agree that we know why they're here, I don't think anyone does. I haven't found any plausible explanations and I would not consider what is advanced as evidence, just opinions and assumptions. You can only process what your brain has been taught to understand. UFOs are out of understanding and I consider them similar to death. Some explain what they think happens after death and some try to explain the reality of UFOs. I don't know and I don't accept anyone's explanations.

If UFOs are not made on earth by earthlings one cannot make the jump that they must, therefore, be extraterrestrial as from far, far away. Theories are all we have but the ET is by far the one most "out there"!

Surprisingly, based on what earthlings have learned about the different dimensions that have been discovered - and I would guess there are many more still to be discovered as we evolve - before I accept the ET theory I favor that UFOs in all of their variety probably originate from other dimensions and not necessarily connected with the future. Although they could be from the future which explains why there is no interaction with earthlings regardless of claims of such especially abductions.



posted on Nov, 1 2012 @ 05:43 PM
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Originally posted by K-PAX-PROT
Until there is evidence produced that proves or justifies that there is NO possible possibility of any UFOs having an ET origin then that possibility remains valid until proven otherwise.Premature rejections of the ET possibility ,(or an ET intelligence having the technology to visit us), at our current understanding is not a wise mind set to have or indeed the perception of no possibilities is not a scientific protocol i would encourage.

I just find it really arrogant and indeed unwise to prejudge such possibilities of ET origins for how can we come to such pre mature judgements does suggest agendas of debunking at any cost, even it means ignoring the wealth of evidence outside the "UFO landing on the Whitehouse lawn" situation of those UFO cases that contain high levels of strangeness unexplainable flight characteristics ect, if there was none of the latter then maybe there would be a case of no possible ET origins but there ARE. Offer proof or evidence that there is no possibility of ET intelligences behind even just one UFO report until then the ET possibility stands , "extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence" that works also to for the claims of no possible ET origins. The ET source stands as one of a number of explanations and at present cannot be removed from that list.
edit on 15/07/2010 by K-PAX-PROT because: (no reason given)


In my opinion you are partially correct. I am pragmatic which is why I reject UFOs as being extra-terrestrial 'cause all we have are strange aerial objects which are not the result of our present technology. My view may seem arrogant to some but I've lived on planet Earth for 74 years and all I've ever seen are earthlings. The ETH is a human creation based on a romantic notion. Until someone or something disembarks from a landed UFO (now just an O) I won't change my mind.

The only link of UFOs to ETs is that they have been seen and filmed flitting over the surface of the moon and on some Martian videos. But no evidence of real deep space origins.



posted on Nov, 1 2012 @ 05:49 PM
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Originally posted by spiritualarchitect
reply to post by The Shrike
 


1. AFV [Alien Flying Vehicles] are craft.
2. Like a typical aircraft carrier, there are multiple shaped craft to do a variety of task.
There may also be multiple species visiting, which means even more variety.
3. They would be pilot driven.
4. There may be small drone type craft flying around. These would be controlled by ET’s based in our oceans as well as underground. They would also have bases on the Moon and Mars. ET is here. They do not spend all their time flying back and forth.
5. Because humans cannot make or fly craft such as those seen.
6. Seeing is believing, but that won’t help you. So here is a refresher:

Take the Battle of Los Angeles for example in 1942. People saw up to 25 silvery UFO’s over the city that night. One of them, either having trouble or playing Guinea Pig to test air defenses, hung in the air for an extended length of time. Balloons and dirigibles are among the easiest things in the air to destroy, so we can count that out because not only did the UFO change directions and go against the wind, but this UFO was fired upon over and over and took multiple hits while over the city. Unlike a balloon which would have been shredded, none of the hits brought it down. In fact it came back again to offer more target practice. So here we have an aircraft that can withstand antiaircraft fire and fly slow enough to take all the recon photos one could want and maybe the option to deliver pin point bombing.

Or how about Mount Rainer, 1947, where nine flying saucers were clocked doing 1,800 miles an hour. Even at Arnold’s toned down 1,200 mph that is still much faster than anything the US had flying at the time.

If these were American secret aircraft, what happened to them? If you look at saucer sightings from the 40’s you will find saucer technology that can hover in place and take off at terrific speeds, all without making much of a sound.

Have you seen a car from the 1940’s? Do you realize how old, slow and ungainly they look compared to what is driven today? Where are these military aircraft that could hover silently as well as travel at a thousand miles an hour? Where are they today? What museum are they in? What are their names and numbers? Where are the missing hot shot pilots who flew them?

Or have these saucers been updated like the B52? Would the military really put tons of money into updating a design from the 1940’s? If so, why does the military fly junk like the Nighthawk and B2 when in the 40’s they were flying saucers that were much superior to both? Why spend millions of dollars to fly a stealth fighter when a 40’s saucer could fly circles around it?

Neither the Nighthawk, the Blackbird, or the U2 have UFO flight characteristics and cannot account for UFO sightings. But like the Aurora [named after the 1897 UFO crash], the US military does have secret aircraft, but all of these aircraft are alien tech, taken from the saucer crashes of the 40’s, 50’s and 60’s. Those saucers seen flying in the skies 70 years ago were being flown by beings from another planet.

Secret military craft are not responsible for sightings such as saucers, cigars and triangles.


Thanks for the history lesson.


I've been a UFO enthusiast since 1958 and at first it was wonderment for all that I had to go on were reports, photos, films and then videos. Then I had my first through fifth or sixth sighting and the wonderment increased. I never thought that UFOs were human but I could not conceive as to their source. I still don't.



posted on Nov, 1 2012 @ 06:03 PM
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Originally posted by trysts

Originally posted by The Shrike
Let me qualify myself first: I do not believe UFOs are real, I know UFOs are real from first-hand experience after having 5 or 6 solid sightings and I do not think that they are extra-terrestrial..

Where are UFOs from? I have no idea. But since no evidence has been produced I cannot support such an opinion. And if I don't have evidence I don't make nor support claims, regardless.

Now, let me ask you simple questions:
1. Do you think UFOs are crafts?
2. If you do, why are there such a variety of shapes?
3. Do you think that if UFOs are craft, do they contain beings which would pilot the alleged craft?
4. Would you consider UFOs as remotely operated vehicles and if you do, where would their
controlers be located?
5. Why do you think UFOs are extra-terrestrial and what do you base it on?
6. Can you provide any evidence for your opinions?
7. If you do not have any evidence, then you must be employing a belief system so what led you to
your beliefs?




1. Yes, I believe they very well could be crafts, since many eyewitnesses describe them as such.
2. It's not unusual to me that they would have a variety of shapes, since there are a variety of shapes to known crafts already.
3. Yes, I believe it was a good idea to look at UFOs like crafts piloted by beings. Seems logical to deduce.
4. Yes, I believe that some sightings claim there were very small crafts coming out of larger crafts.
5. It seems most likely they are extra-terrestrial since no base, or home has been found on earth.
6. I believe the eye-witness reports are very strong evidence, and some sightings have radar corroboration, as well. But the strength of multiple witnesses, and individual witnesses has always made the subject of UFOs to be more of a reality than a myth, to me.
7. It's the same belief system I have for believing whether or not some historical person, or event occurred in the past. There is enough evidence for me to believe Julius Caesar existed, even though I don't have his bones in front of me, never knew him, and can never know for sure. I believe there is enough evidence already to believe that sightings/encounters with alien crafts have happened.


I'm an eyewitness! And I am in no position to state factually that what I saw was a craft. Eyewitnesses can only use familiar comparisons but do not know for a fact that UFOs are craft. Yes, they are mostly aerial objects. Yes, they "look" metallic". Yes, human aerial objects usually require a pilot but not always. The variety of shapes and behavior has to make one think of diversity which would be the result of more than one. The human race is one, are alleged aliens also one race or more? Where could such diversity originate from and how is it that they all "decided" to be here at the same time? Is there really a "space federation"? No base or home has been found on Earth but for that matter no base or home has been found anywhere! Not on the Moon or Mars or any planet. We rely on written history as support for the reality of our past. We have structures credited to Caesar and other ancient beings. But people believe whether there is no evidence, Jesus being the best known myth. UFOs are real and the circumstancial evidence is enough to erase all doubt except for skeptics who do not accept what is, to me, enough evidence.



posted on Nov, 1 2012 @ 06:15 PM
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Originally posted by WeRpeons
Although there are many thoroughly investigated UFO incidents, one incident I hold as the smoking gun to the existence of extraterrestrials and their vehicles is the Travis Walton case. Five witnesses who have all passed polygraph tests who have never wavered from their stories til this day, is proof to me that UFO's are extraterrestrial. Their personal testimonies even today, still evokes emotional responses from them.

Other multiple witness cases such as the Allagash incident, The Rendlesham Forest UFO Landings, The Stanford, Kentucky Abductions. These multiple witness & abduction accounts are validation that not all UFO's can be easily explained as being man made.


In reality, there isn't a single UFO incident that has been thoroughly investigated because the investigations started after the fact and all that could be investigated were reports and site investigations which were inconclusive.

I am not a Travis Walton supporter and consider his claim to be totally bogus regardless of who says what. Many believe his claimed experiences but many also believe a UFO crashed near Roswell or that the Phoenix "lights" were UFOs instead of flares. I stick with facts not unsupported beliefs. Claiming that you were abducted by alleged aliens does not result in said alleged alien being extraterrestrial. You don't seem to be aware that some humans will go to great lengths to ellicit not only emotional responses but ellicit your buck$.

There are some cases that make me think but I'm still undecided since all I have are accounts and I do not pooh pooh them I simply keep them on the back burner. The Allagash claims are one and possibly the only one I give serious consideration to. The others you mention I'm less acceptable of.



posted on Nov, 1 2012 @ 06:28 PM
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reply to post by The Shrike
 


I have read of encounters where the eyewitness describes a craft carrying passengers, or pilots. If the encounters did occur, then you could conclude that the eyewitness observed the "fact" that it was a craft. After reading through your thread, The Shrike, I understand that you've had a few sightings throughout your life, but of something which you don't believe was a craft carrying a crew of sorts. But there is no doubt that the phenomenon has an abundant diversity of experiences associated with it, so other eyewitnesses may know that they've encountered a craft not of this earth, where your encounters have been different.



posted on Nov, 1 2012 @ 06:41 PM
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reply to post by The Shrike
 


Hi Shrike.
In a reply you posted above you said

The only link of UFOs to ETs is that they have been seen and filmed flitting over the surface of the moon and on some Martian videos. But no evidence of real deep space origins.

That might be because there's not many of us out their to view them. In all the places where humans do go we have reports of them. Maybe when we're able to travel deep space the reports will continue.

Interesting thread
edit on 1-11-2012 by VoidHawk because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 1 2012 @ 06:45 PM
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reply to post by The Shrike
 


to be honest it would take a good while to type up... and to a logical mind pretty unbelievable. maybe when i've got the time and i'm in the mood to have people tell me what a nutjob i am




posted on Nov, 1 2012 @ 06:49 PM
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Yes I believe that UFOs exist and that they are indeed craft.I also believe they are aliem.Why?Because mlst reports are of movements so far ahead of our time,also many reports were before there were even cars let alone planes.Although our governments are involved in some way because of things like area51 and Dulce. As to proof, ive seen at least two UFOs infact one was right over my friends house.



posted on Nov, 1 2012 @ 07:47 PM
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reply to post by The Shrike
 


Dear The Shrike,



Interesting thinking but I see a dichotomy, without meaning to insult, in your sentence: "I believe in science and I believe in God..." I say a dichotomy because science cannot prove the reality of god so you are at odds with reality. Science achieves results. God is a human construction and history proves it so. If you've been fortunate to have had a non-questionable UFO sighting then your experience gives you the edge of not having to depend on beliefs as you have transcended them. Experience is always the best teacher. But while some have replied that they have seen UFOs vanish which I question because a UFO can move faster than we can perceive so it's super acceleration can appear to be a vanishing act. But for a UFO to vanish means that it has to leave our physical dimension and "reappear" in another dimension, a topic best left for a separate thread. I don't accept reports of humans interacting with alleged UFO occupants because we don't know if UFOs have beings inside them.


Science cannot prove many things. One problem it has is that while the theory of how gravity works is based on mass, there is insufficient mass for it to work. That doesn't mean that gravity does not work, merely that science does not have all the answers. The universe worked the way it did long before science had an explanation that is the reality.

I would not claim that there are no aliens or flying saucers, I merely for an explanation as to what we are seeing or observing. You asked a series of questions, I gave my answers, that is what you asked for. I tend to agree with Jacques Vallée and Dr. Josef Allen Hynek on these matters; though, I used to believe in the extraterrestrial answer. I find it interesting that you do not believe people have interacted with them inside the ships. What do you think of the Travis Walton story?

UPDATE - I see you have already commented to another on Travis Martin.
edit on 1-11-2012 by AQuestion because: Clarity





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