Borat Is A Religiously vilifying and racist Creation...so why is it not banned?

Originally posted by Pilot

Originally posted by Pilot
Can someone point to a piece where Mr Cohen parodies the right wing zionist war mongers with the same relish as the creepy racist xtians or muslims?? I would like to see that. It has been mentioned that he makes fun of Jews too. OK, Jews are not zionist warmongers.

Anybody??

I was trying to find a link on youtube but it doesn't show the clips I am looking for however, you will see his gay chasidic outfit in the most religious part of jerusalem where they chase him, they really wanted to kill him, I think. Also, when he tries to mediate peace between Israel and the Palestinians he is just as insulting to the Israeli government.

The point is he insults everyone, there is no bias against Islam and Borat is not an Islamic character at all!

Originally posted by Dr Expired
For those who not know of Borat.
www.movieministry.com...

Is Borat allowed to be aired because of the actors own religion?

Imagine if Borat was a depiction of an Israeli Jew.

It would never ever be aired on TV , or shown in the theatre.

The creator would be charged.

So why the double standard?

It is certainly a dangerous precedent, or perhaps not new to those who are impartial.

edit on 11-10-2012 by Dr Expired because: Title

edit on 11-10-2012 by Dr Expired because: clarifying the issue

It is classed under comedy...i don't really see a problem with it.

reply to post by GogoVicMorrow


Dude you're reading too far into this movie. You need to take a step back, take a few breaths of air then realize that it is just a comedy. He is trying to show how ignorant Americans are. I guess the point of the movie flew WAY over your head. I happened to read that article you posted and while the Khazak government hated the movie, the article went onto say that actual people from that country LOVED that movie. So your own article that you keep defending as proof of his racism actually doesn't support your cause at all.

The Kazakh tabloid Karavan declared Borat to be the best film of the year, having had a reviewer see the film at a screening in Vienna. The paper claimed that it was "...certainly not an anti-Kazakh, anti-Romanian or anti-Semitic" film but rather "cruelly anti-American ... amazingly funny and sad at the same time."[95] Another favorable word came from Kazakh novelist Sapabek Asip-uly, who suggested Baron Cohen be nominated for the annual award bestowed by the Kazakh Club of Art Patrons. In a letter published by the newspaper Vremya, Asip-uly wrote, "(Borat) has managed to spark an immense interest of the whole world in Kazakhstan—something our authorities could not do during the years of independence. If state officials completely lack a sense of humor, their country becomes a laughing stock."[96] Amazon UK has also reported significant numbers of orders of Borat on DVD from Kazakhstan.[97] The film is also watched regularly by the Kazakhstan national football team's players.[98]

abovetopsecret

From the very article you linked. Balls in your court Holmes.

Borat was made simply to perpetuate the Myth (lie) that countries like Kazakhstan are backwards, unintelligent, lower cultured then the west, and how stupid Americans are.

There are people that believed it was real, and then there ones who got the joke but would still think it was an accurate description of Kazakhstan!

Not many would know that most of current Rocket launches to space station happen in that country...

i havnt seen "the dictator" yet.

i was very curious

reply to post by GogoVicMorrow

No.. Borat get's away with it because in the western world it's ok to be racist towards Muslims. That's it.

Do Muslims worship The Hawk? Borat explicitly states that in Kazakhstan, people worship The Hawk. Have you actually seen the movie, or have you just been making the assumption that because the titular character supposedly comes from a country that exists in the real world, the satire is based on the real world inhabitants of that country. In fact, Baron-Cohen's portrayal of "Kazakhstan" is based on rural Russia. Imperial Russia banned all the Jews to a zone of settlement called "The Pale," as in, "beyond The Pale." As a result, Russian peasantry knew very little of the actual customs of European Jews, allowing them to imagine them as supernatural folkloric demons, as they are presented in the "Kazakhstan" of the film. Baron-Cohen satirizes this ignorance on the one hand, while satirizing and exploiting the ignorance of Americans. If the people who appear in the film knew anything at all about Kazakhstan, it was that it was a former part of the Soviet Union. If it was in the Soviet Union, the people must be Russians, right? For a grotesquely over the top film, the subtlety is dazzling.

Double standard? Sacha Baron Cohen IS JEWISH.

That point aside, do you really believe a movie like Borat incites hate?

reply to post by Hongkongphooey


It would be great to see the clips you describe. Now, here is an excerpt from an article I linked to earlier, not sure if anyone saw it:

You see, SBC is a Zionist, a very publicly declared one. Which is not a problem for me personally, really. He's got the right to hold his political views even if they are very bigoted ones that have been the root of most of the strife in the Middle East since 1948. But he's got a very deliberate agenda which he expresses not-so-subtly in all his movies, and it's not being said by commentators because of the fear that they will be called anti-Semitic.

the comments on the blog piece echo the comments here, people running to the defense of this dude because he makes them laugh!! And Jimmy Savile was a great guy too!!

the true cure for racism and other 'isms, is to face it head on and see things from all viewpoints. be it in humor or in serious discussion.
to hide from it (ban it, get angry, attack other views) just encourages the separation of people and ideas.

the point of the movie IS to feel offended. at ourselves, at other ignorants, and at the non existent character. its self educating. its better to achieve acceptance through ourselves then to just be brainwashed with good feelings through social programming.

Originally posted by Pilot
reply to post by Hongkongphooey

 

It would be great to see the clips you describe. Now, here is an excerpt from an article I linked to earlier, not sure if anyone saw it:

You see, SBC is a Zionist, a very publicly declared one. Which is not a problem for me personally, really. He's got the right to hold his political views even if they are very bigoted ones that have been the root of most of the strife in the Middle East since 1948. But he's got a very deliberate agenda which he expresses not-so-subtly in all his movies, and it's not being said by commentators because of the fear that they will be called anti-Semitic.

the comments on the blog piece echo the comments here, people running to the defense of this dude because he makes them laugh!! And Jimmy Savile was a great guy too!!

As I stated earlier, British Jews understand the term zionism to mean something very different to what is portrayed on ATS. They understand it to want to live in Israel, that is all. They do not breed hatred towards Palestinians or advocate stealing land. Most support this definition of Zionism and will visit Israel, maybe work on a kibbutz or even stay. However, here ATS it is determined that if your are described as a Zionist you are an evil, babykilling, land stealing, banker with a gun which is so far from the truth.

As Baron-Cohen has chosen to remain in the UK and retain a UK passport then I suspect he is not what you describe! Why is his characters are allowed to insult Jews, Blacks, Christians, Uzbeks, Gypsies, etc., but its only when he also parodies a Muslim does he then get accused of having an agenda!

I did not see the Romanies complain about his 'Gypsy Woman' content or African Americans scream about his interaction scene with young Blacks, nor do I hear Jews complain about the blatent anti-semitism shown which could be interpreted as being the worst (throwing money to shapeshifting Jew cockroaches) or gays complaining about his antics and the reason is they all understand what he is doing and have a sense of humour!

Again, Borat Sagdiev is not a Muslim character, Ali G was not Muslim, Bruno was not Muslim however, the Dictator was and all very, very funny! If you don't like him, don't watch him, he does not have an agenda against Muslims, he is just shocking people into responses and waking up people to the reality of how silly much of our beliefs and notions are.

Yesterday, i contributed to a thread about China and many peoples misconceptions were so funny, saying they would never go there because the police follow you around and spy on you and its safer to stay in USA, unbelievable and ridiculous.

reply to post by abeverage

Agree with Abeaverage - Sacha Baron Cohen is playing on people's perceptions rather than actualities. So he is playing on people's perception of Khazakstan and then taking it a little further into absurdity (something we seem to do well in the UK). Khazakstan hated their portrayal and then 6 months later changed their mind, understood the joke and used it for their tourist industry.

I do think some of his humour can be cruel - I think his biggest target are the American people (just an opinion), especially the deep south.

I genuinely do not see the religious overtone in this. His hatred for the jews is outrageous and naive but nowhere does he offer an explanation or justify this - it is another part of the absurdity.

There is another debate going on here about whether religion is sacrosanct and humour should not be made of it. Personally I think that religion is always better and evolving if it is being questioned and satire fires those questions from a different direction. If a religion cannot take a little bit of satire then that really is a poor show. And yes we have this imbalance of many religions being the brunt of jokes with the exception of Islam simply because the people who create the satire are too scared.

Originally posted by Dr Expired
reply to post by Monger

 

Name one mainstream movie or TV show in the west that regularly ridicules Israeli Jews via a fictional character creation.

I will wait forever, prove me wrong.

Mel Brooks movies.
Charlie Chaplin (The Great Dictator).

reply to post by Hongkongphooey


So where are those examples of him satirizing zionist warmongers??
Sorry, I don't buy your explanation. We aren't discussing British perception of what a Zioinist is.

Originally posted by templar knight
reply to post by abeverage

 

Agree with Abeaverage - Sacha Baron Cohen is playing on people's perceptions rather than actualities. So he is playing on people's perception of Khazakstan and then taking it a little further into absurdity (something we seem to do well in the UK). Khazakstan hated their portrayal and then 6 months later changed their mind, understood the joke and used it for their tourist industry.

I do think some of his humour can be cruel - I think his biggest target are the American people (just an opinion), especially the deep south.

I genuinely do not see the religious overtone in this. His hatred for the jews is outrageous and naive but nowhere does he offer an explanation or justify this - it is another part of the absurdity.

There is another debate going on here about whether religion is sacrosanct and humour should not be made of it. Personally I think that religion is always better and evolving if it is being questioned and satire fires those questions from a different direction. If a religion cannot take a little bit of satire then that really is a poor show. And yes we have this imbalance of many religions being the brunt of jokes with the exception of Islam simply because the people who create the satire are too scared.

Thanks, an obvious observation.
He is Jewish and I have not seen actual hatred of his people or did I miss something other then Self-deprecation. Certainly does poke fun at the Southerners (not that I blame him sometimes...LOL)

Seriously!? A thread on Borat!? Have you got nothing better to do with your time...

Originally posted by Dr Expired
reply to post by Monger

 

Name one mainstream movie or TV show in the west that regularly ridicules Israeli Jews via a fictional character creation.

I will wait forever, prove me wrong.

Look at just about any Mel Brooks movie...

reply to post by Krazysh0t


Wrong my man. I am not reading too far into the movie, I am looking at the guy overall and using that info to allow you guys to look at the movie in a new way.

He is a zionist that has made three movies that attack Arabs, Muslims, and Palestinians, Also he tried to create capture an exchange that would hurt a US politician when viewed by the people, a politician that was likely targeted particularly because he doesn't support giving aid to Israel or backing them against Iran. Also he has many Zionist figures on his show, such as Noam Chomsky.

When you look at it as a whole, it becomes clear there is an agenda there. I mean people say I have an agenda from a few posts, Imagine if I spent the money this guy did to point these things out. THATS an agenda.

reply to post by Dr Expired


Borat is SATIRE.

The actor, Sasha Baron Cohen, *is* Jewish.

Have you seen Bruno or Ali G?

FICTIONAL CHARACTERS. F-I-C-T-I-O-N-A-L C-H-A-R-A-C-T-E-R-S!

reply to post by zarlaan


Lots of Jewish actors, writiers, make fun of Jewish people. They do it lightheartedly though. They don't go for the jugular as I stated earlier and dress up as the Nazi propaganda of Jews and stage slap stick baby sacrifices. Get what we are saying. That is the equivalent of doing comedy where the Muslim or Arab character is a terrorist or suicide bomber. It would never fly!

reply to post by VaterOrlaag


The point isn't that he is making fun of Jews, see my above posts. He is clearly racist/prejudiced against Muslims and Arabs.