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Boat race protester gets six months prison for upsetting the elite.

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posted on Oct, 20 2012 @ 03:52 PM
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We need a whole lot more of people like this guy protesting against the elites.

Trenton Oldfield is a hero.
edit on 20-10-2012 by poet1b because: Add name




posted on Oct, 20 2012 @ 04:00 PM
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Wow, the more replies I read in this topic, the more surprised I am that any supposed free-thinking ATS members genuinely think 6 months in prison is appropriate for disrupting an amateur rowing race through peaceful protest.
The guy may well have been misguided and all the rest of it, but judging from some of the replies here it seems I may have joined the wrong forum...I thought this was a place where folk rejected state oppression and disproportionate punishment for minor crimes?



posted on Oct, 20 2012 @ 04:13 PM
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reply to post by Wrabbit2000
 


You don`t get it do you ?
That`s what protesting is all about.

The thread is about how the prison sentence is an attack on the right to a peaceful protest.
He got six months because they want us to know that you`re not allowed to protest any more.

He put himself in danger and was lucky not to be killed.
It was a crazy thing to do but that`s in the history of protesting.

He was expecting to be punished but not so severely and if you and others agree to six months in prison compared to other crimes and criminals....well i`m afraid you might as well just lay down and let these criminal elite, government and bankers take every single right and bit of freedom you have left.

This is why we are in this state because too many people go with the flow created by criminals disguising as government.



posted on Oct, 20 2012 @ 04:16 PM
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reply to post by grainofsand
 

If he's been raising hell and causing headaches at the Admin centers of the schools....or even the homes of the Deans if he wanted to get real spunky, Id say he was targeting right on those he aimed at.

In this case?? All he did was screw up the day of some other private citizens who were trying to pursue a sport it takes a fair % of their waking hours to build and maintain the cutting edge for.

Just where is the line when it's NOT state or corps an individual protester is hurting or disrupting but private citizens who did nothing, as people, to deserve any of the grief a stunt like this brings? Is there ANY line where violating other people's rights to display someone's own issue with something has gone too far or does the fact it's all done in "protest" forgive and allow *ANY* behavior the protester deems fit?

If it's the latter, we're one step from Anarchy and falling there quick by that logic, allowed to play out as I see it.



posted on Oct, 20 2012 @ 04:24 PM
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Originally posted by Wrabbit2000


From the other side.. SURE ..Oxford and Cambridge are what I'd call 'Elite' too. The Schools, anyway. I don't know the guys in the boats.


Then you can't understand this. That's the point many of these people are making. The UK is a classist nation at it's core. Like this nation worships money and status, the UK worships money and class. That is why that man jumped in the river. Certainly there are better ways of saying that, but I don't think it deserves six months in prison.



posted on Oct, 20 2012 @ 04:46 PM
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Before anyone else gets too far into telling me all about what I do or do not understand about putting my butt on the line for what I believe in, let me share something.

Occupt St. Louis - Keiner Plaza General Assembly Meeting - October 16, 2011.

Your humble rabbit is the guy holding stack with the clipboard for General Assembly that morning. I'm wearing a white 99% Occupy STL T-Shirt and while I avoided too much face time, I couldn't much avoid being a serious presence on this particular video. You see, I was a protester THAT morning twice over. If anyone listens to the Gun debate portion of that meeting. I'm among those strongly 'protesting' my right to G.A. to carry my weapon in camp, any way I saw fit with my properly issued Permit.


That wasn't a backwater Occupy camp either. We had the direct and very personal attentions of the United States Secret Service and Michelle Obama herself walked through our camp. Unfortunately...or quite deliberately..given my carry status...that happened during a brief few hours around dawn one morning, while I was down here refilling my 4x4 with hundreds in food and supplies for Camp.

So... yeah.. I DO get it. I've been there, done that and literally looked back up the scopes of Federal snipers who were looking right down at ME, in that camp, while Michelle Obama and Biden's wife enjoyed the World Series 3 blocks away.


*I* went knowing full well I may be arrested,...I may be beaten..I may have even been killed. All that, I knew going in...and I wouldn't have ASKED for any exceptions or quarter nor would I have GIVEN ANY had things gone badly.

You pay your money and you take your chances. I paid mine and he paid his. My tab didn't come due to pay....that time. His did. Sympathy ain't there.....and respect only would have been if he'd have taken his lumps like a man and not a whiner. I would have and those I stood with in Occupy DID take it when later, the end did come for that camp.

Thanks for assuming things about me though. I'm a walking contradiction in some very major ways and it usually insures assumptions made turn out wrong far more often than not.

(* Please forgive the fact I look lost and something like a deer in the headlights. At that point in time I'd had exactly 0 training in Public Speaking or even standing before a crowd comfortably. Today would be a far different bunny...but hey, we all start the learning process at some point, right?)



posted on Oct, 20 2012 @ 04:47 PM
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Originally posted by Wrabbit2000
If he's been raising hell and causing headaches at the Admin centers of the schools....or even the homes of the Deans if he wanted to get real spunky, Id say he was targeting right on those he aimed at.

...and no-one would know about it so the efforts would have been futile.


Originally posted by Wrabbit2000In this case?? All he did was screw up the day of some other private citizens who were trying to pursue a sport it takes a fair % of their waking hours to build and maintain the cutting edge for.

So this half hour 'screw up' for an amateur rowing team deserves 6 months prison...really?!


Originally posted by Wrabbit2000Just where is the line when it's NOT state or corps an individual protester is hurting or disrupting but private citizens who did nothing, as people, to deserve any of the grief a stunt like this brings?

Do you honestly think half an hour of disruption to a rowing race, without injury or material loss to anyone, deserves 6 months prison along with the associated taxpayer costs of benefits and welfare on release due to job/home loss?


Originally posted by Wrabbit2000Is there ANY line where violating other people's rights to display someone's own issue with something has gone too far or does the fact it's all done in "protest" forgive and allow *ANY* behavior the protester deems fit?

Of course there is, but temporarily disrupting a rowing race without harm to anyone surely does not deserve 6 months prison time...or are you one of the ATS posters who surprise me by their apparent love of authority and disproportionate justice?



posted on Oct, 20 2012 @ 04:48 PM
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reply to post by Wrabbit2000
 





Before anyone else gets too far into telling me all about what I do or do not understand about putting my butt on the line for what I believe in, let me share something.


That is not what I said, thanks for trying though.



posted on Oct, 20 2012 @ 04:54 PM
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reply to post by antonia
 

I didn't direct that reply to any one person specifically....and it was left vague very deliberately. I usually keep such things general because making a debate personal, as some insist on doing, is not something I've found necessary...or productive. Aside from that, if a couple said it...many more were thinking it, I'm sure, and clarification seemed helpful on that point.

Just because I don't support the right of ANYONE to violate the rights of anyone ELSE for any cause they personally think warrants it, doesn't mean anything MORE than I don't support exactly what I just said. Nothing more. Nothing less and I swear...SOME folks spend far more time reading what isn't between the lines of what people write than what IS being said.



posted on Oct, 20 2012 @ 05:06 PM
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Originally posted by Wrabbit2000
reply to post by antonia
 

I didn't direct that reply to any one person specifically....and it was left vague very deliberately. I usually keep such things general because making a debate personal, as some insist on doing, is not something I've found necessary...or productive.


Addressing the point someone else made to that person is not making it "personal".


Just because I don't support the right of ANYONE to violate the rights of anyone ELSE for any cause they personally think warrants it, doesn't mean anything MORE than I don't support exactly what I just said.



And they violate that man's rights everyday. That's the point. Why should it be so much worse for him to violate their rights when they have no respect for his?



posted on Oct, 20 2012 @ 05:08 PM
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Originally posted by Wrabbit2000

I don't support the right of ANYONE to violate the rights of anyone ELSE for any cause they personally think warrants it


Not sure any rights were violated here...just some amateur sports got disrupted for half an hour...not sure that 6 months jail is appropriate for what actually happened.



posted on Oct, 20 2012 @ 05:10 PM
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Can I just say, that people in the U.S get a very sanitised version of what it is like to live in this class driven society.

We have seen schulyer attempt to tell us where we went wrong as a nation, Boncho telling us that Oxbridge isn't full of elites and come on there is a scholarship scheme available and now Wrabbit advising us that upsetting people in this fashion effects the whole of society.

Let me tell you all something. The money people run this country, they have even infiltrated the working class party (Labour). The leaders of the two main parties are Bilderbergers and they stick to the agenda of the E.U regardless of what they have promised previously.

We live in a world of self serving individuals intent on bringing in the New World Order and most of our populations are sleep walking into this Orwellian nightmare.

It's time to wake people up, they need to smell the coffee and we need to get strong. They are few, we are many. It's time to say enough is enough and screw the financial consequences, we are already paying for the mess the
'Elite' have made!!!
edit on 20/10/12 by Cobaltic1978 because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 20 2012 @ 05:13 PM
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reply to post by Cobaltic1978
 


If only you stopped interrupting their silly classist activities maybe they'll throw more scraps off the table.
It difficult for Americans understand something they haven't lived through. Here we just worship money and almost anyone can get that. It's a lot more difficult to somehow be reborn into the right family.



posted on Oct, 20 2012 @ 05:16 PM
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Originally posted by Cobaltic1978
Can I just say, that people in the U.S get a very sanitised version of what it is like to live in this class driven society.

We have seen schulyer attempt to tell us where we went wrong as a nation, Boncho telling us that Oxbridge isn't full of elites and come on there is a scholarship scheme available and now Wrabbit advising us that upsetting people in this fashion effects the whole of society.

Let me tell you all something. The money people run this country, they have even infiltrated the working class party (Labour). The leaders of the two main parties are Bilderbergers and they stick to the agenda of the E.U regardless of what they have promised previously.

We live in a world of self serving individuals intent on bringing in the New World Order and most of our populations are sleep walking into this Orwellian nightmare.

It's time to wake people up, they need to smell the coffee and we need to get strong. They are few, we are many. It's time to say enough is enough and screw the financial consequences, we are already paying for the mess the
'Elite' have made!!!
edit on 20/10/12 by Cobaltic1978 because: (no reason given)



Great post !
Why is no-one seeing this ?
Gotta star you for that.



posted on Oct, 20 2012 @ 05:18 PM
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reply to post by antonia
 


I see.. Which man in which boat had no respect for his rights? Which individual he interrupted the perfectly legal and legitimate sports activity of, was the guilty one who deserved his protest at THEM, Personally??

Protest is great..when it accomplishes something. Anything. This accomplished..what? He went to jail. People who would have supported him ANYWAY...support him now. People who wouldn't have can now add idiot to what comes to mind when his name comes up. In the end, what was accomplished beyond his arrest and a criminal record for this?

Did Government even give one passing seconds worth of thought to anything he was doing it for? Hmm.. to laugh at the futility, perhaps, but nothing more. The brave Soldiers of the British Military we heard about marching on parliament got attention, respect and in the end..DID get something accomplished, even if it was a small thing for reconsideration of the disbanding of a unit.

See the difference? One protest was well thought out, planned for maximum IMPACT and RESULT and it got precisely what it set out to get in what I understood the narrow focus to be. The other? Got wet, arrested, prosecuted and 6 months older....to make a total fool of himself.

I respect one. I laugh at the other when I don't feel pity for the guy thinking it could matter.....while disrupting this event in the process. It's just that simple.



posted on Oct, 20 2012 @ 05:22 PM
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reply to post by Wrabbit2000
 


You arguing something subjective. While you think it accomplished nothing there are many others here arguing that it did accomplish something. So which is it?



posted on Oct, 20 2012 @ 05:27 PM
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reply to post by antonia
 

Then enjoy your subjective thread and topic..... I'm being as specific to the topic at hand, the very specific actions of this man and his effect on a private boat race as I can be without having been there to add eyewitness context for additional background.

If the replies I take time to form are to get nothing but zingers and slogans... I'll move on where two sided debate may be had. It seems exceptionally hard to find here, as everyone seems 100% staked and camped on Mt. Ideology and nothing..but nothing that contradicts that first rule of life, for some, will ever be considered...let alone seriously looked at.

I'll check back later to see if anything but cheap shots and sniping came..but enough for now. I've had it for awhile, wasting real, measurable time in forming replies I put thought into just to get a snarky slogan in reply.



posted on Oct, 20 2012 @ 05:28 PM
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Originally posted by antonia
reply to post by Wrabbit2000
 


You arguing something subjective. While you think it accoamplished nothing there are many others here arguing that it did accomplish something. So which is it?

Good question...love of the state seems to be how some folk here live their lives...how can anyone think 6 months is appropriate when some street robbers get community service?!



posted on Oct, 20 2012 @ 05:31 PM
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Originally posted by Wrabbit2000
reply to post by antonia
 



I'll check back later to see if anything but cheap shots and sniping came..but enough for now. I've had it for awhile, wasting real, measurable time in forming replies I put thought into just to get a snarky slogan in reply.



If you think that's what I did then report it, but the point still stands. It is an entirely subjective question as to how useful it was.




Then enjoy your subjective thread and topic..... I'm being as specific to the topic at hand, the very specific actions of this man and his effect on a private boat race as I can be without having been there to add eyewitness context for additional background.


Ok, but this still doesn't change the fact that your view of what is and is not useful is a subjective opinion.
edit on 20-10-2012 by antonia because: clarity



posted on Oct, 20 2012 @ 05:33 PM
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Originally posted by poet1b
reply to post by ANOK
 


You almost got that right.

Libertarianism, the whole tea bagger thing, where people support free market capitalism the turns control of our country to the ICs.

I agree, liberal elites are almost as bad as conservative elites.

A true liberal sees individual rights as above the rights of institutions, while the elites see just the opposite.


The thing is even the conservative elite capitalists support liberalism. The true conservative elite do not support libertarianism. They need big government. All elites are bad, they use liberalism and conservatism to further their agendas. They have no allegiance to anything other than their own capitalist interests, and will use whatever they need to. Modern politics is just a smoke-screen, a soap opera to keep the people passive.

The elites are not liberals, they use liberalism to pacify the people. Liberalism is how the capitalist class reduced the threat of worker rebellion and revolution like what happened in Spain, 1936.

Look at history, take Winston Churchill a staunch conservative from the ruling class who was also a Liberal Party leader in 1908. In 1908 the workers were forming their own revolutionary workers party that became the Labour Party in opposition to the Liberal Party. The liberals have always tried to pass themselves off as 'left-wing', and even 'socialist', but the real working class left was always apposed to liberalism. Post-WWII, after working class solidarity was destroyed, the liberals became the new 'left-wing' and the true revolutionary working class left of pre-WWII was all but gone.

"Liberalism is not socialism, and never will be", Winston Churchill

He didn't predict the future too well but he was right liberalism is not socialism.


edit on 10/20/2012 by ANOK because: (no reason given)



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