Right to Resist - Overturned

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posted on Oct, 11 2012 @ 12:45 PM
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Back in May 2011, this thread was posted - www.abovetopsecret.com...

Basically stating that Indiana citizens have no right to resist police forces entering their home illegally.


Overturning a common law dating back to the English Magna Carta of 1215, the Indiana Supreme Court ruled Thursday that Hoosiers have no right to resist unlawful police entry into their homes. In a 3-2 decision, Justice Steven David writing for the court said if a police officer wants to enter a home for any reason or no reason at all, a homeowner cannot do anything to block the officer's entry.


Today, I found this, dated May 2012 - www.officer.com... controversial-right-to-resist-bill

I'm not entirely sure if it's been posted before, I searched and only found the original ruling. Basically, this one reverses it, and allows Indiana citizens the use of force against illegal home entry by police.


Gov. Mitch Daniels has signed into law a measure that allows homeowners to use force when resisting police entry into their homes in some cases. The bill was a response to the public uproar over a state Supreme Court ruling that residents could not resist officers, even during an illegal entry. The measure specifies that residents are protected by the state's self-defense law if they reasonably believe force is necessary to protect themselves from unlawful actions by an officer.


The only drawback I see from this, is someone getting killed while exercising their now Court-backed rights.
Is this a sign that maybe we peons actually have some backers in the court system? Maybe.


Edit to add: Someone needs to take a look at the way your forum coding is parsing [url links. I wasn't able to use a description of the URL after the tags, I had to use the URL itself, otherwise the link wouldn't work.
edit on 11-10-2012 by mattdel because: (no reason given)




posted on Oct, 11 2012 @ 12:52 PM
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So "private property" is only private when it's convenient to the people who are supposed to protect you but might be tempted to bend the rules for their own twisted gratification?

Okay, as long as we're clear on that. By the way, on a completely unrelated note, how much does a ticket to Canada cost this time of year?
edit on 11-10-2012 by AfterInfinity because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 11 2012 @ 12:58 PM
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Police entering someones home should either be:

1) Andy Griffith like - "Hey Andy, come on in."



posted on Oct, 11 2012 @ 01:08 PM
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I should add - if I were a scumbag and someone kicked in my door yelling police I would probably think - 'yeah, that makes sense.'

I'm not though, so I'm not going to believe it. I think maybe that is where the police are running in to some problems - you can't kick in the average working/taxpaying/American's door and not expect to have lead fired back at you. Its safer sticking with the scumbags.



posted on Oct, 11 2012 @ 01:14 PM
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I think this whole bill allowing lethal defense against law enforcement was a bad bad idea. I see the points the supporters made with it but it's so far over the top and into the land of fantasies and wishful thinking it's not even funny. It's dangerous.

Cops go too far..of course some do...Court is where that is settled after a try to Internal Affairs gets results or gets a laugh and a hang up. However, I absolutely DO NOT want to see the ability to KILL those society puts in a place of keeping order based on 330 MILLION different judgments and concepts of what is 'justified'.

Not only is that aspect insane on the face of it....but just HOW bad and HOW brutal would people LIKE the cops to become anyway??

What does everyone expect Police attitudes to be toward the public as a whole after, say, a few of their brethren were shot to death under THIS law and..gee.. damn, sorry about that. OOPS... Circumstances probably weren't 100% what they seemed..but hey, killing the "pig" was legal, so what the hell right?

If cops were bad before...if people thought they were brutal BEFORE....see a law like this actually be USED a few times without consequence to the shooter and we'll think of 1980's Soviet Russia as a free wheeling and fun place to have been by comparison.

Bad Bad problems don't justify BAD IDEAS to solve them. It just makes everything worse, IMO.



posted on Oct, 11 2012 @ 04:35 PM
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Originally posted by Wrabbit2000
Cops go too far..of course some do...Court is where that is settled after a try to Internal Affairs gets results or gets a laugh and a hang up. However, I absolutely DO NOT want to see the ability to KILL those society puts in a place of keeping order based on 330 MILLION different judgments and concepts of what is 'justified'.


Your police are getting away with Murder left, right and center. We don't have guns over here. But thankfully we don't, yet, have 'those society puts in a place of keeping order' shooting dogs and people like its a sport.


Not only is that aspect insane on the face of it....but just HOW bad and HOW brutal would people LIKE the cops to become anyway??


Let me rephrase that.. "but just HOW bad and HOW brutal would Cops like People to become anyway." - Considering the lack of recourse the public inevitably has.


What does everyone expect Police attitudes to be toward the public as a whole after, say, a few of their brethren were shot to death under THIS law and..gee.. damn, sorry about that. OOPS...


Again, let me rephrase that "What does everyone expect Citizens attitudes to be toward the Police as a whole after, say, a few of their brethren were shot to death...."

I find it quite disheartening that someone could be against a law that could protect (at least a little) rightful Citizens from feeling safer in their homes.

Truly a strange view, and I don't even live over there.



posted on Oct, 11 2012 @ 04:53 PM
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reply to post by AdamOver
 


We could be approaching a point where old-west justice is preferable to police enforcement. The police are now tax collectors in their current role. A few hundred posse-style hangings would probably go a lot farther at curbing anti-social behavior than 20 million imprisonments. Criminals do not fear the public so they feel empowered over them but that wasn't always the case. Piss off a large group of people and you were as good as done. We need militia to deal with the serious elements (e.g. gangs) and sheriffs and posses to deal with other individuals.

If I knew I could commit a crime and probably be convicted and subsequently released due to overcrowding vs knowing I might be hunted down by a gangs of pissed off twitchy fingered men rifles and dogs I would probably prefer the former.

We transferred the right to self-defense to the government a long long time ago and they started 'expanding' the powers from sheriff/justice of the peace to tax collection and social engineering.



posted on Oct, 11 2012 @ 05:06 PM
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Originally posted by AdamOver
Again, let me rephrase that "What does everyone expect Citizens attitudes to be toward the Police as a whole after, say, a few of their brethren were shot to death...."


We should question the role of police entirely. Get them out of the law enforcement business (which is tax collection) and back to maintaining peace and empower the people and militias to start dealing with things.

Its a question of effectiveness. 8 or 9 million people in correctional supervision and instances where a person can be a repeat offender not 2 or 3 time but TWO HUNDRED times. Are you kidding me? If the system worked then sure I'd be all for it but the majority of police resources is spent in tax collection activities under the guise of law enforcement and only a small portion is used to keep the peace and they have become disconnected and abusive in their treatment of the law first to the offenders of peace and now to the offenders of tax collection laws. They just 'process' the offenders and then hand them off to a justice system that is as completely broken which holds those people and most often returns them to the streets without any rehabilitation.

The best example I've seen is a town which started shaming drug dealers and requiring them to work jobs, have big-brother style monitoring and re-assimilate them in to society holding the criminal evidence over their heads as leverage. Those people actually seemed to become rehabilitated and the town better off rather than sending them through the revolving door of the criminal system.

Of that 8 or 9 million I bet 3 out of 4 are non-violent crimes which could have been handled in a completely different manner.



posted on Oct, 11 2012 @ 05:33 PM
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Yep, same deal here. Thousands in prison for pathetic things like smoking a bit of weed, drunk and disorderly, minor driving offences, and a myriad of non-harmful-to-others charges. Costing the taxpayer millions each year.

The police need to be put back in their cage, they're becoming too militarised. They also need to stop pestering the citizens with bullsh!t and get back to catching real criminals.



posted on Oct, 12 2012 @ 10:14 PM
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Originally posted by AdamOver

Originally posted by Wrabbit2000
Cops go too far..of course some do...Court is where that is settled after a try to Internal Affairs gets results or gets a laugh and a hang up. However, I absolutely DO NOT want to see the ability to KILL those society puts in a place of keeping order based on 330 MILLION different judgments and concepts of what is 'justified'.


Your police are getting away with Murder left, right and center. We don't have guns over here. But thankfully we don't, yet, have 'those society puts in a place of keeping order' shooting dogs and people like its a sport.


Not only is that aspect insane on the face of it....but just HOW bad and HOW brutal would people LIKE the cops to become anyway??


Let me rephrase that.. "but just HOW bad and HOW brutal would Cops like People to become anyway." - Considering the lack of recourse the public inevitably has.


What does everyone expect Police attitudes to be toward the public as a whole after, say, a few of their brethren were shot to death under THIS law and..gee.. damn, sorry about that. OOPS...


Again, let me rephrase that "What does everyone expect Citizens attitudes to be toward the Police as a whole after, say, a few of their brethren were shot to death...."

I find it quite disheartening that someone could be against a law that could protect (at least a little) rightful Citizens from feeling safer in their homes.

Truly a strange view, and I don't even live over there.


I will not address the Guy Fawkes avatar you have, and the disconnect in your apparent viewpoints. But instead, let me ask you if you know what the red "A" symbol in your avatar means?

If so, how do you reconcile the philosophy of anarchy with your above statements?





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