ATS Science Challange: Air Condition a House in high humidity without standard AC/Refrigeration

You can use a very small ac unit that is based on a heat pump.
Flexible tubing is buried in the ground or even sunk to the bottom of deep ponds. The heat pump exchanges temperature without using a big compressor that takes 240v ac.

Another way to cool a home but works better in a dry climate is a belfry.

Belfry's are just a chamber that goes from the first floor ceiling to a covered and vented structure on the roof. It looks like a small church belfry. A large fan or even (old school) gas burner will get the warm air flowing upwards. This pulls air up and out and cool air in through first floor windows or doors.

reply to post by JohnPhoenix


You could look up what they are doing with Earthships, he has has made some amazing wind fans also you could look into dehumidifiers that go in the roof.

love and harmony
Whateva

I am not an HVAC tech, but I have a little experience with some geothemal systems. The geotherrmal systems that were installed into houses we have built are really nice. Defenitely worth checking out if it is feasable for your area. I live in Ilinois where the humidity is extreme in the summer and the ones I have seen work great. I will try to explain the method I have seen.

Holes called wells are drilled pretty deep (100-200 feet) and a closed water line is ran down and then back up each well so both ends are at the surface. The water lines are connected to form a continuous loop up and down each well and then inside to the house where it passes through the heat extracter and pump and other components. The whole system heats the house in the winter and cools the house in the summer by using earth's natural temperature.

At the start of each cycle, the water temperature enters the house at 56 degrees. The heat extracter pulls heat from the water solution coming into the house, lowering the water to about 35 degrees. The water is then pumped back through the wells where the earth warms the water back up to 56 degrees by the time it gets back to the house. During the summer the process just works in reverse. The water is used to heat and cool air that is distributed throughout the house with air ducts ran to each room.

The system is more complex than I can explain in text, but that is the basic idea. It costs 25-35k installed compared to 7-10k for a natural gas furnace and central air conditioner. It is generally too expensive to have installed in an existing home. It is most cost-beneficial in larger square foot structures that are expensive to heat. A local church saves 2k per month with their retrofitted system. A family moved in a new 3600 sq foot house we built from a 3000 sq foot house and they are saving 500 dollars per month in the winter on heating costs. That more than pays for their difference when its mortgaged into their new home. It also is cheaper to cool a house than a central air unit, but the advantage is smaller than the heating advantage.

I don't know the electrical requirements to try this off the grid. The system needs electricity all of the time so that would be a factor.

Thermoacoustic cooling. High pressure air pumped into a properly shaped area (accousitcal resonator) causes the air to leave the two exits in a fashion which results in one side being hot and the other being cold. No moving part other than the pump putting the air in. The same can be done to create thermoacoustic heating in a space. This is relatively simple engineering. The temperature difference between the two can reach 100 degrees. This will increase the air pressure inside so a venting will be needed and the pump should be outside as it creates its own heat. So, outside... incoming vent, air pressurinzing pump, thermoacoustic resonator, hot side exit vent. Inside, cool air vent and warm air vent to compensate for air pressure increase. No refrigerants, condensers, coils.

www.youtube.com/watch?v=jwV4GkniFNo

www.coolsound.us/work.html

Originally posted by darkhorserider
reply to post by JohnPhoenix

 

The wood here is fairly expensive, so this would not be economical if I were buying wood, but I have an old truck, and you can get a $5 permit to cut wood in the National Forest, and I enjoy splitting wood for exercise. So, I cut a truckload 3 or 4 times per year, costs less than $20, gets me and the kids out into the forest, and I save about $400 on propane compared to 3 years ago.

They let you cut wood in a national forest? I had no idea this was permitted anywhere, thought it was protected land?

Your best bet is to look into a high efficiency A/C unit. they have large units that will pull less watts then a hair dryer. there are also ones that will freeze a large amount of water overnight when its cheaper and more efficient to run the ac unit. it then builds up a large block of ice that cools your home during the day. look into very high S.E.E.R. ratings for ac units and i think youll be surprised

reply to post by JohnPhoenix



You can use a Vacuum pump to pull a vacuum on a closed vessel that contains water. You can get the water
to boil at 45 deg. You could blow a fan over the vessel or through tubes going through the vessel (like a fire tube boiler). This is about the simplest way I can explain, of course, There are other things to consider but, this will give you a starting point.

One could use fire from natural gas or propane to drive an ammonia and water refrigeration system. The only draw back would be the deadly gas that might escape. In the book Mosquito Coast an icemaker is built in the jungle like this. No moving parts!

jaxnmarko,

That concept of cooling with sound is very awesome but there doesn't seem to be enough details where I could build one for the home and they aren't for sale yet. Thanks though, I'll keep this in mind.

earthdude,

I loved that movie and for years wondered if that was possible. There are tons of solar ice makers it seems from a Google search like this one that was actually inspired by the movie Mosquito Coast.

greenupgrader.com...

But so far I cant find these plans. This unit was made for about 100 bucks. don't know if I could use it to cool my house but I'd sure use it for ice and food refrigeration ! Perhaps you can help me dig up these plans?

www.geothermal-dx.com...

geothermal is the best option but it might not be cheap.

you can also run water pipes down and back up for hot water

higher end units even generate power!

reply to post by ubeenhad


Very interesting video thanks. 2 problems. I can't afford to hire this guy to design my house and my wife would still insist on a cold 73 degrees year round,

reply to post by JohnPhoenix


Here is a how to on scribd. Not very detailed but maybe a good start.

It basically works like an Icy Ball but using solar energy as the heat source.

reply to post by daskakik


Thanks awesome. Now I can have "free" ice and refrigeration for food !

reply to post by JohnPhoenix


I dont know squat about air conditioning, but what I do know is that white only absorbs 5% of the suns rays and black absorbs 95%....so if you paint your house white and if possible have a white roof you cool your house with this simple step.....and install ceiling fans, you will be cool....not sure how to disperse the humidity though.

reply to post by JohnPhoenix


Build a giant tube that goes up into the atmosphere high enough to reach cool air. Then just suck it down.

Lol sounds easy enough.

reply to post by JohnPhoenix


Tell her to build it then.
Or trade her in for a model from around the equator. They wont mind the heat.

reply to post by JohnPhoenix


Maybe a little off topic.. But I saw a fridge once that worked without electricity. It was a simple idea in which a clay cylinder was placed within a second clay cylinder... The gap was filled with sand and then water which needed to be topped up, In a warm environment the inside chamber remained at about 4 degrees as the water was pulled out by the heat.. Just an idea..

The best thing I've seen is a PVC pipe with a computer fan and ultrasonic emitter on one end. The fan blows air
past the emitter which apparently removes a lot of the energy from the air from bashing it with sound waves and cools it down. Set up right and a 2 foot section of PVC pipe can literally blow snow out the other end if the humidity
is high enough. All electric, and uses very little electricity anyway.

I saw it on TV one time on some science news show. It was created by some engineering grad student. He was working on the patent at the time. Not sure what you would call it, as I can't find it online.

Originally posted by DejaVuAgain

Originally posted by darkhorserider
reply to post by JohnPhoenix

 

The wood here is fairly expensive, so this would not be economical if I were buying wood, but I have an old truck, and you can get a $5 permit to cut wood in the National Forest, and I enjoy splitting wood for exercise. So, I cut a truckload 3 or 4 times per year, costs less than $20, gets me and the kids out into the forest, and I save about $400 on propane compared to 3 years ago.

They let you cut wood in a national forest? I had no idea this was permitted anywhere, thought it was protected land?

I used to think that also. They permit is actually very cheap, $5 per day, and they have designated areas. There are many areas around where I live. You have to stop by a US Forestry Office and pay the small fee and get the pass tag, then they give you a map of the permitted areas. I swear they used to tell me to only cut downed trees, but now they say to leave the downed trees alone and only cut standing timber.

Cutting standing timber, by yourself, with a small chainsaw poses a little bit of a headache, but it can be done.