Sincere Christians Only please - my faith is being tested and shaken

reply to post by lr7gmx
Good Grief, I am seriously tempted to clue you in but I low it is pointless so, why bother. Sincere Christian Only huh...or basically, only those who are going to tell you what you want to hear need respond. Well, I have something for you:

Originally posted by lr7gmx
With everything that is going on in the world I am becoming more and more frightened. New Agers or scientists are preaching the Marduk theory and that messes with my mind. I am a conservative Protestant Christian and am struggling to maintain my faith. Is there anyone listening to my pleas?

Mick

Not to bash your religion... but you should do some research on the Bible. The stories inside aren't new. They were taken from older texts. The Sumerians, for example, have stories of the great flood, Adam and Eve and a few others. Akkadian texts do the same. Many other ancient cultures talked about these events.

IMO the Bible was created as a means to control the masses.

Originally posted by Athin

Originally posted by lr7gmx
With everything that is going on in the world I am becoming more and more frightened. New Agers or scientists are preaching the Marduk theory and that messes with my mind. I am a conservative Protestant Christian and am struggling to maintain my faith. Is there anyone listening to my pleas?

Mick

Not to bash your religion... but you should do some research on the Bible. The stories inside aren't new. They were taken from older texts. The Sumerians, for example, have stories of the great flood, Adam and Eve and a few others. Akkadian texts do the same. Many other ancient cultures talked about these events.

IMO the Bible was created as a means to control the masses.

Yeah, the Enuma Elish paints the Fallen Ones out to be good guys. I think i'll trust Jesus over Fallen Ones tyvm!

Originally posted by Athin

Originally posted by lr7gmx
With everything that is going on in the world I am becoming more and more frightened. New Agers or scientists are preaching the Marduk theory and that messes with my mind. I am a conservative Protestant Christian and am struggling to maintain my faith. Is there anyone listening to my pleas?

Mick

Not to bash your religion... but you should do some research on the Bible. The stories inside aren't new. They were taken from older texts. The Sumerians, for example, have stories of the great flood, Adam and Eve and a few others. Akkadian texts do the same. Many other ancient cultures talked about these events.

IMO the Bible was created as a means to control the masses.

*********************************************************************
All the other stories do is verify the truth of the Holy Bible. You walk on thin ice when you blaspheme God's Holy word. You seem to do it with ease. Forgive them Lord. They know not what they do.
The God of Abraham is your creator. You are the created and you open your mouth and things fall out with the ease of a needed crap. Of course the bible was written to control people. People need controlled. People need their brains washed too. You would do well to seek your creator and ask him to give you eyes to see. He will do it if you are sincere. You can't fool him. If you die in your sins without the covering and atonement that Jesus bought, then your life is for nought and you will die the eternal death. I will pray for you. I wish I could reach you with words and plant a seed that may save your eternal life.

Originally posted by lr7gmx
With everything that is going on in the world I am becoming more and more frightened. New Agers or scientists are preaching the Marduk theory and that messes with my mind. I am a conservative Protestant Christian and am struggling to maintain my faith. Is there anyone listening to my pleas?

Mick

Nope. Sounds like you are waking up. Quick...go watch Bill Maher's Religulous and read a Dawkins book or two.

IT'S NOT TOO LATE!!

Originally posted by cantyousee

All the other stories do is verify the truth of the Holy Bible. You walk on thin ice when you blaspheme God's Holy word.

So...riddle me this. How do the other stories "verify" the bible when those all those other stories came THOUSANDS OF YEARS before the alleged birth of jesus?

The story of Horus can be found in "The Egyptian Book of the Dead (also known as the "Papyrus of Ani") written over 3,000 years before the birth of Christ. Below is a brief summary of the life times of the god the ancient egyptians called "Horus KRST" around 3000 BC. Tell me if you have heard any of this before or if it sounds just a little bit familiar. lol:

Identical Life Experiences
(1) It is written that both Horus and Jesus existed before their incarnations.
(2) Horus was born of the virgin Isis on December 25th in a cave/manger.
(3) Horus' birth was announced by a star in the East and attended by three wise men.
(4) The infant Horus was carried out of Egypt to escape the wrath of Typhon. The infant Jesus was carried into Egypt to escape the wrath of Herod. Concerning the infant Jesus, the New Testament states the following prophecy: "Out of Egypt have I called my son." (Matt. 2:15)
(5) He was a child teacher in the temple and was baptized by Anup the Baptizer when he was thirty years old.
(6) He had twelve disciples and performed miracles such as feeding bread to the multitude and walking on water.
(7) He raised one man, El-Azar-us, from the dead.
(8) He transfigured on a mount.
(9) He also had titles such as the "way, the truth, the light, the Messiah, God's anointed Son, the Son of Man, the good shepherd, the lamb of God, the Word, the Morning Star, the light of the world.
(10) He was "the Fisher," and was associated with the lamb, lion and fish ("Ichthys").
(11) Horus's personal epithet was "Iusa," the "ever-becoming son" of "Ptah," the "Father."
(12) Horus was called "KRST," or "Anointed One.
(13) He was crucified, buried in a tomb and resurrected.
(14) The adoration of the Virgin and Child is connected with both the adoration of Isis and the infant Horus and the adoration of Mary and infant Jesus. In the catacombs at Rome are pictures of the baby Horus being held by the virgin mother Isis, the original "Madonna and Child."
(15) Concerning the writing of the Gnostics, C. W. King, a noted English author, says: "To this period belongs a beautiful sard in my collection, representing Serapis,...whilst before him stands Isis, holding in one hand the sistrum, in the other a wheatsheaf, with the legend: 'Immaculate is our lady Isis,' the very term applied afterwards to that personage who succeeded to her form, her symbols, rites, and ceremonies" (Gnostics and Their Remains, p. 71).
(16) Osiris, Isis, and Horus are the principal trinity of the Egyptian religions. God the Father, Jesus the Son, and the Holy Spirit is the Christian trinity. Dr. Inman affirms the Egyptian roots of the Christian trinity "The Christian trinity is of Egyptian origin, and is as surely a pagan doctrine as the belief in heaven and hell, the existence of a devil, of archangels, angels, spirits and saints, martyrs and virgins, intercessors in heaven, gods and demigods, and other forms of faith which deface the greater part of modern religions" (Ancient Pagan and Modem Christian Symbolism, p. 13).
(17) Dr. Draper says: "For thirty centuries the Egyptians had been familiar with the conception of a triune God. There was hardly a city of any note without its particular triads. Here it was Amum, Maut, and Khonso; there Osiris, Isis, and Horus" (Intellectual Development, Vol. I, p. 191).
(18) Dr. Draper stated: "Views of the Trinity, in accordance with Egyptian tradition, were established. Not only was the adoration of Isis under a new name restored, but even her image standing on the crescent moon reappeared. The well-known effigy of that goddess, with the infant Horus in her arms, has descended to our days in the beautiful artistic creations of the Madonna and Child." (Conflict, p. 48).
(19) Mrs. Besant believes that Christianity has its main roots in Egypt: "It grew out of Egypt; its gospels came from thence [Alexandria]; its ceremonies were learned there; its Virgin is Isis; its Christ, Osiris and Horus."
(20) There are two stories connected with Horus that is analogous to stories found in the Old Testament. The hiding of the infant Horus in a marsh by his mother undoubtedly parallels the story of the hiding of the infant Moses in a marsh by his mother. When Horus died, Isis implored Ra, the sun, to restore him to life. Ra stopped his ship in mid-heaven and sent down Thoth, the moon, to bring him back to life. The stopping of the sun and moon by Isis recalls the myth of the stopping of the sun and moon by Joshua.
:

i am no christian or believer but i aplaud your courage to ask a very difficult question on a site like this
like someone said, you are inviting ppl to " debunk" faith, but on the other hand, i was pleasantly surprised when i read the third post

if there are other ppl strugling with there faith they will find good suggestions here, and maybe even strengthen some other ppl

hope you find some kind of peace

be strong m8

reply to post by lr7gmx


Live in Love and follow what your heart tells you is right. The lord will not lead you astray, but sometimes you need a break away from everything to find yourself. Do not feel like you'll lose touch with god if you are not around the church as much. If you only feel a connection to god on sunday mornings then maybe there's something else in your life you need to help you "grow your roots" and encompase your spirituality in everyday life.

if you have to "question" your own faith, does it really exsist? if god truly was, there would be no question. you already have your answer.

reply to post by Violater1

Look, we are in the end of times and the evil ones are going to do everything they can do, say or write to lead you astray.

We have been in the "end times" since John the Baptist and it just meant the latter days, which is how they said in their language back then, "the future".

People leading people astray has always been with us, just look at the Book of Job, where his friends were giving him advise on how to cope with calamity but were really leading him away from what turned out to be the correct way.

reply to post by lr7gmx

New Agers or scientists are preaching the Marduk theory and that messes with my mind. I am a conservative Protestant Christian and am struggling to maintain my faith.

My advice to you is to stop being a conservative (fundamentalist?) Christian, and try really hard, meaning spend some serious time, and for as long as it takes (maybe three years or longer) to become a mainstream "liberal" Christian.
That is what I had to do, otherwise those "Marduk theories" will "mess with your mind". I spent a couple years on an atheist forum arguing my fundamentalist line with them and I eventually had to admit that they had a point, as far as there being all sorts of ancient religions and some parallels with the Old Testament, to the point that one could easily imagine that the OT was actually influenced by the old religions of Mesopotamia.
What we know now is that it isn't where the OT came from, but it comes from local beliefs peculiar to the old Land of Canaan. Now even that could be troubling to people who were brought up to be fundamentalist, but you have to get over that and my solution that seems to work for me is to drop the extreme form of fundamentalism, like believing Moses wrote the Torah, and move on to the New Testament where it is determinable that it was all at least written within a short time of the events that they purport to describe. That is what should be important to a Christian, the NT, and not the OT, and to be a NT Christian and believing in Jesus and the advice from the Apostles to live a life of faith and righteousness.

Originally posted by milominderbinder
Originally posted by cantyousee

All the other stories do is verify the truth of the Holy Bible. You walk on thin ice when you blaspheme God's Holy word.

So...riddle me this. How do the other stories "verify" the bible when those all those other stories came THOUSANDS OF YEARS before the alleged birth of jesus?

******************************************************************************************************************
Most people, including Christians, do not understand that there are three earth ages. Before the one true God of Abraham revealed himself to the people of the Adamic age there were legends and myths of false Gods.
Whatever duplicates existed before was all worship of false Gods. Satan,lucifer,Horus,the morning star, all names of the fallen one has forever tried to cast himself as the one true God. These stories go back thousands of years to the first earth age.
The difference between the true and the fake is this: Those false representations of God never came to the earth to redeem mankind from sin. The law of God was never revealed until Moses received it. The Adamic race was the first to reveive the perfect law of God and to understand their shortfalleness and need for salvation.
These legends all fail to take into account a savior to take the place of and be atonement for the downfall of Adam.
All these false saviors required worship and sacrifice without providing atonement for sin. God said, "for sin comes death"
There is no atonement for sin without the shedding of blood. God had a problem if Adam sinned. Therefore as it is written, The lamb of God, slain before the foundations of the earth, in the councils of heaven, offered to come and kin himself(Jesus of Nazareth) with mankind and be a propitiation for sin. Now God could send his Holy Spirit to man. None of these false representaions done that. God has successfully redeemed his Adamic creation of which Satan was perversely jealous of because this creation in its fullness would be of greater Glory and power than the angels and would one day rule over and judge the angels. This is the old hatred. The beginning jealousy; The reason for the mutiny and downfall of Lucifer who was once a cherubim.
If there is an almighty God, he had to have created the earth and mankind with a purpose. That purpose is revealed in the Bible and the gospels reveal the chosen one who came and died for us. Took our place when we deserved eternal death. Conquered death so that in the fullness of time we(all who believe in him) could obtain our destiny. To put it in a nutshell, None of the early representaions of God ever manifested the "LOVE" needed to save.

Originally posted by jmdewey60
reply to post by lr7gmx

 

New Agers or scientists are preaching the Marduk theory and that messes with my mind. I am a conservative Protestant Christian and am struggling to maintain my faith.

My advice to you is to stop being a conservative (fundamentalist?) Christian, and try really hard, meaning spend some serious time, and for as long as it takes (maybe three years or longer) to become a mainstream "liberal" Christian.
That is what I had to do, otherwise those "Marduk theories" will "mess with your mind". I spent a couple years on an atheist forum arguing my fundamentalist line with them and I eventually had to admit that they had a point, as far as there being all sorts of ancient religions and some parallels with the Old Testament, to the point that one could easily imagine that the OT was actually influenced by the old religions of Mesopotamia.
What we know now is that it isn't where the OT came from, but it comes from local beliefs peculiar to the old Land of Canaan. Now even that could be troubling to people who were brought up to be fundamentalist, but you have to get over that and my solution that seems to work for me is to drop the extreme form of fundamentalism, like believing Moses wrote the Torah, and move on to the New Testament where it is determinable that it was all at least written within a short time of the events that they purport to describe. That is what should be important to a Christian, the NT, and not the OT, and to be a NT Christian and believing in Jesus and the advice from the Apostles to live a life of faith and righteousness.

edit on 31-10-2012 by jmdewey60 because: add Bible quote: "For the creation eagerly waits for the revelation of the sons of God." Romans 8:19

I don't get how that works. For your religion to work... you have to alter it to fit what is right?
Anything associated with the words 'liberal' or 'conservative' should be taken extremely lightly. You left one extreme viewpoint behind to go with another very extreme viewpoint.
Also dropping the OT beliefs is crazy. Just because some of the ideas in it sound insane you think you just just drop it and follow the NT? Every early form of religious belief is connected in one way... truth. It mat be skewed to the point that it's unimaginable in this day and age...but IMO it stems from truth.

What is more logical...
A.) The OT is filled with stories from other cultures... copied and changed just enough to look like Jesus did all of the same stuff other 'Gods' have done... thus enforcing the idea that the Bible is just plagiarized from other 'religions'.

B.) The OT is filled with local stories which duplicate other stories from around the globe. Theres an extremely slim chance that this is just coincidence... the only other thing it points to is truth.

Either way those seem to be the only 2 choices unless you think it's just a coincidence that numerous religious texts have almost identical stories in them.

Originally posted by cantyousee

Originally posted by Athin

Originally posted by lr7gmx
With everything that is going on in the world I am becoming more and more frightened. New Agers or scientists are preaching the Marduk theory and that messes with my mind. I am a conservative Protestant Christian and am struggling to maintain my faith. Is there anyone listening to my pleas?

Mick

Not to bash your religion... but you should do some research on the Bible. The stories inside aren't new. They were taken from older texts. The Sumerians, for example, have stories of the great flood, Adam and Eve and a few others. Akkadian texts do the same. Many other ancient cultures talked about these events.

IMO the Bible was created as a means to control the masses.

*********************************************************************
All the other stories do is verify the truth of the Holy Bible. You walk on thin ice when you blaspheme God's Holy word. You seem to do it with ease. Forgive them Lord. They know not what they do.
The God of Abraham is your creator. You are the created and you open your mouth and things fall out with the ease of a needed crap. Of course the bible was written to control people. People need controlled. People need their brains washed too. You would do well to seek your creator and ask him to give you eyes to see. He will do it if you are sincere. You can't fool him. If you die in your sins without the covering and atonement that Jesus bought, then your life is for nought and you will die the eternal death. I will pray for you. I wish I could reach you with words and plant a seed that may save your eternal life.

It's people like you who give 'Christian' a bad name. Suggesting that just because I don't follow YOUR religion that I'll burn in hell. People need to be controlled and be brainwashed? I'm not mad at your ignorance... I pity it.

reply to post by Athin

I don't get how that works. For your religion to work... you have to alter it to fit what is right?

"My Religion"? I'm talking about what someone personally believes. Currently in the US, people have a right to their own personal religious views. There are plenty of denominations out there so no need to invent any new ones but you can look at different ones as examples of what you might do yourself as to what positions you may want to adopt on issues that you are concerned about.

Anything associated with the words 'liberal' or 'conservative' should be taken extremely lightly. You left one extreme viewpoint behind to go with another very extreme viewpoint.

And you think that based on what, exactly? Being mainstream is considered by you to be extreme? How so?
The mainstream denominations are liberal which just means not hard core fundamentalists, something which is prevalent with cults like some Baptists and non-denominational and so-called evangelical congregations.

Also dropping the OT beliefs is crazy.

I didn't say that, I said dropping extreme fundamentalist ideas about the OT which are outdated and seem more like an indication of either insanity or induced delusional states caused by cult indoctrination.

Just because some of the ideas in it sound insane you think you just just drop it and follow the NT?

Believing Moses wrote it is insane, and I didn't say anything about the content other than it originates from the area that you might expect, which is Palestine, formerly Canaan.

Every early form of religious belief is connected in one way... truth. It mat be skewed to the point that it's unimaginable in this day and age...but IMO it stems from truth.

Oh, no kidding, care to explain what that is?

What is more logical...
A.) The OT is filled with stories from other cultures... copied and changed just enough to look like Jesus did all of the same stuff other 'Gods' have done... thus enforcing the idea that the Bible is just plagiarized from other 'religions'.

B.) The OT is filled with local stories which duplicate other stories from around the globe. Theres an extremely slim chance that this is just coincidence... the only other thing it points to is truth.

Neither one is because you can't find the answer through pure logic. You have to actually know some facts and that takes study, not just being opinionated.

Either way those seem to be the only 2 choices unless you think it's just a coincidence that numerous religious texts have almost identical stories in them.

They don't, and I have to suspect that you are falling for YouTube videos without doing the hard work of reading actual physical, responsibly written books.

Athin wrote:
It's people like you who give 'Christian' a bad name. Suggesting that just because I don't follow YOUR religion that I'll burn in hell. People need to be controlled and be brainwashed? I'm not mad at your ignorance... I pity it.

***************************************************
I suppose you think mankind is just alright the way they are? They don't need guidence or any controls put upon them? And I suppose you think the way they think is OK? They don't need their filthy brains washed? Mankind without God's Holy Spirit is corrupt. Unless God washes them and makes them clean they cannot live in his sight. If they cannot live in his sight then they are good for nothing but to be cast into hell(eternal seperation from God) It is a blessing that Christ came to keep that from happening.
Who do you think makes the rules? Do you think there should be no rules? Are you going to be angry at him when you find out there is a superior being who created you and expects you to rise to a certain standard?
I have news for you. You are the created. You exist because God dained to create you. You would have no existance without him. Do you feel that you have a right to be...without a creator?
I'm interested to know what you think of these things and how your mind works. It's not religeon that God wants.
Christianity is not a religeon it is a way of life. Man made it a religeon and then cut it up into sects. Christ will return to put it all straight. Will you be happy at his return or will you do as the bible says the unbelievers will do, pray that the mountains fall on you and hide his face from you?

Originally posted by lr7gmxNew Agers or scientists are preaching the Marduk theory and that messes with my mind.
Mick

What you are seeing is a fulfillment of Bible prophecy.

Now the Spirit expressly says that in later times some will depart from the faith by devoting themselves to deceitful spirits and teachings of demons,
(1 Timothy 4:1 ESV)

Satan sometimes even uses scientists to spread his false teachings. The best solution to your problem is to spend time studying what the Bible says about the future. Here is a good site that can help you with this:

raptureready.com...

Originally posted by cantyousee
I suppose you think mankind is just alright the way they are? They don't need guidence or any controls put upon them? And I suppose you think the way they think is OK? They don't need their filthy brains washed? Mankind without God's Holy Spirit is corrupt. Unless God washes them and makes them clean they cannot live in his sight. If they cannot live in his sight then they are good for nothing but to be cast into hell(eternal seperation from God) It is a blessing that Christ came to keep that from happening.
Who do you think makes the rules? Do you think there should be no rules? Are you going to be angry at him when you find out there is a superior being who created you and expects you to rise to a certain standard?
I have news for you. You are the created. You exist because God dained to create you. You would have no existance without him. Do you feel that you have a right to be...without a creator?
I'm interested to know what you think of these things and how your mind works. It's not religeon that God wants.
Christianity is not a religeon it is a way of life. Man made it a religeon and then cut it up into sects. Christ will return to put it all straight. Will you be happy at his return or will you do as the bible says the unbelievers will do, pray that the mountains fall on you and hide his face from you?

edit on 31-10-2012 by cantyousee because: spelling

You know, if you are going to espouse Christian mythology at people in the hopes of convincing them to "turn from their evil ways," perhaps you should try to do it in a way that doesn't make the mythology you are peddling look so bad. But, since you wanted to come out swinging here, allow me to respond in kind You pulled no punches on what you believe, and I won't either.

This is the standard line that all bible-thumpers spew forth. "God created you. He will judge you and send you to hell. Turn to his love before he tortures you, torments you, and condemns you to an eternity of pain, suffering, agony, and separation! But, don't ask me to prove it."

I'm sorry...wait, no I'm not. Your religious mythology and holy book offer nothing more than threats, manipulation, condemnation, and emotional abuse. I see nothing positive, nothing good, nothing "holy" in what you are offering us here. As well, I have never seen one shred, one iota, of proof that the Christian god actually exists.

So, though it wasn't directed at me, do you want my answer as to what I would say if I ever came face-to-face with Jesus? I would say "thanks, but no thanks. I would rather go to hell than live in service to a jealous god who demands subservience, worship, and piety yet fails to give us proof that he exists. I would rather burn in a lake of fire for eternity than take a reward offered by a god who gives us the will to live our lives as we see fit, but still chooses to punish us for simply not believing in him. I refuse to honor a god whose criteria for saving people lies not in the goodness of their hearts, the honor of their deeds, or the caliber of their actions, but in whether or not they chose to follow one of the hundreds of religions on this planet. Your god, who demands to be worshiped, doesn't deserve to be!"

reply to post by Koros


Wow, you seem angry, my friend. I'm sorry that your view of God is someone who enjoys sending people to Hell. I rather enjoy going to E-Free church services. The passion and comfort and peace there supercedes hatred and codemnation. God IS love.

Mick

Originally posted by lr7gmx
reply to post by Koros

 

Wow, you seem angry, my friend. I'm sorry that your view of God is someone who enjoys sending people to Hell. I rather enjoy going to E-Free church services. The passion and comfort and peace there supercedes hatred and codemnation. God IS love.

Mick

Sorry, my friend, but your god is anything BUT love. A god who loves his children does not condemn them to hell simply for not attending the right religious services. A god who cares more about what you think than what you do in life is not a god that deserves followers.

And, yes, I do get angry sometimes. I'm not angry at the Christian god, as some people have said in the past. It's hard to be angry at a being that doesn't exist. Rather, I am angry at so many Christians who take on a holier-than-thou attitude and attempt to proselytize every chance they get, as if they somehow have a moral authority to "convert us sinners."

Well, if thinking that Christian mythology is a load of tripe makes me a sinner, then a sinner be I.