Ex-Navy SEALs Kill 60 Terrorists In Benghazi Consulate Attack

Originally posted by Echo3Foxtrot

Originally posted by trysts
This is a bunch of BS propaganda, with a bunch weirdos acting like killing people is heroic.

BS propaganda in who's favor? What are you afraid of kids looking up to these guys who gave their lives trying to protect American citizens? Sure as hell isn't a move to make the government look good. If you remember the government were the ones letting it happen and tried to cover it all up. These guys were absolutely heroes, but you're head is so far up your own butt with your righteous holier-than-thou attitude. To spit on the corpses of these men as you did when they were trying to do what the military is actually there for is disgusting. Whether the story is true or not, it's the principle of what they did that matters most.

It's an idiotic story, but you apparently believe it. Hero-worshipping the invaders is for the most confused jingoists in society, Echo3Foxtrot. There is a certain point in life where you should grow up.

Originally posted by Granite

Originally posted by trysts
This is a bunch of BS propaganda, with a bunch weirdos acting like killing people is heroic.

You will change tune when it comes time to remove all the infedel's heads...a fitting end for your kind.

Very creepy, Granite....

reply to post by trysts


If your really upset at the imperialism, why blame the troops and not the leader? Did the seals have any say so on the policy? Did they want an embassy there? Did they want to remove a dictator in some third world hell hole no one should give a s$%t about? All the answers are no. Thew simply heard AMERICANS crying out for help being shot and raped and without regard for their own lives made the ultimate sacrafice for another human being.

Only a troll coward would blame them(seals) instead of the leaders who are reponsible for ALL of the decisions made on foreign policy. Your lame and an ignorant coward, go guzzle your dear leader maobama, when the time comes hopefully you have a chance to be abandoned as well.

reply to post by butcherguy


Thanks for those extra links. Firms it all up a bit more for me but at the same time it does raise a couple of uncomfortable questions (as i want to believe in this story for a variety of reasons). For example, it does strike me as completely odd that the 2 ex SEALs had laser pointers but no weapons - they had to scavenge AK47's but yet they had state of the art laser pointers on them? Something about that doesn't sit well.

Originally posted by Flavian
reply to post by butcherguy

 

Thanks for those extra links. Firms it all up a bit more for me but at the same time it does raise a couple of uncomfortable questions (as i want to believe in this story for a variety of reasons). For example, it does strike me as completely odd that the 2 ex SEALs had laser pointers but no weapons - they had to scavenge AK47's but yet they had state of the art laser pointers on them? Something about that doesn't sit well.

I have a problem with the story too.

Not so much with them having laser target designators, they would be used by the CIA for targeting terrorist leaders in drone strikes, as has been done in Afghanistan and Iraq. The designators were said to be used while they were fighting at the 'annex' (CIA post) after they evacuated from the consulate.

What I have a problem believing is that they would have left the annex unarmed to help at the consulate.

I could believe that they took weapons with them and ran out of ammo, then discarded them in exchange for AK 47's that were retrieved from dead combatants.

Originally posted by pyramid head
reply to post by trysts

 

If your really upset at the imperialism, why blame the troops and not the leader? Did the seals have any say so on the policy? Did they want an embassy there? Did they want to remove a dictator in some third world hell hole no one should give a s$%t about? All the answers are no. Thew simply heard AMERICANS crying out for help being shot and raped and without regard for their own lives made the ultimate sacrafice for another human being.

Only a troll coward would blame them(seals) instead of the leaders who are reponsible for ALL of the decisions made on foreign policy. Your lame and an ignorant coward, go guzzle your dear leader maobama, when the time comes hopefully you have a chance to be abandoned as well.

I blame the "troops", and their leaders. I think it's morally wrong to support an army used to invade sovereign nations, as the U.S. does. I don't believe the story to begin with, but it's also an ugly story of the mass slaughter of human beings that you apparently get a warm feeling about, pyramid head. I just think it's disgusting that people actually feel good about murder, and hearing murder stories.

The laser designator is not that uncommon. In fact you can buy them yourselves for about the cost of a good handgun. Today I read that the SEAL using the designator was on the radio at the same time calling for an air strike.
Now he did so in a particular way.
"Where the blank is the Spectre?'"
THE SPECTRE
Which implies that he knew there was an AC-130 Spectre gunship already on station or had been told it was on station.

If the laser they used was visable which I have to assume it was unless they had NVG's then it not only painted the target but painted their location as well.
If Someone in the WH was watching this attack and prevented that AC-130 from engaging the mortar then they are responsible for the loss of those two men.
Plain and simple.

reply to post by Dragoon01

I would hope that the designator was IR, but they can still be spotted with IR night vision gear.

Either way, the person using it must put their head and hands in the line of fire.

reply to post by trysts


Ouch. That stung. But I had it coming. I wasn't exactly cordial in what I said.

I never said I believe the story outright. I will say I have read some old Medal od Honor citations from the world wars that rival this, so to think it is impossible is to underestimate a well oiled killing machine in a desperate situation. But I'm not talking about the story being true. My point lies with the fact that these men were doing what so many people know the military is there for: protecting American citizens. The circumstances of the whole scene is questionable seeing as how it was a CIA safehouse and the ambassador was selling arms, so it may very wall have been a case of protecting assets or the interest of greedy people. But I would like to sit in my fantasy world, if you will, and believe these guys disobeyed orders to protect American citizens. That's the kind of stuff America needs, but unfortunately the story makes it a little far fetched.

I admit I have bias. I've been in the service for 6 years now. I want these guys to be the heroes they are portrayed as. I want to believe they are perfect examples of the true mindset of us military guys. You know, we will give up our lives to protect this country and its citizens. Believe what you will, but I will continue to believe that these men, who probably did not kill 60 men, are still heroes.

The last thing the world needs is ANOTHER American hero! We get it, enough already. Calm down and settle down like the rest of us who are trying to live peaceably amongst other nations.

reply to post by Echo3Foxtrot


I wish the U.S. would stop invading countries so I could feel that it's place in the world was morally respectable enough to call the military- the defenders of this country. But that's not real.

reply to post by trysts


Some people call it invading, others call it justified. Until he American people stop following false idols, we will all remain split and doing the bidding of the dark lords. I understand where you're coming from. That crap in the middle east I have been trying to avoid like the plague even though it's my "job" to go over there. I've been to Iraq and Afghanistan. I will avoid going back at all costs. I don't agree with being there anymore. Our purpose has not been met over the years and we have over stayed our welcome. It's time to tuck tail and run like the Russians. Who cares. Lets fix our own crap before we even bat an eyelashes at the rest of the world. Tell the UN to take a hike, too.

Originally posted by pyramid head
reply to post by trysts

 

If your really upset at the imperialism, why blame the troops and not the leader? Did the seals have any say so on the policy? Did they want an embassy there? Did they want to remove a dictator in some third world hell hole no one should give a s$%t about? All the answers are no. Thew simply heard AMERICANS crying out for help being shot and raped and without regard for their own lives made the ultimate sacrafice for another human being.

Only a troll coward would blame them(seals) instead of the leaders who are reponsible for ALL of the decisions made on foreign policy. Your lame and an ignorant coward, go guzzle your dear leader maobama, when the time comes hopefully you have a chance to be abandoned as well.

The ex-Seals were contractors, i.e. mercenaries, for the CIA. They didn't have to be there; they chose to work for blood money because it pays well. Live by the sword, die by the sword.

Good gawd, it wasn't an embassy; it wasn't even a consulate; it was a US "diplomatic mission", which is an euphemism for a CIA base. Can't you folks get that one straight yet? The fact that you don't even know what kind of facility it was shows that you are not in command of the facts on this issue. They were likely conducting a gun-running venture to Libyan militia and Syrian rebels. They weren't protecting Americans, and the only interests they were protecting were banking and oil interests. The CIA has a record of assassinating foreign leaders, causing coups in democratic countries and smuggling drugs into the US to finance their clandestine and sordid operations. So I'm not too sympathetic to CIA goons getting whacked. They're in another country supplying weapons to one group or another. If there were foreign nationals, working for a foreign spy service, distributing weapons to various militia/militant groups in the US, you and just about everybody else would be raising holy heck. But it's OK for the US to do it elsewhere, and how dare anybody attack US agents doing so.

By your rhetoric you seem to be implying that Obama is not your leader, so you evidently don't respect the commander in chief of the US military and the leader of this country. And unlike George W. Bush, he was actually elected, rather than selected president by five partisan flacks on the Supreme Court. Yet you claim to be patriotic. Typical right-wing cognitive dissonance.

And as more is coming out, it appears that help was sent to this CIA base, but that conventional US military forces were not sent because permission of the Libyan government was required in order to not cause a diplomatic row. The fact that the Obama administration as not been very forthcoming has to do with the covert nature of this operation, but that doesn't seem to bother you, FOX and the rest of the right-wing nut-a-sphere.

It also didn't seem to bother you all when the Bush II administration outed Valerie Plame, a CIA case officer working on monitoring nuclear programs in various Middle East countries, and that her outting caused the deaths of some of her operatives/agents/informers. Again, the double standard of the right-wing is INCREDIBLE.

reply to post by trysts


I'm a combat war vet I speak from experience. Believe it or not, some people do love their country and the idea of it. Many also feel it is their responsiblity to dedicate a portion of their lives in its service, not simply complaining then leaching off its freedoms like it is something they have earned. Live in a country without freedoms, you would not even be on this website. Working for the CIA is no different than being joe schmoe the troop.(may sound crazy but they actually work together ssshhhhh) Troops may not always agree with the mission, or even the morality of it, that is not their job. If it was you could not have a military period, and shows you have a complete lack of understanding for its basic make-up and function. Thats why it is YOUR job as a well informed citizen to ensure imperialists do not get elected and ABUSE the military.

Abuse of power is not the reponsibility of the troops, it is of the commander, otherwise whats the difference between the troops and commander if they all have the same authority. Most people, like myself don't celebrate the specific "killing" of anyone, and in this case most people are describing the heroism and selflessness it takes to forgoe your life for someone else. Hold you government accountable, that should be your biggest outcry. But you know this and just being a lib troll

Apologies haven't read the whole thread and if this has been covered before, disregard.

From what I've read, I can't help but wonder if DCI Petraeus is being set up to take the fall over this one...

It's probably a good thing that Sandy came along to blow this under the rug for Obama this close to the election...

reply to post by MrInquisitive


You have alot of stupid assumptions about the CIA. I have personally worked with them(CIA) overseas and they saved troops lives with valuable intelligence they provided while they were on the ground, just like we were. You are talking out of your @!# and it is evident by your lack of understanding of how the military and CIA operate. Using your logic troops are mercinaries as well.

To assume these were just some money grubbing seals is sad on your part. You should speak to people who have fought overseas. There are many different circumstances for what people do, people who serve in the military have more heart than you so maybe you cannot understand, but I have seen guys re-enlist just because the had a sense of loyalty to their unit and felt they had an obligation to protect them, even though they were facing certain hostile deployment.

These guys were seals, use a little intelligence, what are they supposed to do when they get out? Many military people do government related jobs when they get out, i.e. police, FBI, CIA, its common sense. It would be like getting a biology degree then expecting that person to be a chef. They can be, but they are probably going to do something biology realted.

It is not the job of ground troops(everyone except commanders) to dictate mission, just carry it out. Your dear leader obozo is the commander, imperialist policies are all his to own. Whatever you believe the reason americans are in libyia for, the ultimate desicion resides with the president, just like it did for bush. You should learn how the power structure and accountability works before blaming two heroic seals who sacraficed their lives for other americans, its shameful.

reply to post by pyramid head


Get real and forego the emotional BS patriotism nonsense... The former Navy Seals were contracting through a British owned company as mercenaries... Their loyalty was to the highest bidder.

Originally posted by pyramid head
reply to post by trysts

 

I'm a combat war vet I speak from experience. Believe it or not, some people do love their country and the idea of it. Many also feel it is their responsiblity to dedicate a portion of their lives in its service, not simply complaining then leaching off its freedoms like it is something they have earned. Live in a country without freedoms, you would not even be on this website. Working for the CIA is no different than being joe schmoe the troop.(may sound crazy but they actually work together ssshhhhh) Troops may not always agree with the mission, or even the morality of it, that is not their job. If it was you could not have a military period, and shows you have a complete lack of understanding for its basic make-up and function. Thats why it is YOUR job as a well informed citizen to ensure imperialists do not get elected and ABUSE the military.

Abuse of power is not the reponsibility of the troops, it is of the commander, otherwise whats the difference between the troops and commander if they all have the same authority. Most people, like myself don't celebrate the specific "killing" of anyone, and in this case most people are describing the heroism and selflessness it takes to forgoe your life for someone else. Hold you government accountable, that should be your biggest outcry. But you know this and just being a lib troll

First, pyramid head, the U.S. government, and it's military, don't give me "freedoms". I was born free, like everyone else on earth. Governments and laws tell us of the consequences of specific actions I may take while living in a society. That is not giving me "freedoms", so I don't 'leach' off "freedoms".

Second, as much as you would seem to like it if all the people who keep signing up for the U.S. military would have no responsibility for the systematic slaughter of human beings around the world, it's not so, in my view. Trying to defer sole responsibility to the leaders, instead of the people who serve the leaders, is transparently false.

reply to post by trysts


You are born free in america, not all countries. Freedom is constantly fought for and maintained via a countries military, not by trolls on computers. The mere presence of the military ensures your freedom, even if you do not understand that basic concept. You do not even understand that other countries our different. Simply being born entitles you a "right" to nothing, try being a woman born in pakistan. Your world view shows your lack of basic knowledge on how the real world works. Your comments reflect your lack of education and are based on an opinion of nonsense.

reply to post by hypervigilant


Spoken like someone who has acomplished nothing in life. Just because you have no honor or self-repect does not apply that to all. The bottom line is they did not get paid to die for the americans they saved, they did that against orders. Their orders were to listen to them die, they did not, and lost their lives. Its pathetic that this has to even be argued. There is nothing more disgusting than some lazy kid on a computer taking his freedom for granted and bashing someone who has made the ultimate sacrafice for his country. Very sad.