Children to be taught 'heterosexuality not the norm' in Australian schools project

Originally posted by Noinden
reply to post by WhisperingWinds

 

You brought it up. So you show it. I do know however the government would not allow a biased curriculum EITHER way to be implemented. So you are making the accusation of bias and agenda, you prove it. That is how this goes, oh and your source is about as unbiased as a lynch mob.

Actually I wasn't making the accusation, and I quoted no sources. I simply was replying to your statement below. So you brought it up, and its on you.

Actually that is EXACTLY what they are teaching. That different is ok, kids get bullied over a lot, and they really dod not need to have archaic prejudices encouraged.

You don't know EXACTLY what they are teaching , or do you ? That is why I asked about the curriculum.

But. if they are teaching our kids that people will be different, and it is NOT right to be bullied over it, that is good, and I agree wholeheartedly. I would also hope that would extend to those who may view homosexuality, or any sexual preferences in a different view, for whatever reasons, and they they are allowed to have their own viewpoints without being bullied and made to feel rejected.

Teaching children and even adults not to bully others because they will have a difference of opinion on sexual preferences, as well as many other issues in life, is a noble thing to be taught, but you can teach that to children now, and most all schools do, so we really don't need whatever special "curriculum " they had in mind that would undervalue what some parents teach their children in regards to sexual preference.

reply to post by WhisperingWinds


You are also making assumptions on what will be taught, and you are making a flap about it. Basically don't accuse others of actions you are making yourself! It is clear you have no idea what a reliable source is and what a biased one is.

Originally posted by Noinden
reply to post by WhisperingWinds

 

You are also making assumptions on what will be taught, and you are making a flap about it. Basically don't accuse others of actions you are making yourself! It is clear you have no idea what a reliable source is and what a biased one is.

I truely do not understand what your objection is? Many of us do not want to put our children's sex education in the hands of the Feds, and I think with good reason.

We have had a brave young gay teenager come into this thread and state what he wants and believes, and he has basically said he wants homosexuality to be taught as a subject that some people have different feelings...and I'm totally cool with that.....no reasonable loving person wants kids to feel "abnormal" for being different then the "norm"....for a variety of reasons......

This brave kid, who is the heart of this discussion doesn't want SEX, SEX, SEX.......shoved down his throat...and for the record, I am a big fan of Sex...and I think one of the most precious and wonderful parts of life, be it straight or gay is being exploited to the lowest common denominator.......oh geez...I guess I'm a romantic.....just too much sleez in this world for me.....

reply to post by MountainLaurel

I truely do not understand what your objection is? Many of us do not want to put our children's sex education in the hands of the Feds, and I think with good reason.

Do you have any information indicating that this program involves sex education?

reply to post by Phage


Well...let's just start with the fact it is called "Sex Education"....so a logical person could imply the purpose of the class is to teach about sex, yes?

I'm not gonna go into the "where's the proof" argument with you, and actually the fact that you have completly ignored some very important concerns being raised in this thread is bewildering to me, apparently your a respected member of ATS...so the lack of willingness on your part to even address the issues baffles me?

My "proof" is my research into the subject of public education, my "proof" is raising a child and my OBSERVATIONS of what is going down, my proof is hiking into the Bohemian Grove and hearing directly from the locals about what sleezy scumbags are running our country.....these "married" crazy old men would screw your teenager in a heartbeat...especially your sons.......

reply to post by ThirdEyeofHorus


Are you truly asking for elucidation? If so, I will gladly oblige you with such. If you only aspire to further impugn my agnostic world view in an attempt to feed your metaphysical superciliousness, then I must decline.

Originally posted by Wongbeedman
But if you don't agree with children being taught about it in schools then you're implying they don't deserve it, and that's an obvious form of discrimination.

No, I'm implying I don't want people teaching my children about homosexuality. That is my choice for my children and that should be respected...

Maybe our kids need to be taught more about discrimination against racial/sexual minorities? Surely that's fair?And yes in my opinion it does, not because you think homosexuality is wrong, but because you're teaching them that its wrong instead of letting them decide for themselves.

The truth is it wouldn't affect my kids. The point is I do not agree with political parties deciding what my children should and shouldn't be taught whether its right or wrong.

Personally I admit, I don't agree with it, its counter productive in my opinion.
But people have their own opinions, and I know mine means absolute zilch to everyone else.

Same here.. But when it comes to MY children, My opinion does mean something to me whether anyone agrees, disagrees. I find it offensive that someone thinks they can teach my children about their sexual life and preferences better than me and my daughters mother.

reply to post by MountainLaurel

Well...let's just start with the fact it is called "Sex Education"....so a logical person could imply the purpose of the class is to teach about sex, yes?

I guess I misunderstood. I thought we were talking about the topic of the thread. It is not called "sex education". It is not a sex eduction program, it is an anti-bullying program. It is exactly what vendettent (whom you seem to be sympathetic toward) was asking for.

reply to post by Phage


No reasonable person would be against anti-bullying programs, your premise that this would not effect how sex-ed is taught is unrealistic.....IMHO......

Yes, I do feel very almost "protective" of our young friend Vendettent, and honestly I'm not sure how to debate this subject at this point because there is now a kid involved, and I like him...

There are some wonderful teachers out there , but there are also some wack-jobs...I once had a teacher at age 15 tell me I would end up pregnant by 16...I have no idea why she would say that, I had a steady BF from age 12 till I went away to college...and yes, we were each other's first lover's......but she was wrong...

My daughter had some nut job teacher that once dropped a pencil on floor on purpose and made her bend over to pick it up...he wanted to humilate her...and it was actually one her classmates that told me about it....that was her last year in public school....I DO NOT TRUST that such a sensative and important issue as sexuality should be in the hands of public schools......not sure how better I can say this.....

Originally posted by MountainLaurel
reply to post by Phage

 

No reasonable person would be against anti-bullying programs, your premise that this would not effect how sex-ed is taught is unrealistic.....IMHO......

Care to tell us your reasoning in coming to that opinion?

reply to post by MountainLaurel


Just one question, would they teach the how to of heterosexual sex in a "Sex ed" program? Just curious as too your opinion.

The point remains this is an anti bullying program, which is the whole point of this sort of education. ALL kids should be safe from bullying no matter sexual orientation, gender, ethnicity, or religion and any combination there of.

reply to post by MountainLaurel


Did you see the NATION involved in this? Australia, now I know (from living in the USA for a decade) that many people in the states don't look far from their own state boarders or hell even the next town over (mind you that might be Wisconsin where I lived while I worked in Pharmaceutical manufacture), but please don't label every other nations problems with your own.

If you notice the source for this article in the OP is highly biased, I also believe that NO religion should have a say in education, I was under the impression the US beleived this at some point to "Something something separation of state and church something something"

It comes to this. It is an anti bullying education program.

Here is what appears to be a link to something to do with the program:

www.curriculumsupport.education.nsw.gov.au...

Note language like "Consider what is age and developmentally appropriate for students to learn about in relation to sexual diversity."

and

Respond to discrimination and harassment based on sexual diversity as effectively as you would acts of racism or sexism.

So this is a done deal. It is an Anti bullying program not a "how too" program. Jesus never decried homosexuality, and told you to "judge not" and "turn the other cheek".; Show some compassion like your savior did. Yes you just got told that by a pagan, who apparently knows more of your saviours teachings than you.

Originally posted by Noinden
reply to post by MountainLaurel

 

Jesus never decried homosexuality, and told you to "judge not" and "turn the other cheek".; Show some compassion like your savior did. Yes you just got told that by a pagan, who apparently knows more of your saviours teachings than you.

you forgot "love they neighbour...."

Atheists and Pagans 3, someone else nil....

Originally posted by Aloysius the Gaul

Originally posted by Noinden
reply to post by MountainLaurel

 

Jesus never decried homosexuality, and told you to "judge not" and "turn the other cheek".; Show some compassion like your savior did. Yes you just got told that by a pagan, who apparently knows more of your saviours teachings than you.

you forgot "love they neighbour...."

Atheists and Pagans 3, someone else nil....

Oh I don't know that sounds very ...umm hippie and liberal

Originally posted by DarknStormy

Originally posted by Wongbeedman
But if you don't agree with children being taught about it in schools then you're implying they don't deserve it, and that's an obvious form of discrimination.

No, I'm implying I don't want people teaching my children about homosexuality. That is my choice for my children and that should be respected...

Maybe our kids need to be taught more about discrimination against racial/sexual minorities? Surely that's fair?And yes in my opinion it does, not because you think homosexuality is wrong, but because you're teaching them that its wrong instead of letting them decide for themselves.

The truth is it wouldn't affect my kids. The point is I do not agree with political parties deciding what my children should and shouldn't be taught whether its right or wrong.

Personally I admit, I don't agree with it, its counter productive in my opinion.
But people have their own opinions, and I know mine means absolute zilch to everyone else.

Same here.. But when it comes to MY children, My opinion does mean something to me whether anyone agrees, disagrees. I find it offensive that someone thinks they can teach my children about their sexual life and preferences better than me and my daughters mother.

edit on 24-10-2012 by DarknStormy because: (no reason given)

I would say that you can teach them whatever they like. And society, be it through school, or just plain living in the world, will make known its attitudes whether you like it or not.

reply to post by Phage


Not even an anti-bullying program I just think it would be resonable to include all students in sex education so they can get the right information.
Not even exactly details that are extremely specific, I just believe a public school is for all types of children while private schools can be more specific. Due to this shouldent a public school recognize all significant groups of people in there school? Something that affects 3-10% of children is a significant number that would guarantee there are children like that in public schools. Something like 0.001% or 00.1% would obviously be insignificant but up to 1 in ten children is pretty large.

I don't think it would be appropriate to force all children to learn about homosexuality in extreme detail and it would ignore parents who disapprove. Briefly touching on the subject in a relativity large unit should be a happy compromise? Should it not?

reply to post by vendettent

I agree completely. In the context of sex education, I don't think homosexuality need be covered in depth for the general student population. It needs to be discussed because it exists, yes, but most of the kids will be aware of that anyway. But gays should be able to receive additional counseling if they desire it.

But that "additional" factor in itself may set them apart from the straights. That may be a good reason for homosexuality to be specifically addressed by anti-bullying programs as well. To accentuate that there is no reason for them to be the target of bullying just as no other group is.

Does that make sense to you?

Originally posted by thebtheb
I would say that you can teach them whatever they like. And society, be it through school, or just plain living in the world, will make known its attitudes whether you like it or not.

Whats society got to do with it?

This is a political group pushing this agenda, not society. Society really doesn't care from what I can see and hear.

reply to post by DarknStormy

Society really doesn't care from what I can see and hear.

Perhaps your corner of society. Some other parts of society have some compassion and don't like to see anyone bullied or ostracized because they are different.

Originally posted by Phage
reply to post by DarknStormy

 

Society really doesn't care from what I can see and hear.

Perhaps your corner of society. Some other parts of society have some compassion and don't like to see anyone bullied or ostracized because they are different.

No-one wants to see anyone bullied but the problem I have is that this isn't a problem here. Homosexuals can doing everything a straight person can.. They work, run businesses, go to the local for a beer, they have it great here and do not get harrassed. That is in society and I bet what I just pointed out is better than the way things were 30-40 years back when a beating was a common occurence.

The problem I have with introducing it to the schools is that some kids may not know or realise what homosexuality is (in other words they don't have the knowledge to bully in the first place) and with that, I see that it could be influencing children at the same time.